woodmaxx flail mower?

[blb078]

I did a lot of research on flail mowers before buying my Caroni. I called the Woodmax dealer and he was knowledgeable to a degree. I asked him why I should buy a Woodmax instead of Caroni. He stated he didnt know that brand . Had not heard of it. My point is he is not very up on the flail mower business. I was quite a bit surprised. He stated the mower was designed in America and made in China. China being an unscrupulous trading partner to start with, it was no problem choosing Caroni.
Greg

I wouldn't hold it against the guy for not knowing about Caroni. If it's a typical lawn and farm store then he's got dozen's of implements, maybe even tractors, zero turns, riding, and various other equipment to sell. So not knowing about a brand on something that isn't that popular in the U.S. to begin with isn't a knock imo. Can only ask that he knows his own products. American design and Chinese made isn't to bad. I've accepted that most stuff now days is going to be from Asia. As long as the QC is there that is the big thing. American and Euro companies have bad runs of products just like you would out of Asia, the biggest difference is that they are caught in QC and never make it to retail, which can't be said for China or other Asian products. I wonder if they QC them back once they back here, that would nice. Will look forward to what sidecarist has to say about his as I was looking at the 78 or next one up.

 

[gregharr55]

It is still an unknown quantity . With known good brands why take a chance. Just did not make sense to me. To be honest I realize that just because I own one does not make me an expert. And u r correct he might know all brands. Hadnt thought of in that direction. I am a little narrow minded!
Thanks
Greg

 

[sidecarist]

I'll admit I'm a bit budget minded. I have a full machine/welding shop and feel comfortable with repairing maintaining most equipment as needed. I thought hard about the caroni, but for my uses I wanted the rear trash door for mowing thick brush. To get that feature I'd have to go with a land pride or maschio (sp?) at about 4x the money.

For me it is a combination of features and price. I'll look it over very carefully and if I don't like what I see I'll work with woodmaxx to resolve it or return it. While the flails don't have much history, they have a pretty good history with the chippers. I talked to a very satisfied chipper owner that praised the customer service at woodmaxx.

I'll let you all know my thoughts after it arrives.

 

[gregharr55]

We r waiting to hear. Good luck with it. Looking at the rotor and knives I didn't get the impression it would be any better than others. For heavy brush Rears brand can be set up for heavy brush. I know I wouldn't be happy with the bargain units for the heavy work. Just my mostly newbie opinion based on months of research. Happy cuttin and good luck!
Greg

 

[DieselBound]

sidecarist, thanks for posting here. I look forward to hearing what you think. As you note, I'm also not able to pay 4x for something that is "popular." I require side shift, and that's an option that really adds to the price of a flail mower. I contacted the vendor (they are the manufacturers of the #1 wood chipper in the US) and they were very prompt in their responses: I asked about the low scraper blade and they replied that all scraper blades tend to gunk up- it's located there in order to allow the rear access door.

At one point EVERY product was a new introduction. People have been lambasting up-starts since time began. If no one ever bought a product from a new company (or new to a given market) we wouldn't have any products. I recall back in the 70s everyone bad-mouthing the Japanese. And here we are, lots of folks here (I raise my hand) with Kubotas.

And let's be real here, most folks aren't buying flail mower to do heavy brush (that's what rotary mowers are for). Most flail mowers aren't heavy duty anyway.

I recently imported some palletized wire crates from mainland China. Shipping and import costs were more than the product itself; but, even so the pricing still came in at about 1/2 of what I could purchase here in the US through some vendor/retailer (who is probably buying from China anyway). So far I've used 80% of the crates and have a defect rate of 0.6% (and that doesn't make the one piece unusable).

 

[blb078]

I'm curious how this will do on just a regular large yard cutting grass and medium duty. I'm not worried about heavy duty, how will it handle my yard and some other things I get into. Now I'm not looking for my yard to look like Augusta National or anything but I want it to be nice at the least. If this device can do that and take care of some other medium work along with the hydraulic side shift it has and sidecarist doesn't come back with a horrible review on it then I'll have to strongly consider it.

 

[sidecarist]

Well, I'll let you know. I have abut 3/4acre of very dense white clover tat my ZT mower deck clogs with. I've let it go for a bit just to see how the flail does.

A big reason for me buying a flail is that I intend to plant rotating crops for our honey bees. Buckwheat, clover, alfalfa, etc. Along with a 2 acre wild flower medow. All of these will need to be mowed to about 1.5in and a finer mulch cut is desirable. Some of these crops are so wet as to be difficult to cut in one pass. I'll cut them down with the rear door open, then recut a few days later when they have dried a bit.

That's the plan at least...

 

[IslandTractor]

I wouldn't worry about a Chinese built flail or an American designed flail. The problem with crappy stuff from China these days is that the American marketing companies specify cheap over quality. Woodmaxx has a good reputation with chippers and I doubt they would risk that or follow a HF strategy in bringing out a flail line.

That said, I still think under $2000 for a Caroni 75" rough cut flail is a bargain. I've had mine for ten mowing seasons now and except for replacing lost knives and a couple of belt changed I've had no issues.

 

[sidecarist]

To match what I have ordered would be a few hundred dollars more and it wouldn't have the rear door I wanted. That bit of extra money bought me a full set of extra knives and some other spare parts.

In the end I've ordered it and will let everyone know my thoughts after I see it/use it. I have nothing invested in the brand, or any other. My thoughts are that will it match a $10,000 unit? Probably not. Will it meet my needs as a hobby farmer? Probably. We will see.

 

[IslandTractor]

I just checked out the Woodmaxx website. Looks like nice equipment. A few differences in design from the Caroni TM1900 I have but their 78" model seems most comparable.

It has, as noted, a trash door. I've never felt a need for a trash door but I do tend to use my bush hog for really rough cutting of material like seven or eight foot high bushes and taller saplings. I have cut those with the Caroni and noted no issues but as those areas clearly have not been cut in years I prefer to use the bush hog in case I discover more old car parts etc. Tired of unwrapping car parts from the flail.

I also see that it has the PTO slip clutch. As discussed earlier, I don't know if I've ever seen a flail with a slip clutch before. The belts serve essentially the same purpose. I have a slip clutch on my bush hog that I dislike mostly because I use it infrequently and therefore need to spend 45 minutes each time to adjust the thing.

The flail knives are very sturdy looking but are directly mounted to the rotor rather than through a clevis. This will cut down on blade loss due to clevis failure but also removes an extra element of "protection" as the knives cannot pivot sideways when they hit a rock or stump etc.

I don't see an adjustable side offset on the FM78. Maybe it just isn't apparent. The Caroni has two obvious positions to setup the 3PT attachment mounts which give up to about 15-18" of offset to the the right. Useful when mowing near trees or ditches or fences.

I'm a bit surprised at the pricing. Maybe it is just the list prices but the model that is closest to the Caroni TM1900 is four hundred bucks or more extra. FM-78 Flail Mower | Tractor Flail Mower | PTO Mower Attachment | -WoodMaxx兌/url]

 

[blb078]

Does the Caroni have a hydraulic slide option? I think that's what most people are liking about the woodsmaxx is that it has that at a reasonable price.

 

[DieselBound]

Island, really appreciate your input. Wondering whether the PTO shaft can be swapped out for one with a shear bolt? (I've only got a shear bolt on my rotary cutter and would kind of like to have the clutch instead, I think). Can one retrofit clevises? What knives are you running on your Caroni (and why)?

As blb078 notes, the hydraulic side shift is a/the big draw.

 

[Fallon]

As long as they are the right length, right rating & have the right connectors, you can swap PTO shafts.

However a PTO for a rotary cutter will be way longer than for a flail.

A gearbox designed for a sheer pin will be round with a groove for a keeper pin so the PTO can spin but not fall off when the pin sheers. A gearbox designed for a clutch or nothing (like my old Ford 917 flail) will be splined. The replacement PTO shaft for my flail has a funky sheer pin in it but still connects to the spliced gearbox. It's a generic PTO shaft & I didn't care if it had the sheer pin on it because of the belts.

Generally unless you sheer bolts much, a sheer bolt is better. On my tiller every spring I have to spend half an hour loosening up the clutch bolts, spinning it to make sure it isn't rusted solid, then tighten everything back up. I was upset when I found my rotary cutter had a pin instead a clutch. However I have never sheared a pin or done a dam thing to it other than grease it (and pull off a shield to adjust the clutch only to find the pin instead of clutch).

 

[IslandTractor]

Does the Caroni have a hydraulic slide option? I think that's what most people are liking about the woodsmaxx is that it has that at a reasonable price.

Yes, there is a hydraulic kit for the TM1900. I never considered it myself but I believe it goes for something under $500 and can be purchased through AgriSupply.

For occasional use, it only takes about fifteen minutes to move the fixed mounts to the other offset position. Just takes a wrench or two.

 

[IslandTractor]

Island, really appreciate your input. Wondering whether the PTO shaft can be swapped out for one with a shear bolt? (I've only got a shear bolt on my rotary cutter and would kind of like to have the clutch instead, I think). Can one retrofit clevises? What knives are you running on your Caroni (and why)?

As blb078 notes, the hydraulic side shift is a/the big draw.

Fallon already answered the first part and I agree with his note. Regarding adding clevises, I suppose it could be done though it would significantly affect the cutting height. You'd still be able to adjust cutting height but depending on geometry you might be limited to fairly close cuts as the clevis would add and inch and a half or so to the swing. If I had the Woodmaxx I wouldn't do it unless experience showed me I needed the clevises.

 

[DieselBound]

As long as they are the right length, right rating & have the right connectors, you can swap PTO shafts.

However a PTO for a rotary cutter will be way longer than for a flail.

A gearbox designed for a sheer pin will be round with a groove for a keeper pin so the PTO can spin but not fall off when the pin sheers. A gearbox designed for a clutch or nothing (like my old Ford 917 flail) will be splined. The replacement PTO shaft for my flail has a funky sheer pin in it but still connects to the spliced gearbox. It's a generic PTO shaft & I didn't care if it had the sheer pin on it because of the belts.

Generally unless you sheer bolts much, a sheer bolt is better. On my tiller every spring I have to spend half an hour loosening up the clutch bolts, spinning it to make sure it isn't rusted solid, then tighten everything back up. I was upset when I found my rotary cutter had a pin instead a clutch. However I have never sheared a pin or done a dam thing to it other than grease it (and pull off a shield to adjust the clutch only to find the pin instead of clutch).

Mouth engaged before brain... I didn't stop to think about the necessary differences in PTO shaft length (duh!).

I've only sheared three bolts in nearing 6 years now. Tractor still seems to operate correctly, so I figure that shear bolts work!

Wondering whether one can forgo adjusting a slip clutch if the belts pretty much do the job of absorbing excess shock.

 

[DieselBound]

Yes, there is a hydraulic kit for the TM1900. I never considered it myself but I believe it goes for something under $500 and can be purchased through AgriSupply.

For occasional use, it only takes about fifteen minutes to move the fixed mounts to the other offset position. Just takes a wrench or two.

For my use the hydraulic side shift is pretty much necessary. I'm running around a lot of trees and having the ability to slide back as I pass them and then put the mower back out will mean a lot less swerving around with the tractor and mower (and now going to a bigger tractor the swerving won't be like it is with my nimble B7800). And then I've got ditches here and there, so if I were to have the mower shifted one way I'd end up hoping off and manually adjusting quite a bit: some ditches are only a couple hundred feet or so.

Just making comments so that others can understand the rational. Clearly, if these conditions don't apply to others then they need not be so concerned with a hydraulic side shift ($500 is a chunk of change that could be applied toward another implement- I am real cautious about how I spend my money; some folks more so, others less so).

 

[IslandTractor]

For my use the hydraulic side shift is pretty much necessary. I'm running around a lot of trees and having the ability to slide back as I pass them and then put the mower back out will mean a lot less swerving around with the tractor and mower (and now going to a bigger tractor the swerving won't be like it is with my nimble B7800). And then I've got ditches here and there, so if I were to have the mower shifted one way I'd end up hoping off and manually adjusting quite a bit: some ditches are only a couple hundred feet or so. Just making comments so that others can understand the rational. Clearly, if these conditions don't apply to others then they need not be so concerned with a hydraulic side shift ($500 is a chunk of change that could be applied toward another implement- I am real cautious about how I spend my money; some folks more so, others less so).

I also need to mow around trees and against hedgerows though the majority of mowing is in open fields. I find that even with my Caroni set in the "normal" position, that my 3PT has enough lateral adjustment that I can push the mower to the right and have 9-12" of offset. I find that adequate for getting around trees and preventing encroachment by the hedgerows. It also means that when I mow straight lines, I can line the left tire up in previously cut grass tight to the uncut grass and I get a full 75" of cut rather than losing 6+inches each way on overlap. Of course this means I mow in a clockwise racetrack pattern which may not suit everyone but it is efficient.

 

[DieselBound]

I also need to mow around trees and against hedgerows though the majority of mowing is in open fields. I find that even with my Caroni set in the "normal" position, that my 3PT has enough lateral adjustment that I can push the mower to the right and have 9-12" of offset. I find that adequate for getting around trees and preventing encroachment by the hedgerows. It also means that when I mow straight lines, I can line the left tire up in previously cut grass tight to the uncut grass and I get a full 75" of cut rather than losing 6+inches each way on overlap. Of course this means I mow in a clockwise racetrack pattern which may not suit everyone but it is efficient.

You're getting off the tractor to change the 3pt linkage, is this right?

 

[Fallon]

Mouth engaged before brain... I didn't stop to think about the necessary differences in PTO shaft length (duh!).

I've only sheared three bolts in nearing 6 years now. Tractor still seems to operate correctly, so I figure that shear bolts work!

Wondering whether one can forgo adjusting a slip clutch if the belts pretty much do the job of absorbing excess shock.

If your belts are properly set, a slip clutch is useless except when a gearbox seizes. Pretty much every failure I've heard of is the opposite where the gearbox either grenades or stop spinning the output shaft.

Personally I haven't heard of problems resulting in PTO damage. The PTO shaft always pretzels before the PTO gear in the tractor.

Takes what? 10 minutes to replace a sheer bolt? You've spent as much time replacing sheer bolts in 6 years as you'd have spent adjusting clutches every year. Not a bad deal I'd say.