Flail Mower Let's talk flail mowers

[CADplans]

Winter Storage!! :cool2:

So, how do you store your flail when left out for the winter?

Previous years I have tried a blue tarp, that rots away,,
I am thinking about building a 5 foot wide, 10 foot long, 42 inch tall metal "shed",,
using the loader, I can drop that over it,,,
I do set the PTO coupler on an inverted pail,,, that keeps mud from splashing in when it rains.
Hmmm,,,

Any other great ideas?

 

[Dan in MN]

I haven't had a chance to take any pictures of areas mowed or anything yet, but figured I'd at least post initial impressions of my Value Leader EFG-175. It was pretty heavily protected in a welded angle iron frame that had to be cut apart. Everything seems to be heavily built, the only thing I don't care for is that one of the grease zircs is under the belt cover. It's only one bolt to remove, but that requires getting tools out and I have a feeling if removed over and over that one bolt will eventually be a problem. I'll be drilling a hole in the cover across from the zirc. I've mowed about 3 hours with it so far, I'm generally satisfied but not thrilled at this point. It leaves a bit more standing than I would like, especially some sort of tall weed flower with a thin stalk, just leaves a lot of stalks standing even after hitting some of it twice. It's certainly possible that some adjustments will help, time will tell. We've had several rainy days in a row now so I haven't been able to get out, today I tried mowing with wet grass and ended up having to cut about 30 lbs of wet grass out of the roller....won't be trying that again... :laughing: I'll have to get some pics of it on the tractor and some mowing shots of course, but for now here's what I have..



Since I've had almost no experience running 3 pt implements I need some advice. I have it hooked up right now without stabilizer bars on the lower arms, thinking allowing some movement would be best. Of course if I'm on any side slope and lift it the mower flops sideways a bit. I have stabilizer arms that I can add that triangulate the lower 3 pt arms and will take pretty much all the sway out of it, but for this type of implement what is recommended?

Dan

 

[Fallon]

I haven't had a chance to take any pictures of areas mowed or anything yet, but figured I'd at least post initial impressions of my Value Leader EFG-175. It was pretty heavily protected in a welded angle iron frame that had to be cut apart. Everything seems to be heavily built, the only thing I don't care for is that one of the grease zircs is under the belt cover. It's only one bolt to remove, but that requires getting tools out and I have a feeling if removed over and over that one bolt will eventually be a problem. I'll be drilling a hole in the cover across from the zirc. I've mowed about 3 hours with it so far, I'm generally satisfied but not thrilled at this point. It leaves a bit more standing than I would like, especially some sort of tall weed flower with a thin stalk, just leaves a lot of stalks standing even after hitting some of it twice. It's certainly possible that some adjustments will help, time will tell. We've had several rainy days in a row now so I haven't been able to get out, today I tried mowing with wet grass and ended up having to cut about 30 lbs of wet grass out of the roller....won't be trying that again... :laughing: I'll have to get some pics of it on the tractor and some mowing shots of course, but for now here's what I have..

View attachment 480027View attachment 480028

Since I've had almost no experience running 3 pt implements I need some advice. I have it hooked up right now without stabilizer bars on the lower arms, thinking allowing some movement would be best. Of course if I'm on any side slope and lift it the mower flops sideways a bit. I have stabilizer arms that I can add that triangulate the lower 3 pt arms and will take pretty much all the sway out of it, but for this type of implement what is recommended?

Dan

I always leave my stabilizers tight all the time. I hear leaving them loose when plowing is good to let it move around obstacles a bit, but I don't plow.

 

[Fallon]

Saw a Ford 917L Special for sale. Anyone know why it is "special"? I have not seen it in person, only pictures and they did not send one of the knives. He said it looked like a tiller! He bought it at an auction and never used it.

Other mower is saw was a JD 25A. Looked life it had knives like hammers, but once again only pictures.

The Ford was in excellent shape with all the decals and paint in excellent shape.

Trying to decide which one I will get. Thanks for any ideas.

My 917 came with side slicers. It's old & really beat up, but I still really like it. It's a bit lighter when I compare the hood to my light duty rotary cutter. It will be a great pasture & lawn mower. Might be a bit light for much brush. I think you can swap hammers for side slicers on the same rotor.

Really a flail is the same as a tiller, just a faster speed, loose tines & a belt instead of gears or a chain.

 

[IslandTractor]

Winter Storage!! :cool2: So, how do you store your flail when left out for the winter? Previous years I have tried a blue tarp, that rots away,, I am thinking about building a 5 foot wide, 10 foot long, 42 inch tall metal "shed",, using the loader, I can drop that over it,,, I do set the PTO coupler on an inverted pail,,, that keeps mud from splashing in when it rains. Hmmm,,, Any other great ideas?

Mine sits out without cover. In nine winters it hasn't shown any rust to speak of despite being only a few hundred yards from ocean. Only issue is that there are flat surfaces that trap dirt and stay damp. Tilting mower keeps one side clear but worsens the other. I just clean it out after all the leaves are down but by spring it has reaccumulated.

 

[CCWKen]

Winter storage? Since winter down here lasts about two weeks, mine just sits where it always sits. It'll be time to cut grass again by the time winter is over.

I'd like to build a 3-wall shed to house all the tractors and implements but it would have to be something like 20'x50'. The tax appraiser would jump all over that since it would be spotted easily from the air. (Yes, that's how they do it down here.) Also, the dozer would need special consideration since it has a boom on it. That and I'd probably be going through 2-3 cans of wasp spay every day.

 

[Steave]

I usually keep a can of wasp/hornet spray handy too, especially inside any sheds. They like to build under some of my equipment but not usually a bad problem unless it's been sitting a long time.

On the winter storage: This is the first year I've had the Mott flail and it'll be like the rest just sitting wherever I park it. There's no way to tilt or turn it that water won't be able to puddle on it but it'll dry out.

 

[Dan in MN]

I thought I had gotten a picture of some of the stuff that it leaves standing, but apparently didn't.. Anyway, I've figured out the problem, it's the same as when I mowed outlots earlier this year with a Gravely zero turn. The problem is stalks that are tall enough that the front of the deck pushes them down, and the back of the deck (the roller in the flail's case) gets to it and keeps it held down before the front clears the end of the stalk (never has a chance to pop up inside the deck). It passes right under the blades or knives and pops back up behind. I have one area that still looks terrible after mowing, and more passes doesn't do much either. So far I've had the mower set fairly level and also high, I'm going to try dropping the back of the flail low on the roller, then using the top link to lift the front so the flails are more 'exposed' to the incoming material. I'll try to get more pictures tomorrow and report if the change in angle helps or not...

 

[leonz]

I thought I had gotten a picture of some of the stuff that it leaves standing, but apparently didn't.. Anyway, I've figured out the problem, it's the same as when I mowed outlots earlier this year with a Gravely zero turn. The problem is stalks that are tall enough that the front of the deck pushes them down, and the back of the deck (the roller in the flail's case) gets to it and keeps it held down before the front clears the end of the stalk (never has a chance to pop up inside the deck). It passes right under the blades or knives and pops back up behind. I have one area that still looks terrible after mowing, and more passes doesn't do much either. So far I've had the mower set fairly level and also high, I'm going to try dropping the back of the flail low on the roller, then using the top link to lift the front so the flails are more 'exposed' to the incoming material. I'll try to get more pictures tomorrow and report if the change in angle helps or not...

View attachment 480088View attachment 480089

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Hello Dan,

refresh my memory, do you have the scoop knives or the side slicers?


Are you mowing at the 540 PTO engine speed? Your brush is not that high.

Have you tried half cuts?

Do not hesitate to mow backwards with a full width cut to get rid of the crap. You would be surprised how much will get shredded when mowing in reverse and then driving forward while mowing to shred it even more.

When my father used his 36 inch towed/ motorized lawn Genie(8 HP B+S) to make a jogging path for my mother in an old pasture the golden rod was 12+ foot high on average and once he got the grass and brush down to 2 inches the crap was gone and she had a safe path to jog on when she was still well.

If that rear roller is adjusted to 2 inches the mess would be nothing but a carpet of clippings if the engine speed is set for the 540 RPM PTO speed.

 

[Dan in MN]

refresh my memory, do you have the scoop knives or the side slicers?

side slicers

Are you mowing at the 540 PTO engine speed? Your brush is not that high.

At or near, mower seems to cut the same even considerably lower, but the tractor is happier a little above..

Have you tried half cuts?

I can only lift it about 6-8 inches or I risk the pto shaft separating, doesn't seem to make a difference with those stalks.

Do not hesitate to mow backwards with a full width cut to get rid of the crap. You would be surprised how much will get shredded when mowing in reverse and then driving forward while mowing to shred it even more.

I can try it, but if I have to stop, shift, back up, shift, go forward, etc.. over and over through large areas then I bought the wrong machine..

If that rear roller is adjusted to 2 inches the mess would be nothing but a carpet of clippings if the engine speed is set for the 540 RPM PTO speed.

I don't think dropping it straight down would make any difference with the tall stalks as the front of the deck and roller are keeping them pinned below the knives, never having a chance to get cut. I'm planning on experimenting some tomorrow if it doesn't rain with different heights and dropping the back, raising the front as I think that's the best chance to get knives on those stalks.. :thumbsup:

 

[leonz]

side slicers



At or near, mower seems to cut the same even considerably lower, but the tractor is happier a little above..



I can only lift it about 6-8 inches or I risk the pto shaft separating, doesn't seem to make a difference with those stalks.
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EDIT: I looked at the image with your mule and mower in the foreground and I will assume that the three to four passes that were made on the edge of the field were by you using the ford and the flail mower??

IT does not look bad for a first mowing but the brush will need to be shredded up again to dissolve the clippings quickly into the soil


Lower the cutting height to two inches with the gearbox level from front to back and mow once more with the engine speed at the 540 RPM engine speed. If you have too slow down don't worry your going to love how it looks as long as you adjust the mowers cutting height properly.

Do not hesitate to mow in spiral to allow you to recut the material.
==========================================================================================================================================================================================================================================================


I can try it, but if I have to stop, shift, back up, shift, go forward, etc.. over and over through large areas then I bought the wrong machine..

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EDIT:

My father used a ford Jubilee with a 7 foot JD25A finish mower to knock down
12-15 foot golden rod in old pasture to good sod, it just takes more time

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I don't think dropping it straight down would make any difference with the tall stalks as the front of the deck and roller are keeping them pinned below the knives, never having a chance to get cut. I'm planning on experimenting some tomorrow if it doesn't rain with different heights and dropping the back, raising the front as I think that's the best chance to get knives on those stalks.. :thumbsup:

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EDIT:

Hello Dan,

What I mean by half cuts is simply lowering the flail mower and using half the cutting width as something is very wrong, there should be nothing but clippings and your mowing does not seem to be working.

Set the mowing height at 2 inches and mow with the rear roller riding on the ground as you are losing the mowers ability to create the negative pressure gradient(suction) needed under the flail mower shroud to lift the clippings up and over the flail mower rotor.

IF it does not sound like a vacuum cleaner at the 540 RPM engine speed with the roller riding on the ground its not cutting well.

End of edit:

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I hate to ask but which way is your PTO shaft rotating??? some of the older PTO mules had right hand rotation.

 

[smilinjak]

I thought I had gotten a picture of some of the stuff that it leaves standing, but apparently didn't.. Anyway, I've figured out the problem, it's the same as when I mowed outlots earlier this year with a Gravely zero turn. The problem is stalks that are tall enough that the front of the deck pushes them down, and the back of the deck (the roller in the flail's case) gets to it and keeps it held down before the front clears the end of the stalk (never has a chance to pop up inside the deck). It passes right under the blades or knives and pops back up behind. I have one area that still looks terrible after mowing, and more passes doesn't do much either. So far I've had the mower set fairly level and also high, I'm going to try dropping the back of the flail low on the roller, then using the top link to lift the front so the flails are more 'exposed' to the incoming material. I'll try to get more pictures tomorrow and report if the change in angle helps or not...

View attachment 480088View attachment 480089

Pretty tractor, the flail fits right in the color scheme. They look good together whether it ever cuts a stalk or not. :thumbsup:
Smilinjak

 

[Dan in MN]

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Hello Dan,

What I mean by half cuts is simply lowering the flail mower and using half the cutting width as something is very wrong,
There should be nothing but clippings and your mowing does not seem to be working.

Set the mowing height at 2 inches and mow. if you have time.


I hate to ask but which way is your PTO shaft rotating??? some of the older PTO mules had right hand rotation.

Ahh...thought you were talking about raising for a partial height cut first.. I went out and verified that the knives are rotating upwards in front as intended. I also dropped it down much lower in hopes of trying again tomorrow (forecast is calling for rain...). I did find one mistake by the Value Leader engineers...dropping it down lower of course also needed the skids to be raised, but in front you can't get to the bottom bolt hole on the skid as the curve of the skid is such that it hits the side of the frame before you can get to the bolt hole. I was able to raise the back of the skids and it will work fine with some angle to it, but thats kind of a ridiculous oversight..

 

[Xfaxman]

--------------------

I can only lift it about 6-8 inches or I risk the pto shaft separating,----------------

A PTO shaft extender would solve that problem.

 

[Dan in MN]

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Set the mowing height at 2 inches and mow with the rear roller riding on the ground as you are losing the mowers ability to create the negative pressure gradient(suction) needed under the flail mower shroud to lift the clippings up and over the flail mower rotor.

IF it does not sound like a vacuum cleaner at the 540 RPM engine speed with the roller riding on the ground its not cutting well.

Somewhere with the edit or me just reading too quickly I had missed this part... Definately no vacuum sound, it's so quiet I hardly hear it working and the tractor isn't that loud either (no ear protection necessary). I had started higher just making sure the tractor had enough power, hopefully dropping down in height doesn't cause me to have to drive slower. I can handle mowing in 3L (2 speed Sherman transmission option on my Jubilee), but going down to 2L is a big dropoff in ground speed. I have around ~20 acres I want to mow a few times a year, not willing to make it a part time job.. If I have to creep along then I bought the wrong implement, regardless of how it cuts.. Actually when researching mowers all summer my main concern with a flail was ground speed, couldn't find any real information on it but I took a chance. I know a Bush Hog would move faster, but it was very important to me to be able to back into my shop with the mower attached and still get my zero turn in front of it, a 6' Bush Hog sticking out close to 8' behind the tractor would have been a big problem..

A PTO shaft extender would solve that problem.

Not in this case...I had to shorten the shaft to get it hooked to the tractor, maybe could have done a little bit less but certainly didn't go overboard with it. Part of the problem is this old tractor needs the pto engaged to have hydraulics, so the only way to raise it high is with the pto spinning and I've had it separate a couple of times (lesson quickly learned! lol). If I were able to raise it without the shaft spinning I could get it higher for servicing, etc..

 

[Catoosa]

Speaking of Mott flail mowers.. I have a good gear box off a Mott mower, at least I think it's a Mott. Looks like the one in the photo in post #1877 of this thread except it's red. If someone needs it and can pick it up (or have it picked up) just outside Tulsa OK I'll give it to you. Please do not ask me to ship it, if I wanted to go through the trouble I would put on eBay. It's still sorta attached to the mount because I was not able to get the PTO coupling off the input shaft. Probably needs to be cut off with a torch. It's used but looks good, a couple seals and it would be good to go.

 

[Steave]

Speaking of Mott flail mowers.. I have a good gear box off a Mott mower, at least I think it's a Mott. Looks like the one in the photo in post #1877 of this thread except it's red. If someone needs it and can pick it up (or have it picked up) just outside Tulsa OK I'll give it to you. Please do not ask me to ship it, if I wanted to go through the trouble I would put on eBay. It's still sorta attached to the mount because I was not able to get the PTO coupling off the input shaft. Probably needs to be cut off with a torch. It's used but looks good, a couple seals and it would be good to go.

That's very generous maybe help somebody out around your area. As for the PTO coupling I ended up having to cut the one on mine. When I got it the PTO shaft was bent and wouldn't slide. I tried everyway possible to get it off but ended up splitting it with a cut off blade and then a giant gear puller. Luckily the gear box was fine.

 

[gregharr55]

Good to know the rear roller isn't too easily bent. Thanks for all the good info.
Greg

 

[KenB2920]

Attempted to throw a BX45 belt on my Ford 918H.... Boy, I couldn't get it to fit only to see its a BX45 1/2...... Looks like .8 inches longer.... An inch means a lot to a guy...

Ordered some new ones from messicks and should be here next week. Hopefully I can get them on 1203mm comes to mind

 

[Dan in MN]

I went out yesterday with the grass wet to try the lower height and mowed an area that was only around 12" tall so I wouldn't get grass wrapped up in the roller again...it cut pretty nicely...



Today was nice and sunny all day, was going to go out late afternoon and mow a taller area but the tractor wouldn't start. After some troubleshooting I narrowed it down to the starter and took it apart, definately needs a rebuild with worn down brushes, corrosion on the commutator shaft, and one of the brushes had the wiring almost broken completely off (did come off while I handled it)... I'm surprised it was working at all, hoping to find a rebuild kit locally tomorrow otherwise I'll have to order and wait..