A newbies DIY solar install

[jk96]

Time for another project. This one is a new solar install for the house. Figured I would document my experience and hopefully get some help/advice along the way and maybe help someone else considering a diy solar install. We've had solar on our business for 8 years and has done great and figured it's time to look at doing it for the home.

System will be grid tied. I started out thinking I would do a turn-key install. Recieved 3 proposals, with the best but all close coming in at $52k or $38,500 after tax rebate. That put my ROI at about 9 years based on output and current electric bill and not factoring any repairs. After looking at the numbers I decided to price out a similar self install kit for comparison and was shocked at the price difference. $20,009 shipped to my door or $14,800 after tax rebate so self install it is. Kit includes everything needed other than the 3" pipe for the iron ridge ground mount and any knowledge of what I'm doing on my end but I figure for $23k I can figure it out. Payoff should be less than 4 years if it covers as much of my electric bill as expected.

System details:
25kw system
2 - Fronius Primos 12.5 investors
60 - Trina Solar 410 watt panels
Iron ridge racking systems

Currently working on the application and approval with our electric coop before making the purchase and will update as this project moves forward.

Jeremy

 

[LS Tractor Owner]

Anxiously awaiting your progress report. I have been contemplating solar for a few years, but it was always too expensive to pull the trigger. Good luck!

 

[RalphVa]

You get payment from your utility there for power sent to the grid? Here with Dominion Power (monopoly) here in central Va, we don't. Get credit for any overproduction at the end of the month but not if it exceeds our bill (won't. Ours is only 2 or 2.5 kw: don't recall.) They basically won't let you install a system bigger than your average usage. Yours is about 10 times that.

 

[bunyip]

Those prices!!!!!!
We were going to put up 10kw that would have been AU$8800 but after looking at usage went 6.6kw for AU$3800 with state and federal rebates.

 

[techman]

I put in my solar system DIY in the fall of 2011. It is a ground mount, 40 panels, 9.2 KW, using a single 10KW grid tie inverter. My costs were a bit 0ver $ 30,000. In received state and federal credits/incentives equaling $ 20,000, so $ 10,000 out of pocket. My break-even was at 6.5 years and today I am $ 16,700 to the positive. That includes the cost of saved (or generated in reality) power and solar credits (SREC Trade). The solar credits average $ 25/MWH (about 1 month's worth).

When I put my system in the panel price was $ 1.93/watt for the 230 watt panels. Today you can get panels near $ 1/watt so costs are lower today for a new install. I was limited to a max of $ 10KW by the local utility. Anything greater would put me into a generation classification and my generated power would be considerably lower than the net metering I have (they have since raised the limit to 20 KW).

Overall I would absolutely do it again. My average electric bill is $ 100/month averaged over the year. I have a 2800 sq ft all electric house with 4 adults (3 home most days while I work). All utilities are electric, including 2 refrigerators, freezer, computers, several TVs, pool, etc.

Paul

 

[Jchonline]

Time for another project. This one is a new solar install for the house. Figured I would document my experience and hopefully get some help/advice along the way and maybe help someone else considering a diy solar install. We've had solar on our business for 8 years and has done great and figured it's time to look at doing it for the home.

System will be grid tied. I started out thinking I would do a turn-key install. Recieved 3 proposals, with the best but all close coming in at $52k or $38,500 after tax rebate. That put my ROI at about 9 years based on output and current electric bill and not factoring any repairs. After looking at the numbers I decided to price out a similar self install kit for comparison and was shocked at the price difference. $20,009 shipped to my door or $14,800 after tax rebate so self install it is. Kit includes everything needed other than the 3" pipe for the iron ridge ground mount and any knowledge of what I'm doing on my end but I figure for $23k I can figure it out. Payoff should be less than 4 years if it covers as much of my electric bill as expected.

System details:
25kw system
2 - Fronius Primos 12.5 investors
60 - Trina Solar 410 watt panels
Iron ridge racking systems

Currently working on the application and approval with our electric coop before making the purchase and will update as this project moves forward.

Jeremy

Why so many panels? I doubt you are pulling 2-4kw/h peak from the house during the day Unless you are running a factory! Is insolation that poor in your area that you need that much gathering capability? IMO it would have been better to invest in a battery system for grid down backup.

That said, it sounds like a great project and I am interested to see how it tracks! I have an off grid place on 8kw panels, Outback radian 8KVa inverter about 32 kWh battery bank. All solar projects are great to hear about!

 

[orezok]

I did a ground mount self install last spring on a 5200 watt system. My cost before rebate was about $14k before rebate ($3600). So far I have not has any power charges for the last 9 months just $12 to $14 per month for "connection" charges. That is amazing as my summer time electric here in the desert can run $300 to $400 per month. It also looks like I will be getting a rebate on my yearly anniversary, but I don't know how much yet. SCE has TOU when you go solar but it is a true net metering. Basically they pay/charge $.27 per Kw from 9PM to 5 PM the next day but charge $.43 from 5 PM to 9PM which of course are peak usage hours for a residence. Not bad for a 2,400 SF house and 1,500 SF shop. Today I generated over 38 kWh.

I got quotes for the same system from several suppliers and the cost was $27K before rebate. Contractor installed solar is a racket.

 

[jk96]

You get payment from your utility there for power sent to the grid? Here with Dominion Power (monopoly) here in central Va, we don't. Get credit for any overproduction at the end of the month but not if it exceeds our bill (won't. Ours is only 2 or 2.5 kw: don't recall.) They basically won't let you install a system bigger than your average usage. Yours is about 10 times that.

We get the utility fuel cost for not making what we produce in excess. About .03/kwh.

 

[jk96]

When I put my system in the panel price was $ 1.93/watt for the 230 watt panels. Today you can get panels near $ 1/watt so costs are lower today for a new install.

Paul

My bid for the Trina Solar 410watt panels came in at $184 per panel for 410 watt panels or .45/watt. Should end up at just under .75/watt for entire system install. Panels have come a long way as well. Just looked at my building on Google earth to count the panels on that 25kw system installed 8 or 9 years ago and counted 100 panels.

 

[jk96]

Why so many panels? I doubt you are pulling 2-4kw/h peak from the house during the day Unless you are running a factory! Is insolation that poor in your area that you need that much gathering capability? IMO it would have been better to invest in a battery system for grid down backup.

Big houses have big electric bills. 4,500 sq/ft finished space, 2 fridges, 2 freezers, 3 kids, washer/dryer that runs non stop, etc etc. System will cover all summer usage and with summer credits may cover winter as well. Even in the swing months when air/heat is not used I average about 65 kwh/day

 

[Jchonline]

Interesting my house is 4800 sq ft 4 ppl and we run about 35 kw a day in the summer. Well since you are grid tied it can just be sold back, but you will be doing them a huge favor!

 

[RalphVa]

We get the utility fuel cost for not making what we produce in excess. About .03/kwh.

Guess panel costs are WAY down from when we put ours in around 5 years ago. No way could we have paid out such a large project with that little bit of credit.

 

[RalphVa]

Big houses have big electric bills. 4,500 sq/ft finished space, 2 fridges, 2 freezers, 3 kids, washer/dryer that runs non stop, etc etc. System will cover all summer usage and with summer credits may cover winter as well. Even in the swing months when air/heat is not used I average about 65 kwh/day

Our house is around this size, and our average kw usage is short of 2.5 kw. Only the 2 of us though, and we run thermostats about 74 F in summer and about 64 F in winter. Have 2 fridges, 2 freezers, big ice maker that uses as much as a frig, washer/dryer. 4 ton main heat pump, 2 ton upstairs heat pump and 2 ductless units for the basement.

 

[beowulf]

I asked the solar installers I got bids from what percentage of their bid was for the equipment and what percentage was for installation. I was told that 40% of the cost was for installation. So, I contemplated doing it myself as the total bid was $29,200 and I checked it all out and figured I would be able to handle it, and there are companies catering to DIY solar installers. But I changed my mind when I was told that the equipment would not be warranted if I did it myself. So, I had it installed. Also, this was done when the tax credit was 30% on the total cost. If I did it myself I would have only received the tax credit on the equipment cost - so that was another reason I had it done.

 

[Industrial Toys]

My criteria would be to have a system without integrated inverters in the panels, so YOU could use the power if needed in an outage. Maybe not immediately, but having the possibility there. Being able to tap into the DC from the panels.

 

[jk96]

My criteria would be to have a system without integrated inverters in the panels, so YOU could use the power if needed in an outage. Maybe not immediately, but having the possibility there. Being able to tap into the DC from the panels.

In the last 6 years here I can't remember more than 3 or 4 outages with the longest being this winter for maybe 3 hours so usage during an outage just isn't a factor for me.

Oh and the 30 seconds our lights flashed on and off when the house was struck by lightning and it grounded out in the walkout garage through the hvac unit. That was fun.

 

[jk96]

Our house is around this size, and our average kw usage is short of 2.5 kw. Only the 2 of us though, and we run thermostats about 74 F in summer and about 64 F in winter. Have 2 fridges, 2 freezers, big ice maker that uses as much as a frig, washer/dryer. 4 ton main heat pump, 2 ton upstairs heat pump and 2 ductless units for the basement.

2.5 Kilowatt hours? Per hour?

 

[jk96]

Currently working through the application for our electric coop for the approval to grid tie the solar before I finalize the purchase. One question I have for those who have done a ground mount system before is the location of the invertors and auto shutdown box? Did yours go at the panels or house? For my installation it looks like the sequence would be panels to rapid/auto shutdown box to invertors to manual disconnect to utility. Panel location is about 540 feet from the house and invertors are outdoor rated. With that said would it be better to locate the invertors & shutdown box indoors for better efficiency out of the heat? My electrical service enters the house into a utility room in the basement where my electrical panel is located. Just thinking it may be best to also place the shutdown modules and two invertors on the basement wall as well as opposed to outdoors on the house. Would make for a cleaner install as well without all of the components on the outside of the house.

 

[bmaverick]

My criteria would be to have a system without integrated inverters in the panels, so YOU could use the power if needed in an outage. Maybe not immediately, but having the possibility there. Being able to tap into the DC from the panels.

And that's how I'm setup. Power goes out, got enough juice to run the 230V well-pump down 200Ft.

My panels put out 24VDC. Thus, it's easy to branch the battery bank to charge 12VDC series batteries in pairs, and then use another tap to be dedicated as 12VDC. From 24VDC, it's easier to reach 230V.

I made this some time back. For 24VDC charging and 12VDC access when the power is out. The Renology charge controller does Lithium Iron batteries too!

 

[ponytug]

Going 540', I would consider upsizing the conductors to reduce losses, but more than that, I would think about DC.

If you have no shade, you might want to consider running the DC back to the house, and converting it there, if you can arrange your DC to be as high as possible for your inverter input, but below, 600V. (I think that is from a common insulation limit on wires, but there is also an NEC burial limit for depth, as in you have to deeper if at, or over, 1000V.) You will have lower power loss in the transmission. (Loss goes as current squared times resistance, so doubling the voltage quarters your losses) I would check your local codes and AHJ to be sure.

I'm not a solar expert, but that's the advice we were given, and it made sense to me.

YMMV

All the best,

Peter