a tractor can break in half?

[sandman2234]

Soundguy,
You were almost right with my circumstance. I was operating a green tractor with a boxblade, no front weights, moving a pile of dirt that had been dug for a drainage ditch about 20 years previous. I started down the slope of the hill and the next thing I know, I am looking at the dirt, up close and personal. The tractor broke at the front of the bell housing. Best I can find, that tractor never had a loader or backhoe on it. We never even thought it might have had one. I suspected the previous owner had put a clutch in it and neglected to torque the bolts between the bell housing and engine. When they loosened up, they allowed a little bit too much play and the movement caused the bolts to break out of the engine casting.
A little longer bolts, some cast iron rods, and a lot of time put that tractor back in action and my wife's uncle still owns it.
The tractor is a Duetz 30-06
David from jax

 

[john_bud]

I used to work with a guy that snapped a JD 4020 in two pieces. He used it to haul round bales out of the field. One on the back and one on the front. After years of that stress, it broke clean in two. Right in the middle of the field and right at the start of hay time. He had to scramble to fix it in a hay field with no access to power.

 

[Soundguy]

Anything on the 3pt could stress it.. a mower for instance.. If you have a heavy load.. and hit a bump. that's a huge shock load.. etc..

Soundguy

I would venture to say those who put weight boxes on the 3PH to counter balance a loader can stress the "frame" of a tractor driving too fast over bumpy ground.Randy

 

[Charolais]

Can't say I've seen one break with a 3 pt. backhoe but have seen 3 break with a FEL. One was a new JD in the 80-90 hp range. Guy just up the road was pushing up trees and broke in half. One IH 674 and a 2610 Long. All three of those someone had turned the relief valve up for more pressure and all three didn't have support braces from the bell housing back to the rear axle.

I've owned two loaders on two different tractors. One was a 574 IH and a Farmtrac 80 (675). Both loaders were made by Long which is Farmtrac now. I don't know about Farmtrac's smaller tractors but the larger ones have some major supports from the mid point of the bell housing area back to the rear axle. I haven't put a tape on it but it's somewhere in the area of 5/8's to 3/4" thick and 6-7 in. wide. It's got to help with steel that thick. And never never turn the relief valve pressure up. Loader pressure is set up at a break point. If it won't lift what you want buy a bigger loader and tractor to go with it. If you know you're going to get into some real hard work with a tractor look hard at a loader with the brace that goes from front to rear. If you break that you need a bull dozer anyway.

 

[sandman2234]

Or maybe consider renting a larger tractor for the current project that could be too much for your current tractor.
I for one would be really hard pressed to actually park my tractor and go rent one that is bigger. My "I think I can, I think I can" attitude would have me out there picking up the two pieces of the tractor to get them to the shop to start a repair on them. I understand my attitude and have suffered my whole life with it, so having to fix my own mistakes is part of life. Doesn't mean I am going to give someone else that advice, as it often has been a challenge to say the least.
David from jax

 

[Farmwithjunk]

I know of one particular model that had a reputation for breaking in half. The Deere 2840. When Deere first released the 40 series Dubuque models in 1977, there was the 2040, 2240, 2440, and 2640. They were 40, 50, 60. and 70 hp respectively, all 4-cylinder models. A 6-cylinder, 80HP model was added shortly after the introduction of the first 4. It used essentially the same chassis with a longer motor. The engine/transmission area was adaquate for the length of the 4-cylinder models. It WASN'T strong enough for the longer engine and increased hp. I know of several that broke the bellhousing under what would be considered normal use. They just snapped in half. The 2840 didn't stay in production long. It was changed to the 2940 with a re-designed middle in short order.

(The Dubuque 2X40 series production was shifted to Mannhiem (sp) Germany for the 1980 model year)

 

[D7E]

I know of one particular model that had a reputation for breaking in half. The Deere 2840. When Deere first released the 40 series Dubuque models in 1977, there was the 2040, 2240, 2440, and 2640. They were 40, 50, 60. and 70 hp respectively, all 4-cylinder models. A 6-cylinder, 80HP model was added shortly after the introduction of the first 4. It used essentially the same chassis with a longer motor. The engine/transmission area was adaquate for the length of the 4-cylinder models. It WASN'T strong enough for the longer engine and increased hp. I know of several that broke the bellhousing under what would be considered normal use. They just snapped in half. The 2840 didn't stay in production long. It was changed to the 2940 with a re-designed middle in short order.

(The Dubuque 2X40 series production was shifted to Mannhiem (sp) Germany for the 1980 model year)

AAAh so my seeing deeres broke in half is quite common , The ones i've seen were european models like , 2140 , 2850, 3140 ,3350 and 3650 .
Vever seen a broken blue one though ?

 

[bjr]

D7E

If by "blue" you mean New Holland, there is in the local nickel ads a New Holland 33 hp 2003 tractor with FEL for $4000 with broken transmission housing. I've stayed away from the FEL/bachoe machines just for this reason. I've needed to move a large amount of dirt I have rent a specific machine of hire a contractor and yes it's expensive. I'm limited in my capabilities, but I couldn't afford to repair a major breakdown and would have scrap the tractor if that occurred. bjr

 

[Soundguy]

I've seen reports of a broken 2120 I'm pretty sure. not sure if it had a backhoe.. but there was a reported issue of loose tranny mount bolts.

soundguy

ever seen a broken blue one though ?

 

[Taiser]

I heard lots of negatives when I got my 4672 (3pt)hoe for my B7800. Nobody has shown me a kubota with an approved hoe on it breaking....EVER. Heard stories, all stuff other people have heard, but no actual first hand accounts and pictures to go with it. Dealer (Deere and Kubota) told me he has never had or seen a problem with them. If these things snapped like candy canes all the time, you can bet Kubota would not be making them available wit a full waranty.

Different makers (Woods) then yeah maybe they would be over powered (if put on a smaller tractor) and break something, but I have not seen any proof of those either. I've been lurking here for years and I have only ever seen one picture of a 3pt hitch failure where the cast on the tranny snapped off, only one! Are there more? Maybe but they obviously don't get posted often. You can bet if my 3pt ever snapped off I'd be raising he** and posting TONS of pictures.

Can it break...sure. Would I prefer a subframe? Yeah I'd take one but so far mine has been fine and done everything I ask. Anything will break with abuse but look at the size of this top link!!! If this ever snaps, it would probably take me with it!!!

 

[sandman2234]

I would think that the size of the top link would only be to transfer that much more load to the tractor, theorectically giving it that much more chance to break in the middle.I wonder if a top link with a large, very large spring, calibrated to compress at an approximate load that is considered harmful to the tractor. Everyone would probably be trying to beef it up so it didn't compress and you could do that much more with the tractor.
David from jax

 

[Taiser]

The top link on mine is bolted to a thick steel bracket over the tranny that looks like it is attached to the back end frame of the tractor. For it to snap anything on the tranny it would have to snap that frame. I don't think it has the power to do it and would probably flip the tractor over first. That's a lot of steel that would have to let go.

 

[sandman2234]

Taiser,
I don't think you understand my point. From what I can determine, and I AM NOT AN EXPERT, what breaks a tractor in the middle has nothing to do with how well it is mounted to the rear of a tractor. It has to do with how well it is mounted to the front of a tractor. The bouncing and loading/unloading of the weight on the front end, causing torsional failures to the bellhousing when you are constantly loading and unloading the weight on the backhoe. Same thing goes for a FEL. When you pick up something, it puts a downward pressure on that end of the tractor, and when you let it down it unloads it, causing the stress to go exactly the other way. Constantly doing that fatigues the middle and that is where it breaks. The stronger a tractor is in the middle and the shorter it is between the wheelbase is what makes it stronger. Not saying longer isn't better, it just takes more metal in between to keep it from snapping.
A sub frame transfers this load further forward, thereby reducing the stress created by loading the very back (or front) of a tractor. Even though a loader is hooked to the middle of a tractor, the weight is still out front, and thereby causes the stress from up front,instead of the middle.
Hopefully I have explained myself to where you can understand me.
David from jax

 

[john_bud]

Actually, back around 2000 or 2001 there were a couple Kubota (gasp!) tractors that had the top mount for the 3pt pull out of the housing. That is, they cracked around the bolt holes and pulled out a 4x6" chunk of the rear end. After that there were a few threads about buying a 3pt top mount that wraps around and bolts to the top of the differential housing in addition to the rear. If memory serves there were pictures of the carnage and yes a 3pt BH was mounted putting the stress on the tractor leading to the failures. I ordered one of the stouter housings and installed it.

Also, even full size full framed TLB's crack housings. The owners manuals usually have a 600 hour or annual check for cracks and repair/replace as needed. So, don't think it can't happen to you - even with a subframe. Everytime you change fluids, do a 100% close up visual inspect of the mounts, bolts and housings. It's easier to fix a small crack or tighten a bolt than buy a new casting.

 

[D7E]

There's no rule , Tractors are built with attachments in mind ,With a frame/without a frame , They can take abuse , But you get the odd one that wont , Metal fatiuge , Poor steel , ( russian) ,High hours "Whatever sometimes it happens and it happens to $200,000 machines too nothing's perfect.

 

[Grrrr]

There's no rule , Tractors are built with attachments in mind ,With a frame/without a frame , They can take abuse , But you get the odd one that wont , Metal fatiuge , Poor steel , ( russian) ,High hours "Whatever sometimes it happens and it happens to $200,000 machines too nothing's perfect.

There have been a couple of pictures of tractors in a magazine I get of tractors snapping in half, and these were propper ag tractors.

One was a Doe Dual Drive tractor. For anyone who doesn't know what this is it was a tractor made by ford in the 60's (I think) which consisted of two tractors joined together. Neither of the tractors had front wheels and there was an articulation point in between the two tractors.

The tractor that broke in half was being used on very heavy clay pulling a 5 furrow plough. The back wheels had dug down really deep in the clay and had got rather stuck. However, the front wheels still had grip and literally pulled the front tractor off the back tractor.

Looked a bit like this one.

The second tractor snapping was a Roadless tractor like the one posted earlier with two ploughs mounted on it. It had been working on a big farm about 30 years ago and been ploughing. The owner thought it could work a bit faster so told the driver to up the rev's. This the driver did for a while until he completely sheared the rear wheel of the axle.

Just proves that tractors can break and are not indestructable.

 

[D7E]

There have been a couple of pictures of tractors in a magazine I get of tractors snapping in half, and these were propper ag tractors.

One was a Doe Dual Drive tractor. For anyone who doesn't know what this is it was a tractor made by ford in the 60's (I think) which consisted of two tractors joined together. Neither of the tractors had front wheels and there was an articulation point in between the two tractors.

The tractor that broke in half was being used on very heavy clay pulling a 5 furrow plough. The back wheels had dug down really deep in the clay and had got rather stuck. However, the front wheels still had grip and literally pulled the front tractor off the back tractor.

Looked a bit like this one.

The second tractor snapping was a Roadless tractor like the one posted earlier with two ploughs mounted on it. It had been working on a big farm about 30 years ago and been ploughing. The owner thought it could work a bit faster so told the driver to up the rev's. This the driver did for a while until he completely sheared the rear wheel of the axle.

Just proves that tractors can break and are not indestructable.

Hey GRRR

Being an ex brit and a ford/fordson/county/muirhill enthusiast im only too familiar with these , We once had a Doe triple D when they were new but i was mereley proving a point that some break some don't regardless of brand or work load .

 

[dfkrug]

Actually, back around 2000 or 2001 there were a couple Kubota (gasp!) tractors that had the top mount for the 3pt pull out of the housing. That is, they cracked around the bolt holes and pulled out a 4x6" chunk of the rear end. After that there were a few threads about buying a 3pt top mount that wraps around and bolts to the top of the differential housing in addition to the rear. If memory serves there were pictures of the carnage and yes a 3pt BH was mounted putting the stress on the tractor leading to the failures. I ordered one of the stouter housings and installed it.

I remember that, jb. I wish I had kept the pix.

One of the two broken toplink casting photos I saw posted was particularly
memorable to me as it was on a Kubota L2550, the same model tractor
I was using back in 98-2000. I was just a TBN lurker back than.

 

[tawilson]

I saw a 75hp New Holland break in half. It got plowed into by a pickup truck. Drove the tractor ahead and off the road about 75'. Truck didn't look so good either. Nobody got hurt but I think some underwear needed changing. Especially by the guy that fell asleep driving the truck. I have some pics somewhere that I'll try to find.

 

[irwin]

I remember that, jb. I wish I had kept the pix.

One of the two broken toplink casting photos I saw posted was particularly
memorable to me as it was on a Kubota L2550, the same model tractor
I was using back in 98-2000. I was just a TBN lurker back than.

I remebered this one, found it after a short search..
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...43-backhoe-3pth-v-subframe-mount-p1010003.jpg

This picture had me thinking about my own 3pt backhoe, it now has a subframe. (though this wasn't connected to 3pt hoe, still .... made me think)