Stump Pulling with 3-Point - Any concerns?

[LD1]

LD1, that's an interesting response. How is one to gain that experience? Wouldn't it suffice to explain the risks and to suggest an abundance of caution?

I am a tractor newbie myself but I didn't spend $30K to not use the thing. I'm just sayin ...

You gain experience by growing up around such equipment, and being familiar with your equipment to know its limitations. If one is asking these kind of questions, it is apparent that that person lacks the experience to do it safely, regardless of how many suggestions of caution are said.

There is no need to explain the risk in my post, as others have already said....flipping over.

I know my tractors limits. I can skid large logs by using the 3PH and a short chain to lift the log and drag. I know from experience that on level ground, my tractor will break tractor WAY before it flips. HAving the loader up front is a must.

But its not something you learn overnight, and not something for a less than skilled operator to attempt. I can feel IF and when the front gets light. And pulling slow while feathering the clutch. Again, learning my limits AND my tractors limits isnt something I learned overnight. It is from years of experience. And latching onto a stump, is pushing EVERYTHING to the limit ALL AT ONCE. and NOT something I recommend the OP doing.

 

[TomSeller]

LD1, that's an interesting response. How is one to gain that experience? Wouldn't it suffice to explain the risks and to suggest an abundance of caution?

I am a tractor newbie myself but I didn't spend $30K to not use the thing. I'm just sayin ...

Egbert, if you did not get your questions answered, PLEASE let us know. SAFETY is of primary importance. We want everyone going home their family each day without injury. Tractor flips usually kill the operator on older non-ROPS tractors.

 

[Egbert]

Tom, thanks, but I understood completely - basic phyics/logic. I just thought "Don't" was a little lacking in light of the original question and subsequent responses. No problem

 

[TomSeller]

Tom, thanks, but I understood completely - basic phyics/logic. I just thought "Don't" was a little lacking in light of the original question and subsequent responses. No problem

I would agree.

 

[Beltzington]

Thanks all for your interest in my project and my safety, after many hours of seat time I have learned to mitigate the risk of a flip over by counter balancing with family members in the FEL . Good information concerning possible damage to the 3-pt, not something I am interested in breaking so I will stick with the drag-bar and try a shorter chain or just cut the dang things flush with the ground. Take Care All!

 

[ozley]

Thanks all for your interest in my project and my safety, after many hours of seat time I have learned to mitigate the risk of a flip over by counter balancing with family members in the
Good information concerning possible damage to the 3-pt, not something I am interested in breaking so I will stick with the drag-bar and try a shorter chain or just cut the dang things flush with the ground. Take Care All!

I hope you were joking about family members FEL . If not stand back.

 

[FTG-05]

The concern about a full flip over when pulling from your 3 point stems from the elevation your chain is connected at the rear of the tractor. If your chain is lower than the rear axle, the tractor front is pushed down when pulling. If the 3 point is raised higher than the axle, the tractor front is LIFTED when pulling and if you have solid traction, your tractor rear tires keep going and the front flips over backwards.

If you have trouble imaging this, think about hooking a chain to the top of your ROPS or cab. Then hook the other end to a solid immovable object and imagine driving forward with good traction. Your front will raise up, putting even more weight on your rear wheels giving them more traction.. Say you are in full throttle decreasing your reaction ability, your rear tires keep going but the top of your ROPS (or cab) stays still. So the tractor flips over backwards in a heartbeat. It literally is that fast.

I believe the OP was talking about lifting with the 3 point and the tractor front can raise up in that case. Once the 3 point is above the axle combined with going forward is a sure way to flip a tractor backwards on top of the operator.

8N Ford tractor rolls over backwards - YouTube

This tractor pull event had horrible officials that obviously didn't know the basics of this problem.

Here's another horrible example: 1948 Ford Tractor Pulls Out a Stump (The Wrong Way) - YouTube

 

[TomSeller]

Here's another horrible example: 1948 Ford Tractor Pulls Out a Stump (The Wrong Way) - YouTube

He was lucky he didn't have enough torque to flip that tractor. He hooked to the top link probably right after he put the rear tires on backwards.

 

[Egon]

Do a dig with the fell on the tree. Then load the bucket with what're is heavy and available. Hitch up the three point real short on the tee and lift as you slowly go ahead.

Pines are usually shallow rooted.

 

[Mace Canute]

Thanks all for your interest in my project and my safety, after many hours of seat time I have learned to mitigate the risk of a flip over by counter balancing with family members in the FEL . Good information concerning possible damage to the 3-pt, not something I am interested in breaking so I will stick with the drag-bar and try a shorter chain or just cut the dang things flush with the ground. Take Care All!

I suspect one of these girls just might be a candidate for the job of "bucket ballast".

 

[Beltzington]

Not sure I said whose family members Mace, looks like your crew will do.

 

[SPYDERLK]

Past thorough discussions:

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/177413-how-do-you-hook-your.html#post2022311

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/buying-pricing-comparisons/146173-why-4-wheel-drive.html

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/owning-operating/215952-preventing-tractor-back-flip.html

 

[rtgt]

I know my tractors limits. I can skid large logs by using the 3PH and a short chain to lift the log and drag. I know from experience that on level ground, my tractor will break tractor WAY before it flips. HAving the loader up front is a must.

But its not something you learn overnight, and not something for a less than skilled operator to attempt.

Actually you are just as likely to be the one who gets seriously hurt or worse. Everyday trade experts with years of experience are killed. Experience can be a great enabler, right up until you don't have enough.

The OP was smart enough to ask. Pretty good chance that he is also smart enough to understand the cautions and warnings, understand the "don't do's" and the "must do's".

Only thing I would add to the other comments, start small, work your way up in size, take your time. Maybe get some help. From your post I think you have a pretty good handle on common sense. - its your best friend.

Remember take your time, Think before you do, be safe - and have fun with your project.

 

[PhysAssist]

Thanks all for your interest in my project and my safety, after many hours of seat time I have learned to mitigate the risk of a flip over by counter balancing with family members in the FEL . Good information concerning possible damage to the 3-pt, not something I am interested in breaking so I will stick with the drag-bar and try a shorter chain or just cut the dang things flush with the ground. Take Care All!

Hi Mr. B,

Instead of flush cutting, try cutting them off 4-5' off the ground, then hook up a chain from your drawbar (below the axle) to about a foot below the top, this is similar to using the "Paul Bunyon's Hammer" technique in that it gives you a tall lever with the fulcrum down at the ground. We have used our B2320 to push and pull over trees in this manner. I will usually also cut a small groove for the chain to get caught in at the point of attachment to keep the chain from either slipping off of the top end as the trunk comes over, or from falling down before you start your pull.

Happy and safe tractoring,
Thomas

 

[LD1]

Actually you are just as likely to be the one who gets seriously hurt or worse.

I like my odds alot better than a newbie/unskilled operator attaching to the 3PH and trying to pull stumps.

 

[Egon]

I like my odds alot better than a newbie/unskilled operator attaching to the 3PH and trying to pull stumps.

Getting the extra weight on the back sure helps in the traction department.

 

[LD1]

Getting the extra weight on the back sure helps in the traction department.

 

[rtgt]

I like my odds alot better than a newbie/unskilled operator attaching to the 3PH and trying to pull stumps.

Not disputing that.

My point was to say is who are you to judge the experience / ability of someone you have never met? Answer his question - can this be done. Give him the whole answer including the warnings and cautions. You cannot gain experience if you never try. Very few have the opportunity to grow up around tractors and farms, however there are a lot of people with small tractors nowdays.

I applaud those that have the sense to ask questions first. That is one of the reasons for websites like this.

If the answer is simply "don't do this - it's too dangerous" then that is the answer, period. If it is dangerous, experience doesn't matter. It just means that you knew it was dangerous BEFORE you did it.

Granted there are many cases where experienced operators can do more than a novice. In some cases the best answer is "go find someone with experience doing this to help you".

Stump pulling is something that a lot of folks are going to do. SHARE YOUR EXPERIENCE. Here is what to do and this is what not to do. The rest is up to the individual. My belief is that if someone is smart enough to seek the advice of others, they are usually smart enough to follow it - proivided that they are given the whole answer.

Experience & confidence get people hurt just as much as the lack of it does - its up to the smarts of the individual. How many times has someone said "I don't know why Joe got killed doing that - he knew better....".

You apparently didn't like my comment that challenged your ability. I would submit that the OP might have felt the same.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[LD1]

My point was to say is who are you to judge the experience / ability of someone you have never met?

I can judge whoever I want and however I want. That is why it is MY opinion. And regardless of experience, I would NEVER recommend ANYONE, on here or in the real world, to attempt to pull stumps with the 3PH. It is dangerous. Yes I do it. I know it is dangerous. THATS why I dont suggest anyone else do it.

Answer his question - can this be done. Give him the whole answer including the warnings and cautions.

I did answer his question. Why does everyone keep saying that I Just said "dont do it...too dangerous". Re-read my post. And re-read the posts prior to it. The whole story was given by more than one other person. There is severe flip-over risk due to the elevated hitch, and added traction. I dont know what else to add???? If you want me to add words of caution, and suggestions on how to do it without flipping over, simple....pull from the drawbar. I am NOT about to advise someone how to pull from the 3PH. There are lots of things going on, and lots to go wrong. The last thing I want is someone going out there, following my advise, and end up dead under their tractor.

So quite simply, the warning and caution is, DONT DO IT. And the advise is PULL FROM THE FIXED DRAWBAR.

Now if the OP decides to do it anyway, thats his call. But it wont be because I advised him it was ok if you do this, and do that, and go slow, etc......