Pole Barn Heating Options This Winter

chantman · Nov 9, 2015

Hi Everyone,

This is my first post. My family and I live on 5 acres in the country and just built a 24x40x10 pole barn. We are really excited about it. I'm going to move my 4-wheeler, mower, and work bench in soon, once we get electric installed. We gave in to my son wanting a couple of barn cats to keep out mice. I built them a nice little box house that is insulated very well and plenty of bedding.

Anyway, on to my question. I have a family friend that can spray foam closed-cell insulation on to my walls for $1/sq ft. This is a really good deal from what I'm told, and I think we're going to do it right away. Unfortunately this is all the insulating we can afford before the winter. The ceiling is still open with rafters, the ridge vent, and the overhang vents.

Due to the kittens, and wanting to be out there during the winter working on various projects, I would like to have some sort of heating system. I cannot afford a forced air propane unit right now. Here is my thoughts. If I have the walls insulated, I could buy a torpedo kerosene heater, and keep it on a thermostat to keep it just above freezing in the barn (35-40 degrees). Then when we come out to work in the barn, we can turn it up to 50 or so. Would the ridge and overhang vents be enough ventilation for the torpedo heater? If we have an average mid-Ohio winter (teens or 20's during the day), how much kerosene do you think I'll go through in a week?

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give me. Hope to eventually buy my first tractor or skid-steer in a couple years.

-Mike

MMagis · Nov 9, 2015

Personally, I would only heat it when I wanted to work in there. The cats don’t need heat. In fact, assuming they have access to the outside any time they want, you could be inviting pneumonia or other respiratory issues with them going in and out. Probably not, with that large of an area. But they certainly don’t need heat.

chantman · Nov 9, 2015

Thanks for the info. I think you're right. I won't be out there all the time, and if the cats don't need it, then we should be ok. I'll just heat it when I go out there. Think we should go ahead with the wall insulation now?

tbrooks26 · Nov 9, 2015

Without doing something for the ceiling, and having ventilation up there, you might as well try and heat the outdoors. I have a 125000 btu lp ready that I use in my uninsulated 20x30 shop sometimes, but all the heat goes straight up. You can't feel it unless your right in front of it. I do have a 16' ceiling though. Even just putting some plastic up on the bottom of the rafters could make a big difference for you. Personally I would put money into insulating the ceiling before the walls

MMagis · Nov 9, 2015

I’d definitely do the walls for that price. And as Tbrooks26 mentioned, getting a ceiling in there, even if left uninsulated for now, would be a huge help.

George2615 · Nov 9, 2015

If you insulate the barn insulate the walls and ceiling. Salamanders are nice (I have a 125,000 BTU fuel oil unit with built in T-stat) but they require a fresh air supply and recommend a some kind of vent to exhaust carbon monoxide fumes. Mine burns less than a gallon per hour due to the T-stat that cycles it off at the desired temp. I also have a used mobile home 80,000 BTU furnace that runs on fuel oil.
Check with a local furnace repair person in your area for a used MH furnace. They usually have some used ones they've replaced for someone who upgraded to a more energy efficient model that run on fuel oil, propane, or natural gas that they'll sell cheap. I got mine for less than $200.

prichard · Nov 9, 2015

George2615 said:
If you insulate the barn insulate the walls and ceiling. Salamanders are nice (I have a 125,000 BTU fuel oil unit with built in T-stat) but they require a fresh air supply and recommend a some kind of vent to exhaust carbon monoxide fumes. Mine burns less than a gallon per hour due to the T-stat that cycles it off at the desired temp. I also have a used mobile home 80,000 BTU furnace that runs on fuel oil.
Check with a local furnace repair person in your area for a used MH furnace. They usually have some used ones they've replaced for someone who upgraded to a more energy efficient model that run on fuel oil, propane, or natural gas that they'll sell cheap. I got mine for less than $200.

I agree with the others that some sort of ceiling will be of immense help, even plastic as mentioned.

Thanks George for the mobile home heater idea. We'll demo ours when house is built and I may move it's unit to the poor barn.

Edit: ceiling will block your venting need to do something about that.

Also install CO alarm

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KennyG · Nov 9, 2015

Lots of good advice here. Keep in mind that if you insulate the walls, you need to finish them some way. As I understand it, all the spray foams need to be covered for fire rating. Also, if you don't finish the walls, the foam will quickly get damaged.

Are your trusses on 4 foot or 8 foot spacing? Just plastic, overlapped and taped, will make a tremendous difference but I don't think it will work well on 8 foot centers. If you do put the plastic up, it will serve as a vapor barrier when you finish the ceiling with something like liner panel. You can then blow in insulation. In total, budget $1000 to $1500 for the ceiling depending on how you do it to be complete, but the first step of the plastic is really cheap. If you do go with the plastic, think ahead about where you will put an attic access and chimney pipes so you can frame those in first.

Whatever you do, +1 on the CO monitor.

George2615 · Nov 9, 2015

prichard said:
I agree with the others that some sort of ceiling will be of immense help, even plastic as mentioned.

Thanks George for the mobile home heater idea. We'll demo ours when house is built and I may move it's unit to the poor barn.

Edit: ceiling will block your venting need to do something about that.

Also install CO alarm

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using TractorByNet

I like using the MH furnace because the heat come out the bottom at floor level so the garage heats from the bottom up. The furnace sits on a pedestal built out of 2x4's and I have ducts facing 3 directions. Furnace exhaust goes out through the back wall then up above the roof. I have 6" insulation in the ceiling and walls. Both ceiling and walls have 17/32" board covering. I keep my 18x32 pole barn at 45* when not in use (to keep the tractor and 2 watchdogs warm) and set it for 60 when I need to work in there. Only takes a short time to get it up to 60.

bucktaker · Nov 9, 2015

waste of time....in Ohio you will not be able to heat that building without complete insulation walls and ceiling and a big heater and a big fuel bill
I assume you have a dirt or gravel floor? Best you can hope for is heat from a heater while directly in front of it . I live right down the road in Greene county been there

prichard · Nov 9, 2015

Mine is heat pump without any aux heat and doesn't do that great at heating but I need ac more than heat here and may look for an old wood stove for heat. We also have a great ac guy that may have something better for me.

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jack707 · Nov 9, 2015

Until I get the things I need for the out side wood burner - I use a barrel stove.

zzvyb6 · Nov 9, 2015

For working in a cold shed, the things that get to you are cold hands and cold tools. Hands get cold because the tools and nuts and bolts and parts are cold. You can keep your body and feet warm using appropriate clothing in layers and by keeping moving. However, I use a warming anvil to lay tools on it along with parts and fasteners. I picked up a $250k btu torpedo heater at an estate sale for $50 and all it needed were new fuel hoses. I run it outside to warm a metal table made from a grate. Park my tools and stuff on it to get them toasty. If the tractor, etc. needs some attention, I blast it with the hot air, too.

I run off-road diesel in it because it smells and is cheap. With warm tools, your hands will stay warm. I also use an arc welder on occasion to heat up a piece of railroad rail to park tools on to warm it. I'm not bothered by the cold air in the room, just the stuff I have to touch.

In summer, heat is also a problem for me. I can sweat hard just thinking about working in there. A ceiling fan overhead and an industrial floor standing fan are my friends, too. The fans may help you in winter, too, so heat doesn't just go out the roof top if that's the way you want to go.

prevent · Nov 9, 2015

My parents have barn cats (9 to be exact...ps get them spayed...) They had 3 during the "polar vortex" (When it got to -20 F not including windchill) in the unheated part of the barn and all three lived just fine. They ended up living in between the hay during the cold. The other ones are "less" feral and we leave the door cracked open for them to go from unheated part of barn to heated part of barn (waste of money, lol)

MMagis · Nov 10, 2015

bucktaker said:
waste of time....in Ohio you will not be able to heat that building without complete insulation walls and ceiling and a big heater and a big fuel bill
I assume you have a dirt or gravel floor? Best you can hope for is heat from a heater while directly in front of it . I live right down the road in Greene county been there

A lot of people would disagree. He's not talking about keeping it 70 degrees in there. Just heat it up some to make it comfortable. With insulated walls and a ceiling, it'll warm up nicely. It won't stay warm forever, but he's not looking to live out there.

bigtiller · Nov 10, 2015

chantman said:
Hi Everyone,

This is my first post. My family and I live on 5 acres in the country and just built a 24x40x10 pole barn. We are really excited about it. I'm going to move my 4-wheeler, mower, and work bench in soon, once we get electric installed. We gave in to my son wanting a couple of barn cats to keep out mice. I built them a nice little box house that is insulated very well and plenty of bedding.

Anyway, on to my question. I have a family friend that can spray foam closed-cell insulation on to my walls for $1/sq ft. This is a really good deal from what I'm told, and I think we're going to do it right away. Unfortunately this is all the insulating we can afford before the winter. The ceiling is still open with rafters, the ridge vent, and the overhang vents. -Mike

I did the math and this insulation bargain is going to be $38,000. Am I missing something?

TractorGuy · Nov 10, 2015

Made one of these in double drum kit for my shop years ago. Donated it to a hunting club I was in for a while. Works pretty good.

prichard · Nov 10, 2015

bigtiller said:
I did the math and this insulation bargain is going to be $38,000. Am I missing something?

Should be 24+24+40+40 x 10 = 1280 sg ft of walls on my napkin

prichard · Nov 10, 2015

JD855guy said:
Made one of these for my shop years ago. Donated it to a hunting club I was in for a while. Works pretty good.

Single barrel Kit.

US Stove Double Barrel Wood Stove Kit

Did you make a grate for the bottom? Seems to me it would fill with ash fairly quick otherwise. How many hours of burn time do you get? How much wood do you put in?