Battery Info

[ultrarunner]

Seen it often… check your grounds…

If you can try connecting cables or jumper cables as close to the starter and see if it makes a difference.

A very early success of mine that had both the dealer and independent mechanic stumped after several new batteries and a starter was as simple then as a $3 braided ground strap from the frame to a starter bolt…

Doesn’t hurt to tug on the battery cables… seen it were the cable just pulled out and separated…

 

[LouNY]

Grounds or cables likely to be bad, have you checked the battery voltage with it disconnected from the tractor?
Also if you can wrangle a second set of hands try checking the voltage from the battery positive post to the starter solenoid connection, with the key off should be zero volts, when starting or trying to start the indicated voltage shows what the cable is eating up.

 

[varmint]

I bought my present Kubota L3400 used in 2014 from a careful previous owner who had taken excellent care of the tractor and even added some premium accessories. It came with a NAPA battery, which is still serving me. The tractor lives in a barn, and I keep a cheap Harbor Freight battery maintainer on it when I know it will sit for weeks, especially in the winter. Never any issues with that battery. I'd hope to get 4-5 years out of any car battery, considering the cost.

 

[JimRB]

I had to put a new end on my positive battery cable. New end with an extension as JD puts in exactly the length of cable with not enough length to put on a new clamp. OEM positive cable was a silly price and had some custom connections happening. Oreilly's had it on their wall. https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/...s01/08202?q=battery+repair+cable+6+inch&pos=3

 

[airbiscuit]

Bad grounds or battery cables would explain the no start, but I don't get the low voltage readings. Frustrating.

 

[grsthegreat]

I had a few issues with my positive battery cable on my tractor with intermittent non starts. I replaced the cable and all issues went away. The copper inside the rubber cover was rotting away from battery acid.

 

[ultrarunner]

I had a few issues with my positive battery cable on my tractor with intermittent non starts. I replaced the cable and all issues went away. The copper inside the rubber cover was rotting away from battery acid.

I did have one starter that acted like a bad battery until I put a meter and saw the huge draw when engaging the starter.

A bronze bushing on the end of the starter armature shaft had come loose enough to cause the armature to no longer align creating a huge amp draw…

I was swapping out the starter when I saw the loose bushing.

 

[DarkBlack]

The weather was nice today and the ground is dried out, so I decided to install the new battery and get the last of my mowing done.

The new battery is identical in size and configuration. It was a simple swap.

I got in my tractor and everything was dead. I tried again and the dash lights came on, but the started didn't make a sound. I put my volt meter on the battery and it read 11.8

I hooked up the jumper cables to my truck and I was able to get some clicking noises from the starter. I let it run for 15 minutes without any improvement. I let it run for another 15 minutes without any improvement.

I decided to try my backhoe battery instead of my truck. The backhoe battery is less then a year old, 950 CCA. After hooking it up, I got the same results as with my truck. I let it run for half an hour and there wasn't any improvement.

With the jumpers on the new battery in my tractor, I'm at 12.08 volts. Without the jumpers, the battery in the tractor is at 11.8 volts.

This is odd to me since I was expecting 14 volts or better with the jumpers. I've had the new battery on a trickle charger for two weeks, and it's odd that my voltage is so low.

Right now I have an old battery charger on it for the night to charge it better than the trickly charger. It's an older Schumaker charger, and the meter isn't showing anything to indicate that it's charging. I don't know for sure if it's working. I probably need to put my meter on it, but I haven't done that yet.

What am I missing?

I’d disconnect one lead from your new battery, and charge it disconnected. If you have a machine to test start it, do it to prove out the new battery. Now you’re at square one.
Next , rule out a parasitic draw on your tractor. Connect one lead. Put your voltmeter in dc amps mode and connect the other battery terminal through your meter to the unconnected cable. You should have much less than an amp flow with your tractor off.
Next, Connect up the cable normally.
Measure voltage from directly on the negative battery post to a good paint free part of your chassis while someone is engaging the starter. The voltage should be less than one volt.
Do the same with the positive to the furthest positive run you can access.
Again the voltage readings should be less than a volt.

 

[BubbaSam]

My Kioti CK30 HST battery lasted 15 years. Replaced it with a new one (exact replacement) and it's going strong 4 years later (of course). I don't even keep a charger on it but then it's kept inside. Cold Cranking Amps (CCA) if you can get one that will fit i that has even more. Like one person said... it's what gives the tractor (car, etc) more umph... Best to take your battery to wherever you want to purchase it for side. BUT, as another dude said, measure the battery pan and height of the area as you MAY be able to put an even larger one in the OEM's place.

 

[IH3444]

New Holland had faulty battery cables from the factory due to the crimping method they used that allowed moisture to infiltrate and then wick up the copper cable and cause corrosion inside the crimped cable. Happened to my neighbor's TC35. He went around for several weeks trying to find out why his tractor wouldn't start. I was telling him to put new ends on the battery cable and even had a few spares for him. He did this while I was gone, and that's when he found the extensive corrosion inside the crimped cable housing, and the infiltration of the corrosion into the copper wires of the cables. He went to an automotive supply store and purchased new copper cable, new copper cable eyelet ends, and marine brass battery cable ends. He then expertly soldered the copper eyelet ends to the cables and attached the brass marine battery cable ends. Problem solved. I can't tell you how much time he spent diagnosing this problem, and how ripped apart his tractor was while he was testing relays, his starter, etc. I think he even bought a new starter, and it still did the same thing. No starting issue.
This problem has its own threads here on TBN.

 

[Xfaxman]

The weather was nice today and the ground is dried out, so I decided to install the new battery and get the last of my mowing done.

The new battery is identical in size and configuration. It was a simple swap.

I got in my tractor and everything was dead. I tried again and the dash lights came on, but the started didn't make a sound. I put my volt meter on the battery and it read 11.8

Was the meter on the battery posts or on the cable clamps?

 

[EddieWalker]

I put the meter on the battery posts. I'm going to pull my cables and inspect them today.

 

[rScotty]

Right now I have an old battery charger on it for the night to charge it better than the trickly charger. It's an older Schumaker charger, and the meter isn't showing anything to indicate that it's charging. I don't know for sure if it's working. I probably need to put my meter on it, but I haven't done that yet.

What am I missing?

Eddie, it sounds like either your voltmeter is shot or you are wasting time with a defective new batttery and your tractor/hoe charging system isn't working either. And that old battery charger doesn't read right either.
Which sounds like too many coincidences, but there you are.
If you trust the voltmeter, it is time for a new smart charger and a new battery...then you can troubleshoot the charging system on the tractor. As you know, it is probably just cables and connector corrosion.

A brand new battery has to come to you with above 12.25 volts. I'd rather see it above 12.6. Check that before hooking it up at all.

To test any battery, unhook it from everything and charge it at a normal rate ... `0 to 20 amps overnight. To confirm that the charger is working, check the voltage across the battery terminals while the charger is hooked up and powered. The voltage should be over 13 vdc. The next morning, disconnect the charger and measure the voltage across the battery terminals. It should be surprisingly high...often 12. 9 volts or more. Then let the battery just sit disconnected for a day. This allows the charge to stabilize. It should then be over 12.5 volts and stay there for days. If it dropped under 12.4 volts it is a weak battery. If it dropped to under 12.1 volts it is very weak, under 12.0 and it is a defective battery.

So if yours read 11.8 volts when you got it, it was bad from the beginning. Sitting at that voltage makes them sulfate rapidly. You might get it to charge, but it won't hold a charge for long.
Luck,
rScotty

 

[EddieWalker]

Thank you Scotty for the detailed information. My battery charger is very old. Probably 30 years old or older. I don't trust it, but I haven't tested it to know for sure.

My plan is to remove my cables, inspect them, clean the ends better then what I did when I changed the battery, and try it again. Since I couldn't get it to start with the jumper cables hooked up to my backhoe with the engine running, there might be an issue with the cables.

My volt meter is probably two years old. It's nothing fancy, just something with a ton of reviews on Amazon. As far as I know, it's accurate.

If it's the battery, shouldn't the battery on the backhoe, with the engine running, be enough to start the Massey?

 

[SteveS42240]

In our area, Western Kentucky, Interstate or Decca are our top batteries for tractors and what I use on my vehicles. I always buy the highest CCA battery available.

 

[rScotty]

Thank you Scotty for the detailed information. My battery charger is very old. Probably 30 years old or older. I don't trust it, but I haven't tested it to know for sure.

My plan is to remove my cables, inspect them, clean the ends better then what I did when I changed the battery, and try it again. Since I couldn't get it to start with the jumper cables hooked up to my backhoe with the engine running, there might be an issue with the cables.

My volt meter is probably two years old. It's nothing fancy, just something with a ton of reviews on Amazon. As far as I know, it's accurate.

If it's the battery, shouldn't the battery on the backhoe, with the engine running, be enough to start the Massey?

Yes, I agree. Jumping from the backhoe should be enough to start the Massey with the "new" battery in most cases. But it probably won't be able to start it if the new battery in the Massey is so flat that it is sucking all the amps. If that is the case you can rev up the backhoe and risk overheating the new battery... or just let the backhoe idle so it charges more slowly for 15 min to half an idle and try to start the Massey again.
If the MF still doesn't start, figure on cables & connectors ...OR you really did get lucky and got a new battery that has an internal defect & cannot be fixed. Gotta be one or the other.

NOTE: be VERY careful trying to charge a bad battery. It can overheat and blow up. I've seen it happen.
If you hear it whistle or see steam, turn everything off and get away.

And also..what is the deal with using that old dumb battery charger? I've got two of them myself in the junk pile. Of all people, I would have thought you would have seen the advantage in the new smart charger. I'd say spend $169.00 & for Xmas get a BatteryMinder with adjustable charging rate and desulfation cycle.
enjoy,
rScotty

 

[ultrarunner]

When I worked at the car lot a questionable battery was charged and then load tested to measure capacity…

It was a Litmus pass/fail test on replace or not.

A jump with properly sized jumper cables from a known good battery and no difference would seem to clear battery doubt.

I’ve seen cheap “Jumper” cables melt when put to the test…

I have a 50 year old 30 amp charger that will cook a battery if left on overnight.

It’s still my go to for neglected batteries which I charge outside on my battery bench.

I know all you want for Christmas is to put this behind you!

 

[EddieWalker]

And also..what is the deal with using that old dumb battery charger? I've got two of them myself in the junk pile. Of all people, I would have thought you would have seen the advantage in the new smart charger. I'd say spend $169.00 & for Xmas get a BatteryMinder with adjustable charging rate and desulfation cycle.
enjoy,
rScotty

I had a really nice battery charger that worked great. It was one of the bigger ones that rolled on wheels, and I could jump start just about anything with it. Sadly, I forgot it was there when backing up the backhoe one day and destroyed it.

The one I have now was my Dad's, and he had it back before I moved to Texas, so I know it's from the 90's. It's been a couple of years since the "accident" with my good charger, and it's just been one of those things that I keep putting off.

Odds are good that I might be doing some After Christmas shopping on Thursday.

 

[jrsavoie]

I haven't noticed any big difference in how long they last. Given that most of us keep our vehicles longer now than in years past maybe we're just more aware of replacement.
It's very much YMMV as far as brands go...someone here highly recommended O'Reilly batteries which I've had terrible experience with, someone else bashed Walmart ones which have given me very good service.

For years I had great luck with batteries from Farm and Fleet.
Then I started having terrible life with F&F batteries.

I've switched to Advanced Auto.

The last battery we got there didn't load test good, but it's working.

We need to return it before the warranty runs out.

I usually load test at the store, but forgot.

The 20 year old previous battery for the 1975 Ford Backhoe from F&F still load tested almost as good as the battery from Advanced Auto

 

[jrsavoie]

I had a really nice battery charger that worked great. It was one of the bigger ones that rolled on wheels, and I could jump start just about anything with it. Sadly, I forgot it was there when backing up the backhoe one day and destroyed it.

The one I have now was my Dad's, and he had it back before I moved to Texas, so I know it's from the 90's. It's been a couple of years since the "accident" with my good charger, and it's just been one of those things that I keep putting off.

Odds are good that I might be doing some After Christmas shopping on Thursday.

From the 90's. That's near new around here