Container Weld Shop build -

[BukitCase]

Sorry the sketches took so long



HTH... Steve

Oh, BTW - if you don't need the winch as close as it can be to the beam, a MUCH simpler way is just find a piece of square tube that'll fit into those factory brackets - then weld a piece of FB to one side of the tubing with a big hole for your trolley bolt, (look at the PINK part in pic3, replace the big pink bar with tube) and you can slide the whole thing around in those brackets til you like the balance...

 

[Oldpath05]

"(Looks like the little 440 winch would work for you - "Shipping Weight 24.95 lb.)" Humm 25 lb isn't that on the heavy-ish side? and I have to a winch as close to the beam as possible, maybe on top, I already bottom out the chainfalls stacking bundles up on top, might have to do some redneck engineering.

"(There's also times when I wanna pick something with the FEL, and set it on a trailer in a specific spot (so I can cram MORE things on there) - for example,)"<<<<<I know everything but the kitchen sink, yeah ok I see your point, need a 3rd hand that can lift a 1000 lbs by a push of a button, know what ya mean, that's what happens when we get older, now when we snap our fingers the wife dont come running anymore.


"( hafta settle for a Browning 300winmag with a 6-20 power Nikon scope and yeah, when I get around to it I have a backstop down at the bottom corner of the back pasture, (Needs brush hogged ATM) over 600 yard range without ever leaving my property)" 600 yards that's awesome and you bush hog around an ATM<Automated Teller Machine, no wonder you have all kinds of money to make stuff. Around here coyotes cant seem to break into ATMs, maybe that's why I hear them howling once and a while, and at times quite close but if the they was just 300' they'd be in the woods and out of sight, but after tem minutes there gone, probably headed out your way.

 

[BukitCase]

"Automated Teller Machine" - Good one :laughing: Also stands for At The Moment in geek-speak

Here's part of your jib pic, with the small winch set next to your chain fall - close as I could tell I got 'em to the same scale, and if you went with my sketch and replaced the "dongle" your winch is hangin' on right now, looks like they'd come out about even for height.



"25 lb isn't that on the heavy-ish side?" - Nope, I just weighed one of my chain falls (same one as yours) - and it weighed just under 25 lbs INCLUDING the 5 gallon plastic bucket it's in, so basically NO CHANGE in weight between the two - if anything, the electric should weigh LESS, since that 25 lbs is SHIPPING weight... Steve

 

[Oldpath05]

Doing a little movie magic, clever, but shouldn't that winch go transverse so's not to loose travel motion, distance, length, movement?
Here's an updated picture I took this past weekend, I have the chainfalls bottomed out and at times it's just barely high enough. The biggest problem I have with these chainfalls if the the up&down chain only works good when its perfectly around the bundle which at most times is hard to maintain so when the chain is off to the side it jams up and that's when aggravation steps in. That's why if had electric winch there'd be no more Hoover jam, theridicly, but then, seems like there's always a but, I wonder what about the electric cable, will that get tangled up in the trolley, I just dont want to move aggravation from one place to the next, I want it out of here and go bother people on the west coast where they have more patience, know what I mean Vern..........

 

[BukitCase]

"shouldn't that winch go transverse so's not to loose travel motion, distance, length, movement?"

It could, but that can cause balance problems - with NO load, the motor is heavier than the cable spool - so if you hang the winch so THAT works, when you hang a LOAD on it that UN-balances the load on the trolley. If you remember the pics of my "mini-jib", I have that problem - somebody on a different site posted a "fix", which I shamelessly "borrowed" -



I haven't DONE that yet, and I'm not sure there's ROOM on YOUR wood beam - I just looked at one of my trolleys, and if you drilled holes for the bearings just below where the side plates angle inward it should work (on YOURS) to keep the trolley from tilting.

Next problem - I do NOT know what the measurements are on those 440 winches, but the 1100 lb one on my "mini-jib" actually HANGS from the long "spacer bolt" on the trolley, using those 2 brackets shown on the factory picture - if the 440 winch is SHORTER, that might not work - you'd probably need to actually TOUCH one of the small ones (dunno how close your nearest HF store is) - if that'd work for you, you should measure the total length of your trolley's big fat bolt fulla washers - here's what I mean (zoom in on that pic, I marked it up)-



"Here's an updated picture I took this past weekend, I have the chainfalls bottomed out and at times it's just barely high enough."

If necessary, it looks like you could maybe raise your jib a few inches fairly simple (easy for ME to say if YOU'RE the one doin' it

"The biggest problem I have with these chainfalls if the the up&down chain only works good when its perfectly around the bundle which at most times is hard to maintain so when the chain is off to the side it jams up and that's when aggravation steps in."

Yeah, they are a PITA for that; I tend to hold BOTH of the pull chains in one hand, keep tension on 'em and stand to the side a bit and pull one while letting the OTHER one slip thru my glove - still, irritating...

"That's why if had electric winch there'd be no more Hoover jam, theridicly, but then, seems like there's always a but, I wonder what about the electric cable, will that get tangled up in the trolley, I just dont want to move aggravation from one place to the next"

Right; the whole idea of changing things is to ELIMINATE PITA's, not ADD MORE - Here's what I did on the "mini-jib", but it's only 4 feet long; you might need "outriggers" on BOTH ends of the electric cords - it's also how I mounted the 1100 lb winch, but the 440 might be a different distance between mounts - if so, you'd need to fab something similar to my sketches instead - notice that the cords fall BELOW the trolley...



Personally, I'd rather figger out a way to hold a cord out of the way than put up with those chains, specially the way YOU'RE havin' to do it...

Oh - things that taught me patience -

Wife that likes horses -
Horses -
Hauling hay for horses
Cleaning up after horses
Kids (and grandkids)
Kids that're allergic to cow milk
Dairy goats (see above)
Building fences that'll keep goats in/out
Building FEEDERS that'll keep goats from WASTING most of their feed
Couple HUNDRED OTHER Things, but list is gettin' too long

Anyway, cogitate on my suggestions, they might actually WORK :laughing: ... Steve

 

[BukitCase]

Just got back from town, stopped at HF store and measured their 440# winch - the factory "U" brackets and their threaded holes will bolt right onto the fat spacer bolt on their 1 ton trolley - and your trolley looks to be identical, so THAT part should be easy - wiring too, I would just run the winch to the outer end of the beam, fasten any kind of "outrigger" maybe 14" long to the support strut halfway along the beam, and maybe add one to the winch itself to be sure - then the POWER cord would go up the support strut and down the wall, and the control pendant can just hang down. You'd probably need a short extension cord for the power, it's about the length of your BEAM but not long enough to go wherever your power plug would be... Steve

 

[Oldpath05]

Oh - things that taught me patience -

Wife that likes horses -
Horses -
Hauling hay for horses
Cleaning up after horses
Kids (and grandkids)
Kids that're allergic to cow milk
Dairy goats (see above)
Building fences that'll keep goats in/out
Building FEEDERS that'll keep goats from WASTING most of their feed
Couple HUNDRED OTHER Things, but list is gettin' too long

Anyway, cogitate on my suggestions, they might actually WORK :laughing: ... Steve

Well I wanted to last night but the wife said she had a headache, again. I see you have a list of the 10 commandments, but me think you forgot one that surely will produce more patience (for you) if all else fails>>>Thou shalt love thy scumbag neighbor more than thy tinker toys especially if they live on the west side. I love my neighbors on the west side of me, it's amazing how friendly trees can be.

Well might be another issue with transverse winch setup besides the balance, in that other picture I posted I just realised my jib crane has to swing against the wall to get the bundles stacked so like in your previous movie magic picture, I'm wondering if that hoist can be swung around in the opposite direction so is to the moter sticks out beyond the end of boom? And did you stick a bering under your trolley yet? like in one of the pictures you posted, if not how is your hoist staying level if the motor part is heavier?

 

[BukitCase]

"my jib crane has to swing against the wall to get the bundles stacked so like in your previous movie magic picture, I'm wondering if that hoist can be swung around in the opposite direction so is to the moter sticks out beyond the end of boom?"

Yup, you'd just need to do it like those sketches I posted, only turn the hoist end for end - you'd ALSO need to trim off your "bumper block" at the end of the jib (flush with the bottom of the I beam) so the motor wouldn't hit it. The trolley doesn't need that lower part anyway.

For YOUR setup to work with the hoist, I would place the BIG HOLE in the PINK piece (the 4th sketch), CENTERED about 1" AWAY from the INNER FLANGE of the cable spool (partly OVER the spool - see where the big black arrow points), PLUS you'd DEFINITELY need the bearings in the pics, or the hoist would rub on the bottom of your beam... that hole position should make it so there's not much TILT for the added bearings to overcome.

I gave up tryin' to figger THAT part out for the 1 ton version I'll be doing, so I just planned on TWO trolleys - one centered over each pair of mounting holes on the hoist - that way there'll be a trolley supporting the cable spool, and one for the motor. (That 1 tonner is a LOT bigger than the 440# one, right at TWICE as long AND TWICE as wide, plus instead of maybe 23 lbs it's more like 75...

"And did you stick a bering under your trolley yet? "

Nope, haven't got around to ordering the right bearings, etc -

"like in one of the pictures you posted, if not how is your hoist staying level if the motor part is heavier?"

It's NOT staying level; at least, not ALWAYS - I haven't been using the jib a lot lately, other fish to fry. And it doesn't tilt when there's a load on, so hasn't been quite irritating enough for me to push that to the top of the list - PLUS, my jib is just low enough I can reach up and push the hoist around by the motor, so that helps

If I didn't 'splain that well enough, let me know and I'll do a more accurate sketch (now that we know what you wanna do ) ... Steve

 

[BukitCase]

OK, what I shoulda been doing didn't seem as fun as this, so here's pretty much what I wuz doin' a crappy job of explaining



HTH... Steve

 

[Oldpath05]

("I gave up tryin' to figger THAT part out for the 1 ton version I'll be doing, so I just planned on TWO trolleys - one centered over each pair of mounting holes on the hoist - that way there'll be a trolley supporting the cable spool, and one for the motor. (That 1 tonner is a LOT bigger than the 440# one, right at TWICE as long AND TWICE as wide, plus instead of maybe 23 lbs it's more like 75...")<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

The two trolley sounds the best idea, if I had some welding rods for wood, I'd add two more feet of I beam to my wooden I beam. Reason 110 why I like working with steel instead of wood, usually when I work with wood I cut a 2x4 three times and it's still comes out to short.

 

[BukitCase]

Know whatcha mean, somehow I cut just ONE of the cross pieces (2" square tube x 1/8" wall - see, I CAN use "normal ruler stuff" too :=) on my container roof 1/4" too short, ended up cuttin' about 1/8" off another piece, leaving a small "open root" gap at both ends, and welding it back up - worked MUCH better than fixin' the SAME boo-boo on WOOD...

Too bad you don't need ANOTHER 10' jib somewhere else, you could pick up a 20' stick of 5" x 10 lb. I beam for about $150, cut it in half and stop messin' with the wood one - that size would MORE than do for anything up to at least 1000 lbs (at 10' long, anyway) - it'd probly tear your swivel mount off the wall before the beam would care... Steve

 

[Oldpath05]

("Too bad you don't need ANOTHER 10' jib somewhere else, you could pick up a 20' stick of 5" x 10 lb. I beam for about $150")

I aventually as in sooner than later want to put a Jib crane inside my shop, but steel cheaper then wood? (cough cough, roll my eyes, scratch my head) time for a math lesson using my state the art calculator, 1st I have plenty of wood, I can go down back cut a log bring it out in 3 hr with 2 gal of tractor fuel, mill it up 4 hr with 1 gal of gas, stack and sticker upstairs in my garage 4 hr, wait for it to dry 3 summer months, make a 16' I beam in 24 hr with using $50.00 worth of glues screws and paint, 24 hr to let paint dry and wahla a 16' ft wooden I beam all for under $60.00.

PS I was bored and wanted to wright something and check your funny bone using alternative facts.

 

[BukitCase]

My funny bone still seems to work, but I HAVE noticed it's a bit more "creaky" than it useta wuz

Forgot to mention before - that small 440# hoist isn't LONG enough to have room to use TWO trolleys - but there MIGHT be a way to add a couple different mounts to the trolley so ONE pair of wheels was almost centered over the spool and the OTHER pair centered over the motor - I'll play around with that idea a bit, see if it holds water (er, I mean firewood

Got more drawing done last night, gettin' close to cutting parts for the "wide-track post braces" on the HF crane... Steve

 

[BukitCase]

Got most of the parts cut today for the post braces on the HF crane - still need to cut 4 pieces of 2" x 1/8" wall tubing for the diagonals, they'll be 31" point to point, both ends cut 45*. Here's what I got done today, got some more prep to do on most of 'em -



This batch is for the crane braces, all just out of the saw. I'll need to notch 2 of the channel pieces to clear the diagonal square tubes, other ends will come in on the FLAT side -



And these are most of the NEW "porch roof" plan - decided against doing a full-fledged roof frame out of 2" tubing, so these will each get a 10' piece of tubing slid thru the shiny pieces (they're actual .030" over RECEIVER tubing) - then I'll just strap a 9x11 tarp over the long tubing pieces and it'll hang over the doors of the container by about 7 feet. One less "permanent" project for a "temporary" condition :thumbsup:



Guess tomorrow (and probably the next day or two after) will be clean up/weld up/put up time (for the "porch roof", that is - the braces will likely take longer... Steve

 

[dragoneggs]

Thanks for all the detail, Steve!

 

[BukitCase]

You're welcome Mark - you probably caught the visual proof (first pic in that last post) of my belief in the old adage, "A clean desk is a sign of a sick mind" - :laughing: ...Steve

 

[Oldpath05]

I gotta say I never seen anyone shine up steel for home projects like you do, show me your favorite shiney steel making tool.

 

[BukitCase]

Most of the time I use a Walter zip disk (light touch, constant movement, about a 45* angle) if there's mill scale - then smooth it out with a CGW 40 grit flap disk (same method as the zip disk, only almost flat) - a NEW 40 grit is a little aggressive, so I use NEW ones for bevels, etc, til they "mellow out" a bit, then I use them for the "final shiney" part -

If a part has sat long enough to start a light rust coat before I get around to finishing the job, I have an old B&D "professional" high speed corded drill (came as a 1/4", I put a 3/8 keyless chuck on it) - it runs 4000 rpm, usually keep a 6" wire wheel on it and use it to get REALLY light rust off and add a bit of "tooth" before painting.

There's so much rain and humidity here a lot of the year, if I DON'T do that EVERYTHING is the SAME COLOR (reddish brown) and has its own "non-skid" finish

My favorite "bb blaster", for FLAT surfaces anyway, is an air hammer with a wide flat chisel, kept pretty sharp - you can just PUSH it along (low angle) til it stops on a more stubborn "bb", then just touch the trigger. That also works really good on the light slag after plasma cuts.

Small needle scaler for corners, fillets, etc...

If there's quite a bit of "flat land", this
Ingersoll Rand 315 Heavy Duty Air Twin Piston Straight Line Sander - 2-3/4-Inch x 17-1/2-Inch Pad - Power Random Orbit Sanders - Amazon.com

works pretty good too - I quit tryin' to live with plain-backed paper, now I buy the pressure-sensitive stuff in 40 grit. I got the idea from my GOOD neighbor, he runs a custom car shop next door. Side benefit - I can drool over all kinds of fun toys without havin' to use perfectly good TOOL money to do it :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

I got the rest of the pieces cut (no pics yet) for both the "porch roof" on the container, AND the other tubing pieces for the HF crane's corner braces; might get more "shinifyin'" done after supper, I wanna get the "porch roof" part done (welded and painted) so I can keep the (coming soon,AGAIN) horizontal rain outa the weld shop container with the doors open... Steve

Oh, BTW - now you can join the "pick on Shiny Steve" club, Terry (Big Barn) is prez, but I'm pretty sure the "Veep" slot is still open :laughing: