How much does that log weigh?

   / How much does that log weigh? #101  
The ONLY thing I'm doubting is, "ANY" tractor/loader rated to pick up less than 3,000 pounds, picking up and walking away with 3500 plus pounds!

It's just NOT going to happen!

SR

I know there have been several threads on this very topic. But you have to take the "rating" with a grain of salt, as the "rating" is max height. Loaders are WAY stronger at ground level.

Kubota actually publishes a force/lift height curve that illustrates this very well.

My loader is rated for 390kg (860lbs) to max height at the cutting edge. And 500kg (1100lbs) at the pins to max height.

In reality, at ground level, its rated for about 800kg (1760lbs) at the bucket edge and 1200kg (2650lbs) at the pins. But these are not published specs, and only shown in the manual.

So yes, MY loader "rated" at 860lbs at the cutting edge, can lift double that down low. And thats with no assist from curl, Which at the bucket edge is even stronger.
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #102  
How far off the ground is the tractor in question holding that log??? Ground level??

SR
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #103  
At 18" off the ground, I am still at ~1000kg(2200lbs) at the pins and ~750kg (1650) at the bucket edge.

But its a moot point. Loaders are alot stronger than their "rating" suggests.

And the fact that the log calculator that calculated that log to weigh 4800# is just plain wrong.

His loader is rated at 2761# at the pins to max height, and 3700# breakout force.

Do I believe his loader will lift a 4800# log......probably not. But the fact that the log is probably around 3500#.....that I absolutely believe he can lift.
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #104  
My loader is rated for 3650 full height, it will NOT lift a 3500 log/pallet forks/grapple to full height and I would NOT lift a 3500 pound log and drive around with it... My neighbor has a CIH JX 95 and my loader will pick anything his will, and it's no wimpy loader on his either...

NOW, you expect me to believe that little 35hp tractor will out lift my tractor or my neighbors JX95??

You have been drinking too much CUT koolaide! lol

SR
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #105  
My loader is rated for 3650 full height, it will NOT lift a 3500 log/pallet forks/grapple to full height and I would NOT lift a 3500 pound log and drive around with it... My neighbor has a CIH JX 95 and my loader will pick anything his will, and it's no wimpy loader on his either...

NOW, you expect me to believe that little 35hp tractor will out lift my tractor or my neighbors JX95??

You have been drinking too much CUT koolaide! lol

SR

If your loader is rated for 3650 to full height, I would be seriously disappointed if I couldnt lift 3500# at ground level.

I lifted 1500# I-beams off my 40" high trailer deck with my loader. Would only lift ~1" off the deck, and then I needed to use curl. And this was with CLAMP ON pallet forks.

I have also lifted logs that were in the 2500# range. No I didnt drive around with them, but just enough to get them off the ground for cutting up.

His loader is rated for nearly 3x's what mine is, So yes, I believe it can lift a 3500# log with the attachment he has. I know there is no way to confirm the measurements, but heck, there is a picture of the thing. And its an impressive lift for a small tractor.

Certainly not drinking any koolaide. But look at specs across various MFG's. It seems most of the good 40-50HP tractors have 2500-3000# loaders. Just about double what a 20-30HP tractor is rated for. But jump to your size class, 90-100HP, and the loader numbers certainly dont double again. It seems they kinda fall off. IE: 30HP - 1200# loader, 50HP - 3000# loader , 70hp- (maybe 3500# loader) 90-100HP...maybe a 4000# loader.....120+hp....maybe 4500# loader. Just the way it is.
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #106  
Read my post again, I said 3500 log, "pallet forks and grapple"... Do you think the log is the only weigh up there...

Now we are talking 4K +, it isn't going to happen...

SR
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #107  
If your loader is rated for 3650 to full height, I would be seriously disappointed if I couldnt lift 3500# at ground level. I lifted 1500# I-beams off my 40" high trailer deck with my loader. Would only lift ~1" off the deck, and then I needed to use curl. And this was with CLAMP ON pallet forks. I have also lifted logs that were in the 2500# range. No I didnt drive around with them, but just enough to get them off the ground for cutting up. His loader is rated for nearly 3x's what mine is, So yes, I believe it can lift a 3500# log with the attachment he has. I know there is no way to confirm the measurements, but heck, there is a picture of the thing. And its an impressive lift for a small tractor. Certainly not drinking any koolaide. But look at specs across various MFG's. It seems most of the good 40-50HP tractors have 2500-3000# loaders. Just about double what a 20-30HP tractor is rated for. But jump to your size class, 90-100HP, and the loader numbers certainly dont double again. It seems they kinda fall off. IE: 30HP - 1200# loader, 50HP - 3000# loader , 70hp- (maybe 3500# loader) 90-100HP...maybe a 4000# loader.....120+hp....maybe 4500# loader. Just the way it is.
Tractors are not made for lifting. A 90 hp tractor doesn't have the front axel to lift 6000 pounds. If you want to lift heavy loads get forklift, tehelandler, or wheel loader. Also the loader in discussion is rated to lift 2600 pounds NOT 3,600 pounds. Tractors put the loader on the wrong end for serious lifting.
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #108  
Read my post again, I said 3500 log, "pallet forks and grapple"... Do you think the log is the only weigh up there...

Now we are talking 4K +, it isn't going to happen...

SR

With a loader, the lift capacities are rated with the standard weight bucket.

Sure, if your attachment is heavier or shifts the load further forward, that diminishes the capacity. But just because you dont "think" your loader will lift a 3500# log, doesnt mean another tractor configured differently cannot.

The fact that your loader is rated for 3650# at max height, means it can probably lift 5000+ down low. Again, I would be disappointed if I had a 95hp tractor and couldnt lift a 3500# log on forks or in a grapple.
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #109  
Tractors are not made for lifting. A 90 hp tractor doesn't have the front axel to lift 6000 pounds. If you want to lift heavy loads get forklift, tehelandler, or wheel loader. Also the loader in discussion is rated to lift 2600 pounds NOT 3,600 pounds.

The loader in question is rated @ 2761# TO MAX HEIGHT. That is what is missing here.

the Breakout rating is what is listed at 3700#, which is a much closer indication as to what it can actually lift near the ground.

How many threads have we seen over the years on here where a loader is rated for xxxx lbs and we see pictures and claims of lifting 1.5x's to 2x's what its rated for. The key is the lift height. The angle the cylinders are on is such that the lifting force diminishes the higher it is lifted. So the rating to the max high is the LOWEST rating for the loader.

Look at deere, they list a lift spec to max height, and a lift spec to a height of 59". the spec to the height of 59" is always significantly more. Its just that other MFG's dont list that spec to a lesser height. But that dont mean the loader isnt rated to do it
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #110  
I'd love to stay and spar with you, but I'm off to go trade my tractor off for a 35hp compact so I can lift 3500 logs!! No sense in burning all the extra fuel I burn to get the SAME job done!! NOW I get it, i've been buying too big of tractors, all these years! lol

oooohhh, I better stop and buy some CUT Kool-aid too, or I'm thinking it won't happen...
orig.gif


SR
 
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   / How much does that log weigh? #111  
Tractors are not made for lifting. A 90 hp tractor doesn't have the front axel to lift 6000 pounds. If you want to lift heavy loads get forklift, tehelandler, or wheel loader. Also the loader in discussion is rated to lift 2600 pounds NOT 3,600 pounds.

The tractors that have impressive lift capabilities imo are TLBs like Case 580s many can lift Over 7000lbs. to full height

here's one of the heaviest logs my grappled tractor has moved- Not as heavy as gladehounds but i am happy since it had to be grappled out of the trailer and my tractor was able to pick it up and move it around , but someday i would really like to get a 580 for the lifting capacity and the backhoe would be great to:licking:

the reality of wood getting and other jobs is, many of us
Use What We Have
to get the job done.
I also agree that FELS can lift a lot more at ground level than their rated lift# to full height- and that is very handy for some jobs
 

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   / How much does that log weigh? #112  
You guys are acting like the lift spec to max height is gospel and that in no way can the loader lift more than that. Which is just incorrect thinking.

IMO, the capacity at the pins is almost a useless measurement, other than comparing, because who actually lifts anything from that point? Most of my lifts are done at the bucket edge (because I have teeth, and they are convenient chain/strap points), or beyond on the clamp on pallet forks.

With my lift spec on "MY" loader being only 860# to max height at the cutting edge, here are just some of the things I shouldn't have been able to do:

Move 500 gallon propane tank with a bit of propane still left in it.....~1450# strapped to the teeth
Unload trailer with 2 25' sections of w18x60 beam with the clamp on pallet forks.....~1500# on the forks
unload 6' bushhog off trailer.......~1100# strapped to teeth
Load pallet of 14 bags (75# each) mortar into bed of truck........~1100# on pallet forks. Load center ~20" forward of cutting edge
Move boiler in progress firebox on pallet with pallet forks..........~900# load centered ~25" forward
Set my (2) 1000# weight barrels into the bed of my truck for plowing.......1000# on bucket teeth


Has nothing to do with CUT koolaide. If the need arises, I get the backhoe. I have yet to find anything it wont lift

E41A0641.JPG

And we also seem to forget that the LOG WEIGHTS ARE ESTIMATED. He never claimed to guess what the log weighed. That was all you guys. And the log calculators ARE WRONG. Look at the picture....it was an impressive lift. Thats all we need to take away from that. And if his DS4510 lifted it.....your jx95 would have lifted it AND SOME. What he is calling a 40" x 9' log, could easily be a 39" log (on the big end) and with a little taper to 36" on the small end, and maybe only 8.5' long. (we all round and/or exaggerate). In which case, that log would only contain ~65 cu ft of wood instead of 78.5. And if it was nice and dry at around 40-45 PCF....that log may only weigh 2600#. But even worst case scenerio of 40" on both ends and full 9' that is green at 50 PCF, puts a max weight of 3925#
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #113  
Awesome boulder in that Ford bucket! Estimate that!
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #114  
6000-7000lbs
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #115  
OH yeah- when push comes to shove with FELs... the TLBs are KING

Awesome boulder moving shot:thumbsup:
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #116  
Wow! sorry guys, didn't mean to start such a debate! I also didn't realize people would be so critical on measurements. So let me give you all the information I have so you don't have to guess.

9 feet long was an eyeball estimate... I didn't put a tape on it. It was certainly over 8 feet. But maybe my estimate wasn't perfect.

40" diameter was again an estimate. My 37" bar on my chainsaw could not cut all the way through the thick end (facing the camera). My 37" bar did barely cut through the thin end. So maybe the log is 38" at the fat end and 36" at the thin end. It is close to 4 foot at the bulge in the center. And it is not round, more of an oval - so figure out square footage on that!

The wood was perfect. No rot. But it was also very dry standing wood. Barely alive. So dry that I could throw it right in my fire and no visible steam, bubbles or any sign of water would come out. It was seasoned before it was cut. I know some on here don't believe that is possible. Believe me, with ash it is. This is not the first Ash I've cut that was this dry.

I could not pick it up without the rear blade on. I tried and lifted the rear (with filled rears and a 200 pound cage, so an extra 1200 over the rear axel and it still picked up the rear).

My hydraulic pressure may be a tad on the high side of spec. I've never checked it but I asked the shop that installed the loader to check hydraulic pressure and make sure it is as high as is allowable. They said they'd take care of me "wink, wink".

The stump bucket that I used actually allows me to get big logs closer to the pins than my forks. The back of that log is behind my pins and I curled fully using the curved bottom of the bucket on the ground as a fulcrum before I lifted with the lift cylinders. So the weight was far back.

That's about as much as I can tell you. I doubt it was much over 3,000 pounds if that and that is well below my rated lift at ground level - however, the center of mass was a bit farther out than the pins. I could have lifted it higher but for safety kept it as close to the ground as possible.

I can tell you that I have lifted heavier. I had to cheat to get the rock in the picture off the ground. This was roughly 5' x 3' x 22" and irregular (as you can see in the picture). With both the log and the rock, I did not need to go far, and no hills to speak of.

Max lift.jpg

Some additional pictures of the same log that I showed before so you can see how solid the wood is on the other end and get a feel for length.

Big log 2.jpgBig log 3.jpg
 
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   / How much does that log weigh? #117  
I'd love to stay and spar with you, but I'm off to go trade my tractor off for a 35hp compact so I can lift 3500 logs!! No sense in burning all the extra fuel I burn to get the SAME job done!! NOW I get it, i've been buying too big of tractors, all these years! lol

oooohhh, I better stop and buy some CUT Kool-aid too, or I'm thinking it won't happen...
orig.gif


SR

Nobody here is drinking CUT Kool-aid! Believe me, I'd rather have a UT. And what I really would like to have is a New Holland Bi-directional. The stronger of the two loaders on that machine is rated around 12,000 pounds breakout force! But I don't have a UT or a NH Bi-directional so I use what I got.

You are right about one thing... you will need some CUT kool-aid if you want your new 35hp compact to lift 3500 pound logs! :confused3: What you're really looking for to get the job done is a 45hp compact! :laughing:
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #118  
"But I don't have a UT or a NH Bi-directional so I use what I got."
Amen, and I'll drink to that........
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #119  
Thanks for the website...it will come in handy. Regarding the "wood burning (seasoned or unseasoned) most wood here in east Texas gets burnable after 29 days. Anything with less than a 20% moisture content is very burnable. For $25 you can buy a moisture meter which I use all the time at Amazon: http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B008V6I840?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o07_s00 I use mine all the time selecting what I want from my woodpile to move to my ready to burn rack on the front porch.
 
   / How much does that log weigh? #120  
As a former logger for 3 decades, everything LD is stating is exactly correct. We learned to estimate log weight for trucking by the stem pile size as our trucks were subject to weight legality testing at any point. A mixture of dry stems and wet even if size equivalent, vastly altered trailer weight as opposed to a load of freshly cut stems. Throw in the differentials of wood species and even when it was cut and any guess is just that. Add to this the differentials of what tractor manufacturers state what their lift capabilities are and you have a worse reference than KoolAide.... more like Alice in Wonderland. There is no set boundary with as many variables existing in wood and machinery.
 

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