Stainless welding options

[bigdeano]

I have some stainless rods that I use for these projects. They work great. Slag peels right off and the weld bead is super pretty. Almost as easy as using a 7014 rod. Wish I had the number or I'd give it to you.

Sounds like the E308L-16 rods I use to weld 304 stainless.

 

[Gary Fowler]

When I said 316L I was referring to the stock and not so much the wire. I have never seen 304 wire. I thought it started at 308.

Is the higher grade SS more for chemical corrosion than for rust? I work one place and they had a machine made by George Ficsher. It used a chemical to clean the metal with a tungsten and a scrubby. It would even take some of the discoloration out of the welds

You are right in 308 wire is used to match the chemical composition of the 304 grade material in the as-welded condition. Without looking into section IX for the chemical composition again, IIRC the 316 has some Mo. in it and maybe even more nickel than 304 but 304 has more chromium. One tends to forget that stuff after a few years of not having to open a Code book and the CRS syndrome kicks in more frequently as one gets older.

EDIT: Well I had to look it up just to see how my memory was working
316 stainless material and rod is sometimes called 16-12-2 which corresponds to the Chromium, Nickel and Molybdenum content.
304 material is call 18-8 and has no moly in it
308 material used to make the alloy welding rods has 20%Cr. 10 % Ni so it will more closely match the chemical content and coloring of the 304 stainless base metal when welded. When welding a small % of the chromium and nickel will vaporize so electrodes usually do contain a bit more of the base elements.

 

[Jim in ICT]

So much concern for the correct filler metal! Sodo is welding S/S towel holders with S6 wire and C25. No time for all this, just use what ya got. Any bailing wire laying around?
Just kidding.

 

[dragoneggs]

I'm no welder but I do work with metals (structural bonding) and we use 316 vs 304 for marine/offshore applications. The 316L is the industry preferred material over 316 for welding as the carbon content is significantly less providing a less susceptible corrosive material after it is welded. Granted, your railing is probably not going to be subjected to salt spray but long term the 316L is the better choice not taking into account cost/availability. Unfortunately I am tainted with a mechanical engineering degree with a materials emphasis. Just wish that made me a better welder!

 

[Walkin Horse]

You gotta have us weldors. Even engineers need heroes.

 

[Shield Arc]

Just wish that made me a better welder!

Any old CC welder, and a Tig rig with a bottle of argon, and you can weld stainless steel.
TIG Torch SR 17V 25R 150Amp Air Cooled | eBay
HTP Argon CO2 MIG TIG Flow Meter Regulator Welding Weld | eBay

 

[dstig1]

Sodo was making something he didn't care a lot about for a rental. This is the opposite end of the spectrum...

Dragoneggs- gotcha beat on this one - I'm a materials engineer with a mechanical bent... There is no need for 316, and while i'm sure I can find it in filler reasonably, getting it for railing parts will be painful and expensive (I guess expensive is painful, too ) If I find I need to passivate it down the road, I can go back and do that I suppose, but i doubt it will be necessary for this. We are not coastal in Wisc...

I will be using my XMT as the power source for this. I will get a foot pedal for sure, and of course a torch plus argon bottle/flowmeter. I am also going to look for a hi Freq box for it like a Miller 251D. I suspect that will make life a lot easier for not a lot of extra dough, though I have lift-arc capability built into the box already. I will dedicate abrasives to this so i don't get any cross contamination. Odds are that I will not need to do anything other than this project at that time, so odds of messing with plain steel at the same time are low.

SA- good to see you back. Appreciate any advice.

 

[dragoneggs]

Sodo was making something he didn't care a lot about for a rental. This is the opposite end of the spectrum...

Dragoneggs- gotcha beat on this one - I'm a materials engineer with a mechanical bent... There is no need for 316, and while i'm sure I can find it in filler reasonably, getting it for railing parts will be painful and expensive (I guess expensive is painful, too ) If I find I need to passivate it down the road, I can go back and do that I suppose, but i doubt it will be necessary for this. We are not coastal in Wisc...

I will be using my XMT as the power source for this. I will get a foot pedal for sure, and of course a torch plus argon bottle/flowmeter. I am also going to look for a hi Freq box for it like a Miller 251D. I suspect that will make life a lot easier for not a lot of extra dough, though I have lift-arc capability built into the box already. I will dedicate abrasives to this so i don't get any cross contamination. Odds are that I will not need to do anything other than this project at that time, so odds of messing with plain steel at the same time are low.

SA- good to see you back. Appreciate any advice.

Oh I totally agree with you Dave on the need for 316 for this application. Just being ****.

 

[Walkin Horse]

Why are you going to put a hi freq box on there. Does your xmt have ac.

Also on lift arc you have a good chance of breaking the tip off of your tungsten. Practice your scratch starts. Tungsten inclusion isn't a big deal on this but once you shatter it, it tends to booger up faster.

One other thing. Have your tig rig equipped with a gas lense. It gives you better gas distribution. I will post a picture of one later.

 

[Shield Arc]

Here is a picture of a gas lens (bottom), and a Tig rig torch (top).

 

[Walkin Horse]

This is the assembly of a tig rig. The gas lense cup the gas lense the collet the plastic adapter. Throw away the collet body.

Sent from my iPhone using TractorByNet

 

[dstig1]

I am thinking about hi freq to use it for starts on steel/SS instead of lift or scratch and to allow Alum welding if I decide to go that way. It seems like ~$400 for a used Miller 251D would save me a lot of time and aggravation in the long run. My limited TIG experience is all of a part of an evening class at the end of the semester (we had extra time, so the teacher showed more stuff to those of us who actually stuck around). That was a Lincoln unit with hi freq start.

I was planning to get a gas lens setup with a torch. I'm not real worried about the money as this still isn't too bad to do, but I'd rather spend a little extra here and make my life easier in the long run. I have way too much going on with the house build to try and do more things the hard way..

 

[Big Barn]

I am thinking about hi freq to use it for starts on steel/SS instead of lift or scratch and to allow Alum welding if I decide to go that way. It seems like ~$400 for a used Miller 251D would save me a lot of time and aggravation in the long run. My limited TIG experience is all of a part of an evening class at the end of the semester (we had extra time, so the teacher showed more stuff to those of us who actually stuck around). That was a Lincoln unit with hi freq start. I was planning to get a gas lens setup with a torch. I'm not real worried about the money as this still isn't too bad to do, but I'd rather spend a little extra here and make my life easier in the long run. I have way too much going on with the house build to try and do more things the hard way..

The high freq will be nice for your XMT but it won't be much help for aluminum as your power source is DC only.

Terry

 

[dstig1]

The hi freq supplies the AC for Alum when set to continuous vs just starts. At least that is my understanding. Perhaps i am clueless here... wouldn't be the first time...

 

[Big Barn]

The hi freq supplies the AC for Alum when set to continuous vs just starts. At least that is my understanding. Perhaps i am clueless here... wouldn't be the first time...

I may be clueless also. Hopefully someone knowledgeable will shed some light on this. I've hesitated to get one for my XMT as I'm fine with the lift start and using the gas valve on the torch.

Terry

 

[dstig1]

I was also trying to avid the manual valve. I know me. I would forget that any time I had a difficult setup where I needed 4 hands to hold everything. I could also just wire in a gas solenoid into the pedal circuit, I'm sure. But then again there is that time thing... If I can get easier starts, a gas valve, and possibly even AC for alum for some future need, then it makes sense. Somewhat.

 

[Sodo]

So much concern for the correct filler metal! Sodo is welding S/S towel holders with S6 wire and C25. No time for all this, just use what ya got.

haha Git'er done. I'da done it with a hanger and O/A if my MIG wasn't around, but probbly not stick. Wouldn't do a stainless railing on my house with iron.

 

[ThomasH]

The hi freq supplies the AC for Alum when set to continuous vs just starts. At least that is my understanding. Perhaps i am clueless here... wouldn't be the first time...

Unfortunately, that is not true. When you put it on continuous, it keeps the hi-freq on in case you are welding something like expanded metal so it will restart instantly instead of there being a slight delay. The hi-freq is a higher voltage and frequency DC superimposed on the existing DC (20 or so volts) welding voltage.

It is possible to TIG weld aluminum with DC if it is not cast and fairly pure (I did it once), but the results are not strong or pretty as there is no cleaning action and therefore all of the oxides, silica, etc. are inclusions in the weld instead of puddling on the top or being burned off.

That is really the only shortcoming to the Miller XMT welders, they are designed for steel. Mine have been flawless for up to 16 years of use, but I am looking around for a inverter TIG unit for use with aluminum. I will probably end up getting one a Everlast PowerTIG 210+ amp or a Miller Dynasty 200. I want a unit that I can vary the pulse frequency and amplitude, etc, and those units give you excellent control over the arc...

 

[dstig1]

Bummer. Maybe I will just stick with lift-start then. Dunno yet.

 

[Big Barn]

Bummer. Maybe I will just stick with lift-start then. Dunno yet.

Put the $450+ you were planning on spending on the hi freq box towards an AC -DC inverter tig instead.

Terry