weld grinding tips needed

[daugen]

inexpensive:
Northern Industrial ST80i Inverter-Based Stick Welder with TIG Option — 115 Volt, 20 - 90 Amp | Arc Welders| Northern Tool + Equipment
moderate:
FREE SHIPPING — Hobart Stickmate 205AC 230V Arc Welder/Stick Welder — 205 Amp Output, Model# 500502 | Arc Welders| Northern Tool + Equipment
tried and true:
Lincoln Electric AC/DC 225/125 230V Stick Welder — 225 Amp AC, 125 Amp DC Output, Model# K1297 | Arc Welders| Northern Tool + Equipment
more expensive and powerful:
FREE SHIPPING — Hobart Stickmate Stickmate LX 300 AC/200 DC 230V Arc Welder/Stick Welder — 205 Amp Output, Model# 500560 | Arc Welders| Northern Tool + Equipment

I'm just using Northern Tools for examples here, as each welder increases in price and power.
What do I need to weld mower decks like this,perhaps with a little in reserve? I'm confused over how
many amps I need. In fact I don't have the foggiest idea how many amps I need.
Light hobby use, but want something better than Harbor Freight.

 

[k0ua]

I have an AC Only tombstone Lincoln, and the DC only Inverter Everlast. I haven't bothered with the Lincoln since I got the DC machine. More noise, more spatter, and a more limited rod selection is what the AC machine offers.. Oh Ok, it will well at higher currents than my little PA160 but I have never had any need to go over 140 amps. The AC machine would run a Carbon Arc Torch for heating, I don't have one, but I have considered it, Then I have read about guys that have built them, complain about all the light and noise, and the possibility of some nasty particles and gasses... Including maybe even Buckminster fullerenes being emitted by the recombination of carbon atoms into more complex forms... So I have never built one. I guess the main reason I have kept the old AC machine is because no-one wants to buy it.

James K0UA

 

[Shield Arc]

In my opinion, and take it for what it's worth because I'm only a hobbyist! The only reason anyone would buy an AC only machine is because they're cheaper, or they are combating arc blow. OK, how many home owners fight arc blow? How many home owners even know what arc blow is?
For the life of me I can't see where the average home owner needs a machine that will go over 150-amps. 1/8-inch 7018 is about as big a rod as the average guy will run, 150-amps is plenty for that rod.
Personally I would not have a 120-volt only machine!
If I were you, I'd PM Mark and see what kind of deal he can make you on a PowerArc 200


http://www.everlastgenerators.com/PowerARC-200---391-pd.html

 

[daugen]

In my opinion, and take it for what it's worth because I'm only a hobbyist! The only reason anyone would buy an AC only machine is because they're cheaper, or they are combating arc blow. OK, how many home owners fight arc blow? How many home owners even know what arc blow is?
For the life of me I can't see where the average home owner needs a machine that will go over 150-amps. 1/8-inch 7018 is about as big a rod as the average guy will run, 150-amps is plenty for that rod.
Personally I would not have a 120-volt only machine!
If I were you, I'd PM Mark and see what kind of deal he can make you on a PowerArc 160, or the PowerArc 200


PowerARC 200 - Welders For Sale, Plasma Cutters, Plasma Cutting Machines, Accessories, Welder Repair

Ok, I checked it out. And you think it's worth two hundred bucks more to get the 160 with TIG option vs. the 140 plain stick?
If I'm welding plate steel, what does TIG do for me?

thanks Drew

 

[k0ua]

Ok, I checked it out. And you think it's worth two hundred bucks more to get the 160 with TIG option vs. the 140 plain stick?
If I'm welding plate steel, what does TIG do for me?

thanks Drew

If you are welding plate steel, the TIG option doesn't do anything for you in this size machine. BUT if you want to weld sheet metal, then the TIG option with the HF start and the pedal control option can do a lot for you. Also if you want to weld copper or brass. It wont weld aluminum. I would love to have the PA160sth. with pedal. I have the PA160, but no pedal and no HF start. But an excellent stick machine. But anything below about 12 or 14 gauge steel, it is time to break out the TIG torch for it. But would I like to have HF start instead of scratch start? you bet, Would I love to have a pedal to taper off with? You bet..

James K0UA

 

[Shield Arc]

I'll have to go look and see what that Tip option is!:confused3:
Tig is really nice for thin material. Little steep on the learning curve though.
I know these pictures are blurry, I took them with an old camera that I eventually through against the wall, and had the wife pickup a better one.
These are some Tig welds I made with my PowerArc 200.

 

[Shield Arc]

Thanks James, saved me a trip to go read about the Tig option.:thumbsup:
Oh, if it comes with high frequency start, and a foot pedal, by all means it is worth the extra $200.00! Foot pedal alone is worth that. Scratch start Tig is a lot harder to learn, than learning Tig with a foot pedal.

 

[k0ua]

Daugen I have repaired many lighweight household things with TIG. Here is a simple little project you might want to look at as an example. Sure it was a stupid project but will give you an idea of what TIG can do.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/welding/239186-am-i-stupid-crafty.html

James K0UA

 

[CNC Dan]

I know these pictures are blurry, I took them with an old camera that I eventually through against the wall, and had the wife pickup a better one.

Felt good didn't it.

 

[Soundguy]

hit it with a lil angle grinder to expose any holes that need to be filled. refill then..

I was going to do that, give it a rough grind to see if anything flakes off, falls out, whatever, then
when you say "refill" you mean reweld, correct?
I could make it all look perfect with Bondo or even plastic spackling, if it were a show queen, but I want to
use the mower, if only a little.
.

yes.. for sure weld. no bondo's .. etc.

 

[chopped]

Just learned this...
What is arc blow and how do you prevent it?

 

[daugen]

My ongoing question to this discussion is am I ever going to weld very light gauge steel, "sheet metal", or aluminum. Unlikely.
But I say that now. I'm guessing that when I get a machine, I'll find more uses for it.
Frankly I've been a little hesitant to get one because I didn't want to do crappy work on my own equipment; I really do know my own limitations,
and I like good work.

My 64th birthday is coming up in March so I'm going to go back to studying machines, and yes, I'll check our "local" products.
Hopefully I'm not getting too old to learn...

One of the challenges in learning by observation here is that it's almost impossible to see what's going on when someone is welding. Too bright.
So it looks like one has to practice on little pieces and simply learn how feed rate, pressure, amps, whatever, affects the final job.
Kinda like turn it off and see what you've done. Before I do that on my mower deck, I need some confidence in my welding.

But first, and thank you Jim for the nudge, I have to get a welder and just do it.
Nice to have you guys here for a sanity check. Thanks again.

 

[daugen]

I watched the video, like many others, still hard to see. The bright white area is the "puddle" of molten metal, and going slightly side to side sets the weld width.

Ok, say I'm welding something half an inch thick. How far "down" should the weld go, about half way? What about the other side?
obviously newbie questions, thanks.

 

[Shield Arc]

I like the double V method, but sometimes you can't get to both sides, so you have to use the single V method. Degree of bevel is sometimes called out by the engineer, or you can go with combined 45-degree, or less. Root gap and root face, (land) in most cases is weldor's choice.

Here is a good chart on different types of joints.

Types of welding joints - Google Search

 

[daugen]

I like the double V method, but sometimes you can't get to both sides, so you have to use the single V method. Degree of bevel is sometimes called out by the engineer, or you can go with combined 45-degree, or less. Root gap and root face, (land) in most cases is weldor's choice.

Here is a good chart on different types of joints.

Types of welding joints - Google Search

huge chart and somewhat overwhelming, but looking for the basics, the root is the very bottom of the weld, bottom of puddle, right?
and now I understand "penetration".

Ok, hmmm, the old saying, "need to get to the root of this"....,
were they referring to a carrot or a weld?

 

[SHORT KID]

daugen I know how frustrating this can be for someone so interested. Years ago I took some welding classes and did a lot of welding on the farm, when i would weld something and hit it a good blow with a hammer if it didn't break it was put to use. Then I got away from welding for about 30 years and had to start all over again. I bought a 110v mig machine and hoped for broken stuff to practice on. Got frustrated many times and wore out several 4 1/2" grinders, but I still kept trying! I had several lawn mower pans that I rebuilt ( welded cracks replaced wheels and repainted), learning something with each job. I had one that I got used and rebuilt several times and probably could have bought a new one for what I had invested in it. Even with all the practice sometimes I still use the grinder and then add more weld or fix up a spot that doesn't suit me. If I were you, I would get a Lincoln or similar 110v mig and of course a grinder and PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE. Also remember before starting to weld CLEAN the metal good, after a while you will get good and even enjoy hiding behind that welding hood. Lots of luck

 

[IslandTractor]

Daugen, besides watching welding videos (welding tips and tricks dot com is pretty good but not set up as a course, Miller has some very good videos too) I would highly recommend a textbook such as Welding Principles and Applications by Larry Jeffus. This is a text often used in high school/tech school classes and does a really excellent job of explaining both theory and practical stuff. While it is intended to be used by an instructor, it is organized in such a way that you can be your own instructor and do the practice welding activities at each step (then post photos for someone like ShieldArc to critique). If you check out Amazon for used editions it can be had for less than $40 but new is over $140. Again, this is a real text not just some Welding for Dummies pamphlet. Welding: Principles and Applications 6th Ed. (Textbook & Study Guide/Lab Manual): Larry Jeffus: 9781428303751: Amazon.com: Books

 

[daugen]

thanks Short Kid. It took years of experimentation and lots of practice to get my refinishing skills improved. So when I'm all done with it, it will look good, and the paint will stick...
Just have to get there and gain the experience. But now that I'm retired, and since learning to weld is on my bucket list, this is going to happen.

I know this sounds a little strange but I usually don't break my equipment. It's stuff I buy, like this mower, that I need to fix.
Plus, I like older, simpler machinery and think we should preserve it, the EPA willing. And I'm just starting to collect older interesting machinery, held back by lack of storage.
Now I have it...:licking:

Personally I have a very strong protective nature. Somehow that translates to enjoying restoring old machinery and making them useful again. I just find it very satisfying, and
am doing a bit of general recycling while I'm at it. I look at machinery abandoned in a field, and I just want to go "rescue" it.
Or more normally, for those of us who enjoy walking the boneyards of older tractor and mower shops, and checking out the veritable treasure trove of old machinery back there,
well those boneyard walks are one of the favorite things I do with one other Gravely nut and there's always something new at one of the three dealers we "inspect" regularly. Great fun.
No, I don't normally buy anything, but the "what is that thing?" is just fun.

All of this rambling to confirm that I think welding will be a satisfying adventure. And once I have the welder, I won't be afraid to buy stuff with a heart of gold and a body of cracks...
All good. Drew

 

[k0ua]

If you want to restore old machinery you will definitely enjoy welding.. I would still stick with a 220 volt Stick machine, not a 110v mig.. The price is better and the 110 volt mig is not really suitable for heavy duty welding like you are wanting to do.. I would lean more to that Everlast PA200 or the Longivity Stickweld 250. Something with some current capacity. Ask ShieldArc again, and don't let him fool you about the "just starting out hobbyist crap" He has forgotten more about welding than most of us know.

James K0UA

 

[daugen]

Ed,
been a long time since I've been in college...but I bought the book, 35 bucks and cheap shipping, like new.
and there will be a quiz...
many thanks
Drew