Adding 3rd function valve, top link, side link, and one extra. How???

[kennyd]

question--I have a jd 2305 with loader and it has a manual diverder I want to run another cylinder and still us my controls need help dixstir.

Start a new thread

 

[CHDinCT]

So after looking a little more, i found that the 4610 has a hyd flow for implements of 9.6 gpm, so I assume that means that I'll have to step up to the next valve size? being the 14gpm rated one?
Is this what I need? Surplus Center - 4 SPOOL 14 GPM PRINCE WVS41BBBB5C1 DA VALVE

Piston, is tht 9.6 GPM total hydraulic flow for your 4610 including power steering, or is the full 9.6 GPM available to power attachments? I ask because if it includes the GPM dedicated to power steering, you can subtract that out as it's not available to power your FEL or anything you plug into your soon to be new 4-spool valve and you may be able to save some money and stick with the 8GPM version. If you don't know, I'd check into it some more before spending the extra for the 14 GPM valve. Good luck.

 

[Piston]

CHDinCT,
It is for the implement flow, the total is 14.4 including the power steering.

I should be ordering the WR Long kit this week, hopefully install that next week.

 

[Moosehill]

Just an FYI make sure your hose fittings match your spool/valve fittings could save you some time.

 

[Piston]

So after an unfortunate Emergency surgery for my dog last month, my play money was wiped clean after paying tufts university for saving my dogs life. I was set back a bit so I couldn't order the valve kit, however I'm happy to report that after all this snow we have had in the last three weeks I have made enough backi to place my order. Yesterday I ordered a 64" wr long open bottom grapple with the pin on type attachment points and a wr long 3rd function kit, I also made an appointment to have my rear tires filled with rimguard. It should take about two weeks to get the grapple and kit but I wont be able to pick it up until the following week.

I spoke with Nelson long on the phone and he explained a lot of information I wanted and spent a lot of time on the phone with me. If his product is as good as his customer service then I will be overly happy with my purchases. Just an FYI, if your thinking of ordering a grapple from wr long in the spring time I would do it now, he said they are backed up from all the sales they have even after hiring 4 new people.

After the grapple I'll tackle the rear remotes project, thanks again to everyone who helped, especially those that posted threads on how tos.

Hopefully the next pics I post in this thread are with a working grapple, but for now everything is covered in snow!

 

[Piston]

I guess it's time for an update, better late than never right? :laughing:

I ended up getting the WR Long grapple and 3rd function valve within about 2-3 weeks of ordering it. At the same time I picked up the grapple I also had my rear tires filled with Rimguard. It pays to shop around, I got prices from a few different dealerships and I got quotes around $7 a gallon, and then found Ahern Equipment in Spencer MA was only $4 a gallon :thumbsup:
The grapple itself has literally changed my life hahah. I can't say enough about how useful it has been for me. I'm not gonna go on and on about how much I like it but if anyone has any specific questions then feel free to ask.

I apologize for not taking pics of the installation of the 3rd function valve. It actually was remarkably simple and I think because of that, I really didn't think of stopping along the way and documenting what I did. I followed the included directions and if I remember correctly, it took me 2 hrs to install, that included welding the bracket to the cross bar of my FEL for the QD mount.
Overall I am extremely satisfied with the grapple, I can't say anything bad about it. I very rarely have my bucket on my FEL now.

I will post a few pics of the grapple and me getting some use out of it. I also posted quite a few pics at this link: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/211635-grappling-fun-picture-thread.html
Feel free to add your own there as well!

I will have some more questions in the near future regarding the rest of this project, mostly some hydraulic hose questions and fittings questions.
Thanks again to everyone who has helped me along the way. I'll try to be better at documenting the valve addition for the top n tilt!

 

[Piston]

Here's a few pics...

 

[Piston]

I decided to go with a stack valve for the hydraulics addition. I bought it from surplus center and got a 4 spool valve, I ordered 2 spools with a detented float postion, and 2 spring return to center spools.
It has a power beyond port which I'll use to run the log splitter.
https://www.surpluscenter.com/Item.asp?item=9SV-4-Y

I also bought a QD fitting, and a pressure gauge, so I could check my system pressure and adjust my relief valve setting if needed.
https://www.surpluscenter.com/Item.asp?item=21-1044
I don't know why I didn't realize this at the time, but I ordered the wrong size for both the QD and the gauge, both 1/4"

You'll notice in the series of pics I took, that I was so excited to get the valve together, that I started putting the spools on the wrong direction, and didn't notice until I got the last spool on, and there were no 'grooves' for the O Rings to fit in :laughing:
I took it back apart, easy enough, and assembled it in the correct order.

(Note: Don't open all the pics if you have a slow connection, they're basically all the same but just showing how I assembled the valve)

 

[Piston]

I decided I will mount the valve on the right rear fender, this wasn't all that difficult of a decision considering that the right rear fender is about the only possible place it will fit without much modification! :laughing:

The only thing that made it a little 'cramped' was the rear flasher, I disconnected it and moved it in a little closer to the ROPS where there was already a hole drilled for it, this hole was slightly further back than the one it was in before, and gave me just enough room to fit the valve :thumbsup:

 

[MtnViewRanch]

I decided I will mount the valve on the right rear fender, this wasn't all that difficult of a decision considering that the right rear fender is about the only possible place it will fit without much modification! :laughing:

The only thing that made it a little 'cramped' was the rear flasher, I disconnected it and moved it in a little closer to the ROPS where there was already a hole drilled for it, this hole was slightly further back than the one it was in before, and gave me just enough room to fit the valve :thumbsup:

Piston, when you get done, you will have one slick setup. :thumbsup: I'm jealous, I really need to get my act together and get my 4th and 5th remotes on my 7520. hopefully before the end of the year.

Hey, have you checked out Discount Hydraulic Hose for your hoses and fitting? I highly recommend them and to use the reusable fittings and make the hoses up yourself. That way they come out exactly as YOU want them.

 

[Piston]

Piston, when you get done, you will have one slick setup.

That's assuming it actually works Brian! :laughing: Thanks for the comment though!
I have looked at discount hydraulic hose in the past but not lately, I'll check them out and thanks for mentioning it because I'm about ready to order my first 'set' of hoses.

HOSE #1:
I measured out the lengths for the hose going from the power beyond of my 3rd function valve of my FEL to the "IN" of the new valve.

This hose will be coming from the right hose in the first pic (which is the backside of my WR LONG solenoid valve) to the "IN" port in the second pic.
EDIT: I added a better pic (3rd pic)

I'm not sure what to call these fittings when I order my new hose? I know the new valve "IN" port is an SAE 8 port, but is that what I specify to be on one end of the hose when I order it?
I'm not sure what type of fitting is on the other end though, the one that goes into my WR LONG solenoid valve? Can anyone tell what type of fitting it is just based on the first pic?

 

[Piston]

HOSE #2:

I measured this one out as well, and before I order it, I want to make sure I have the routing correct. Since this will be my PB circuit, I will come from the (1st pic) PB port (SAE 10 on this valve) to a QD fitting attached to my ROPS (my two fingers representing the mounting in the second pic). I will need a short piece of hose to complete the circuit when the log splitter is not attached. At least I understand that basic information.

Then I'll come from the PB QD fittings to the 3ph I believe??? This is where I'm not sure, I don't know which port to plumb this hose to in the third pic? I think it's the left port in the pic, which is where (currently) the PB from the FEL 3rd function valve is going to right now. (If my memory serves me correctly)

So I'm assuming I disconnect that hose, put it aside, and plumb my PB hose from my new valve, to that same port?

 

[Piston]

Question about the PB QD fittings....

Is there a 'standard' orientation for the fittings? For instance, I am going to mount the male QD in the PB house to be the 'supply' and I'll mount the female QD to be the 'return'

Is this standard? The reason I was going to do it this way, was because the supply hose for my log splitter has a female QD fitting, the return hose, doesn't have any fitting whatsoever, it's just an open hose that on the last tractor, we shoved into the reservoir. I want to add a fitting and do it right this time.



Regarding the QD fittings for the rear remotes, are all of the QD fittings supposed to be female QD?


Here are a couple shots of the log splitter for reference. The hose is 1/2" Does that mean I need 1/2" QD fittings?

 

[J_J]

The system on the tractor is an open center system, and fluid needs to flow through all valves and back to tank unimpeded. Since that valve has a PB outlet, it is never a good idea to install a QD off of it. If you unplug a hose by mistake, something will burst. If it is not connected properly, same thing.

 

[Piston]

Im planning on using the QD from the PB for my log splitter, as I understand it, I will have to turn off the tractor each time I disconnect/reconnect one of these fittings?

I rarely use the log splitter and don't believe I'll have a problem remembering to turn the tractor off when hooking it up. Of course I say this now, and most likely I'll end up with hydraulic fluid everywhere hahah

Since I've already bought the valve I think I have to stick to my original plan right?
I do have detent in two spools but it is for float. Is that different than a valve detent I would use to power a splitter?

 

[J_J]

What you do after connecting the log splitter, and starting the engine, is then bungee one of the levers in a position to pass fluid to the IN port of the log splitter valve, which has it's own detent in the reverse position. You might be able to find a detent kit to hold the spool in say, fwd or rev. The OUT port of the log splitter valve comes back to the other work port. Make sure you know which work port on the detent valve will pass the pump fluid to the log splitter valve.

Use 1/2 in QD's, and mark them as pressure and return. Your QD's may be able to connect under pressure, check out the specs.

If you are using the 4 spool for the supply for the log splitter, you will not need the jumper hose. All the work ports on the 4 spool valve have no fluid going through them until you activate the levers.
The fluid goes in the IN port and exits the PB port to the next valve. The 4 levers determine which work ports have fluid. The OUT port will go to tank.

Your path should be something like this, Pump, FEL, new 4 spool valve, to 3pt.

Do not connect the log splitter to the PB port. The supply for your log splitter valve will come from the work port on one of the spools.

A hyd test gage will help you set all this up.

I believe this is the 3 position detent you need, and can be installed on one of the spools.

From Surplus, the 3 position detent is SVW1BB1
$81.95

This number is from the web site below
170058

3 pos detent kit $31.05

http://www.cylinderservices.net/catalog.asp?prodid=654090

All ports SAE #8 (3/4-16 O-ring thread). except OUT port, SAE #10

 

[J_J]

Piston,

It would only be common sense to set up the hyd path as I suggested. If the valves are set up correctly, there is no reason to install a QD in the PB line . It is not smart to do so. Once the flow path is set, as from pump to FEL, with a diverter in the FEL circuit, the PB out would connect to the new valve, and the PB out from the new valve would connect to the 3pt. Then install 8 QD on the back of the valve for the attachments, and not be concerned with the PB. The outlet of the new valve will provide the log splitter with the flow, and the whole setup will be neat and tidy. If it were mine, I would order the 3 pos detent, just for the log splitter. Your new valve will have relief on it, and should be set equal to or below the FEL PRV settings.

It is also not smart to be unplugging the 4 spool valve in and out of the hyd circuit using QD's.

The factory would never set up the remotes the way Kennyd suggested.

It is your machine and your parts, so use any advice you like.

Kennyd,

Keep on ignoring and reading my post, and you might learn something.

To suggest your way is better, and the only way and stick with me, etc, is just ignorant and makes me want to barf.

 

[Piston]

J.J.
Would you please edit your post and delete the last section? I would really appreciate it.


I'm posting all these questions to get different opinions and help me understand how things work, how they go together, and what I need to make them work.
I really appreciate everyones input.

That being said, I do like the idea of a detent valve to run the splitter but don't like the idea of a bungee cord, it sounds sorta halfassed doing it that way.

If I could buy just the detent kit to add to one of my existing spools then I would really be interested in that? Any idea if that is an option or would I need to buy a 5th spool? I'd rather not spend the money on a 5th spool right now because I need to put some cash towards hoses and fittings.

Just to clarify, all my QD fittings should be the female type right?

 

[hill]

Now you've got me a little messed up, J.J.

I'm reading this one with interest for obvious reasons and this about not using QC on workports brings me to ask: Isn't the 'open center' feature of many multi-spool valves designed to allow fluid to flow through a valve when the ports are closed - the handle is centered? If so, wouldn't that mean that there is no flow through a centered or inactive set of workports and that any set can be plugged off, not connected, while still allowing the use of remaining spools normally?

If other words, if I have a four spool valve with one set of ports reserved for future use, or capped with QD connectors acting as plugs when that set of ports is not used (as in the splitter application by Piston) wouldn't fluid pressure still flow normally through the valve center until I manually routed it to a TnT cylinder or other device?

Why would capping one or more set of workports, whether by plug or by QD risk damage by built up pressure without return relief?

I'm probably reading you wrong, I hope, and if so, my apologies. But I had to ask.

 

[J_J]

hill,

You are correct, if not using a valve spool, just plug it, or install QD's. If all the levers are in neutral, fluid is flowing through the valve to the next valve. Say you have the lever bungeed open so the log splitter will work. The fluid is flowing through one of the QD's to the log splitter valve and back to the other QD. Say you disconnect the return hose from the log splitter. The pump goes to max pressure, and relief valves will go off. If the reliefs can not handle about 6 to 9 GPM, a valve or hose or pump may explode. You have blocked all flow by popping the QD loose.

I did not say not to use QD's on work ports. They are used this way quite often.

If you have a 3 position detent valve with a QD on it, and nothing connected, you also run the risk, but you will hear the relief going and you know you did something wrong.

A QD on the PB hose is even worse if it is blocked. Any thing before it can be damaged.

I hope I have covered all your concerns.