Buying Advice Seeking advice for first tractor

[daugen]

Have you checked your pressure? My little L can carry full loads of gravel and dirt...[/QUOTE]

two different dealers have checked the hydraulic pressure. My expectations were apparently unreasonable for what a CUT
would do. I should have bought a utility tractor like a 5 series JD or a M Kubota.

 

[dave3NC]

Everyone,

Thanks for all the feedback! I've read this thread multiple times now trying to soak it all in!! All of your experiences and insight were invaluable today when I visited the Kubota dealer. This dealer has been around since I was a kid so at least 35+ years and they're located in my home town. It was a great visit and I looked at several models. Walked away feeling like the L3301 was a solid choice for what I want to do. The smaller models have me worried that I might outgrow them fairly soon. Going to be visiting several other dealers over the next week to try out some of their products.

I plan to do as much of the maintenance and servicing as I can. One of my first jobs was working in a scrap yard operating cranes and loaders. Did most of the upkeep on those. I was also trained to work on turbines among other things in the Navy. If I hadn't fallen in to an IT job soon after the service, I think I would have kept working as a mechanic in some capacity.

You have two different "needs"... Is this going to be used at home or business?

Teg - I've been woodworking for a few years now and have reached a point where I want to mill my own lumber and that has me considering starting a tree service business. So to answer your question, I would be using the tractor for both but I mainly see it as a business tool.

 

[teg]

L3301 is solid tractor, it's what my L2800 grew up to be Are you going with gear or HST? I would suggest HST, I was a gear guy and got the HST for the wife to drive it... For the work I have done, I can get so more done and not be tired at the end of the day.

View attachment 462846

 

[dave3NC]

The HST was nice, so I'll be going with that unless I need to keep the cost down. Dealer told me that switching to gear would drop price quite a bit.

Also decided last night that I am going to look at used tractors too. Figure I could save a good amount and still get a well equipped CUT if I find a model that's few years old.

 

[teg]

Over the life of a tractor, it would be the worst money you will ever "save". But that's my opinion. If you ever have to sell it, you'll get most of that back.

I wish I spent more time looking for used... it's a good route to go. I've bought all my implements via. Craig's List... I have not seen as many "good" bargains lately but I don't watch like I used to (almost 24/7).

My trick that work all the time, If the price is really good, offer an extra $5 or $10... I bought a 6' blade and a 5' spike roller for $60 (it was listed at $50, he had hundreds of replies, I was very late but said in the title "a I'll pay $60", "a" inserted just in case his e-mail is listed alphabetically.)

 

[AxleHub]

Everyone,

Thanks for all the feedback! I've read this thread multiple times now trying to soak it all in!! All of your experiences and insight were invaluable today when I visited the Kubota dealer. This dealer has been around since I was a kid so at least 35+ years and they're located in my home town. It was a great visit and I looked at several models. Walked away feeling like the L3301 was a solid choice for what I want to do. The smaller models have me worried that I might outgrow them fairly soon. Going to be visiting several other dealers over the next week to try out some of their products.

I plan to do as much of the maintenance and servicing as I can. One of my first jobs was working in a scrap yard operating cranes and loaders. Did most of the upkeep on those. I was also trained to work on turbines among other things in the Navy. If I hadn't fallen in to an IT job soon after the service, I think I would have kept working as a mechanic in some capacity.




Teg - I've been woodworking for a few years now and have reached a point where I want to mill my own lumber and that has me considering starting a tree service business. So to answer your question, I would be using the tractor for both but I mainly see it as a business tool.

Greetings Dave,

I'd like to reverse the normal flow of a thread . . temporarily at least.

As I understand it . . you have 1.2 acres total. Your 1.2 acres is open land except for 4 total trees. I asdume this is lawn/yard. You do woodworking. You like to maybe get a few trees (cut down trees) to use as a source of some wood.

1. Where will a sawmill and these cut down trees go on a 1.2 acre site that is house and lawn?

2. Will you be getting a trailer to accomodate movement of your tractor?

3. Will you be hauling these tree logs . . If so . . With another trailer?

4. How many tree logs will you need per year to support your woodworking needs?

5. A tree service gets a great deal of branches, limbs, and junk trees that are not woodworking useful. What will be done with all of that substantial bulk not useful for woidworking?

6. What will be the purpose and uses of a possible L3301. 33hp compact tractor and implements?

Dave, im asking these questions because the opening post to this thread seems to have changed radically and substantiially in just a short period of time to present . . and I'm trying to understand the considerable changes in direction and your thoughts in this process. Facilities needed for storage . . zoning . . financial implications . . Liabiluty issues . . Insurance and bonding costs . . any employees needed etc. etc.. Just trying to figure out your plan and how your time/use is, as woodworking and selling the products produced from woodworking both take a fair amount of time and tree service and an L3301 and implements take a fair amount of investment in both time and assets.

I'm not judging anything . . but the distance this thread has travelled in changes from your first post is huge in a very short time with no indication of "why" or "how". So I'm asking "why?" and "how?" I'm not saying there is anythin wrong . . I'm saying you haven't shown to readers why your dieection has chanfed so much.

Axlehub

 

[newbury]

<snip>I also do some woodworking and usually keep rough lumber or entire tree trunks around. I may also be starting a tree service in the near future and know there will be times I would save large portions of certain trees for milling.
<snip>
The biggest job will be moving the lumber/logs around since I may need the capacity to lift up to 1000lbs. Also, along with my needs, I have several relatives that would benefit from me having a small tractor with the ability to use attachments.
<snip>

Do not underestimate the weight of a tree if you are going to mill it. A 10' red oak log, average 20" diameter will weigh about 1200 lbs. based on

You don't HAVE TO HAVE a tractor to move a log that size. I've used peavey's and muscle to roll them around on my parking area and load them on my Woodmizer mill. But a tractor sure helps.

As many have written a SCUT will be on the small side to handle the larger logs. A different approach would be to reduce the weight of the log. Now often cutting them shorter is not viable, if you want 8' long lumber you generally need at least 9' lengths. However, a chain saw mill (CSM) could be used to cut the log in half lengthwise. You'll already have the chainsaw. It does take some time to setup and make the cut, but it would also cut your required lift capacity in half

And be aware that it seems many Kubota dealers sell the tractors with the lift capacity set low, so if buying from a dealer get them to set the pressure on the high side of the recommended range.

Good luck -

And what type mill are you looking at?

 

[dave3NC]

Hey Axlehub,

I don't think it's changed, I just shared more of what I was planning and maybe that made it seem like I was changing my goals. To give you a little background, I have a detached 30x40 workshop behind our house and it has a lean-to down one side wrapping around the back. This is where I currently store logs and any rough lumber I have. Once I start to work with any of it, I keep it inside. Right now I have access to trailers to use when I need them, but would purchase my own once I progress to a point where it makes sense to do so. I also have access to chipper to use when needed for all the debris. I don't plan to keep all the logs/lumber for myself. I hope to sell off the stuff I don't want to other local woodworkers.

If I were just looking at a tractor for lawncare and landscaping needs, I would only be looking at SCUT's, but since I know I will need more lifting capacity, I think something larger is better suited.

I may have not been clear about just being in the planning stages at this point. I've been unemployed after being laid off back in 2013. Would have gone back to work but we ended up pregnant and it made the most sense for me to stay at home to take care of the baby. As he is approaching his second birthday, I've started evaluating what I want to do and one thing I've considered for years is having a small tree service business. So at this point, I am just researching all that would be involved. If I go forward, I plan to keep it small, having at most one other worker and being selective in the jobs we take. I don't have to work, but want to do something I enjoy that will put a little money back in the bank.

Does that help clarify what's going on in my head? Sometimes I condense what I have up there and it doesn't translate well when I write it down.

Newbury - No argument about that. Everything I've done up until now has been done with peavy's and muscle. I considered a CSM but was put off by how much time it would take. I also assume you'd go through several chains with just one log. I am looking at the Woodmizers mainly. I've seen one in action and liked what I saw. The LT15 is the one I currently have my eye on.

 

[AxleHub]

Hey Axlehub,

I don't think it's changed, I just shared more of what I was planning and maybe that made it seem like I was changing my goals. To give you a little background, I have a detached 30x40 workshop behind our house and it has a lean-to down one side wrapping around the back. This is where I currently store logs and any rough lumber I have. Once I start to work with any of it, I keep it inside. Right now I have access to trailers to use when I need them, but would purchase my own once I progress to a point where it makes sense to do so. I also have access to chipper to use when needed for all the debris. I don't plan to keep all the logs/lumber for myself. I hope to sell off the stuff I don't want to other local woodworkers.

If I were just looking at a tractor for lawncare and landscaping needs, I would only be looking at SCUT's, but since I know I will need more lifting capacity, I think something larger is better suited.

I may have not been clear about just being in the planning stages at this point. I've been unemployed after being laid off back in 2013. Would have gone back to work but we ended up pregnant and it made the most sense for me to stay at home to take care of the baby. As he is approaching his second birthday, I've started evaluating what I want to do and one thing I've considered for years is having a small tree service business. So at this point, I am just researching all that would be involved. If I go forward, I plan to keep it small, having at most one other worker and being selective in the jobs we take. I don't have to work, but want to do something I enjoy that will put a little money back in the bank.

Does that help clarify what's going on in my head? Sometimes I condense what I have up there and it doesn't translate well when I write it down.

Dave, Ya, this last description plus knowing the size of tractor you're currently considering presents quite a different picture than the original post.

You'd originally mentioned the desire to do landscaping and establish a better lawn. I'm guessing anything about being on the lawn and an L3301 probably won't mix too well as an L3301 is just under 2800 lbs without including loading of tires or weight of a fel. My lot my house is on is 1.3 acres so if you have a house, a 30x40 shop and a big lean-to behind that plus a storage area for your tractor and implements and a trailer . . I assume the lawn size won't be that big anywa on what is left.


And if you're going to mill lumber for other woodworkers . . Do you have a way to kiln dry it also ?

What types of trees do you have available. I assume white and red oak, ash, maple, elm . . . maybe some smaller trees like Walnut and butternut or alder and birch ?

I assume you don't have ginko or Hackberry or catawba . . All which make very intetesting patterns.

 

[dave3NC]

Sorry for the confusion there. I was trying to be concise in the OP, but looking back I guess more detail up front would have been best.

I certainly don't need something like the 3301 for general lawn care, but we are planning do to some landscaping and a small tractor will be very helpful during that process. A SCUT would do nicely, but would be lacking for what I would be doing with the trees.

No kiln, everything I've done to date and plan to do is air dried. Most of those trees are in the area, but a few can be rare or up in the mountains. I have a contact though that has a tree service and he has always just thrown the trees out, but I've asked him to let me know we he comes across trees that are worth milling. My folks also have some land about 20 minutes from me where we can store trees and lumber if needed.

 

[Gary Fowler]

I think the size you have settled on is an excellent choice for what you are doing. You will likely eventually find that a dedicated lawn mower is the way to go for your grass mowing needs. I prefer Zero Turn mowers but tractor type are great if you don't have a lot of stuff to mow around.

 

[dave3NC]

I think you're right Gary. Especially once we have the landscaping/hardscaping done as there will be quite a bit less yard to maintain.

 

[dickfoster]

I think you're right Gary. Especially once we have the landscaping/hardscaping done as there will be quite a bit less yard to maintain.

I'm sure you'll be happy with the tractor as long as the dealer is a good one that you know and trust. I take it that you shopped around and drove all sorts of brands and models that were close to what you were looking for. It never hurts getting a bit more than it does getting a little too little.

 

[AxleHub]

Sorry for the confusion there. I was trying to be concise in the OP, but looking back I guess more detail up front would have been best.

I certainly don't need something like the 3301 for general lawn care, but we are planning do to some landscaping and a small tractor will be very helpful during that process. A SCUT would do nicely, but would be lacking for what I would be doing with the trees.

No kiln, everything I've done to date and plan to do is air dried. Most of those trees are in the area, but a few can be rare or up in the mountains. I have a contact though that has a tree service and he has always just thrown the trees out, but I've asked him to let me know we he comes across trees that are worth milling. My folks also have some land about 20 minutes from me where we can store trees and lumber if needed.

The othet 20 acres makes a lot more sense because air drying and the time and rigidity required would take a lot of space to bevdoing resale of product.

Sounds like you've got a lot in the hopper . . and I got a real different view when you mentioned you really didn't have to work and that you'd been working on this for 2 years. Too often people jump inro a business idea with little financial or experience support. Sounds like you're in good shape

 

[dave3NC]

I'm sure you'll be happy with the tractor as long as the dealer is a good one that you know and trust. I take it that you shopped around and drove all sorts of brands and models that were close to what you were looking for. It never hurts getting a bit more than it does getting a little too little.

I've been to two so far and have 2 or 3 more to go to. I wanted to check out LS tractors, but they're about 1.5 hours away so I think I won't be going there.

 

[dave3NC]

The othet 20 acres makes a lot more sense because air drying and the time and rigidity required would take a lot of space to bevdoing resale of product.

Sounds like you've got a lot in the hopper . . and I got a real different view when you mentioned you really didn't have to work and that you'd been working on this for 2 years. Too often people jump inro a business idea with little financial or experience support. Sounds like you're in good shape

Thanks! Yeah, I guess I don't consider it work if no one is paying me! :laughing:

 

[Bloomj]

My two cents, after making my first tractor purchase this month:

1) I have 4 acres and plan to do general upkeep and adding landscaping (we didn't do much when we built the house)
2) I didn't want to get something so small that for a few more $ i could have significantly increased my capabilities.
3) I didn't consider mmm's because I already own a scag zero turn mower.
4) I shopped and researched like crazy and here is what it boiled down to for me:
5) Mihindra was more expensive than JD (maybe slightly more capable size for size)


The Kubota BX is probably the most capable and durable of the smallest tractors (vs JD, etc). The kubota is also a little better priced. I probably could have bought a bx2370 and been just fine. I decided that going up one size from the bx/ 1 series made sense because I wanted a standard 3 point (just in case) that could use regular cat 1 equipment (example carrying a middle buster and it not drag the ground when in transport position).

I also learned that maintenance on the bx is just a little more of a pain due to its super compact size...not a deal breaker but I plan to diy and want everything more accessible.

Based on the above I was comparing the B2301, JD 2025r, LS xj2025h.

The LS had better stats on every category and could have been bought for prob about 1500-2000 cheaper but I was concerned that some day long down the road I may have issues getting parts...may not be valid but I just couldn't rule it out. Also, resale was a little bit of concern in the event that I get 'done' with my tractor needs later on, the LS will likely bring less percent of my original cost. It is probably a fine machine otherwise.

The Kubota 2301 and JD are nearly identical in capability and the Kubota was 1500 less. Also I like that they build their own engines and I like orange! Clemson grad... Overall I am happy with my choice. The B2301 will be easy to own, doesn't have the HST Fan concerns of the BX, will do more work, and is nearly the same practical size as far as turning, storing, etc. I also considered the L 2501...without question the best value on the market in my opinion, and I could have owned one for just $2000 more than the B. But it's heavier and larger and I just did not need that big of a machine. I'm sure times will come that it would have been nice but for 99% it will make no difference and my b fits so nicely.

I also shopped used but the used prices were just too close to anything used.

As far as your needs...only you know. It would seem that on a 1.2a lot a bx or b would be plenty of tractor. Get what you like.

Enjoy the search.

 

[AxleHub]

My two cents, after making my first tractor purchase this month:

1) I have 4 acres and plan to do general upkeep and adding landscaping (we didn't do much when we built the house)
2) I didn't want to get something so small that for a few more $ i could have significantly increased my capabilities.
3) I didn't consider mmm's because I already own a scag zero turn mower.
4) I shopped and researched like crazy and here is what it boiled down to for me:
5) Mihindra was more expensive than JD (maybe slightly more capable size for size)


The Kubota BX is probably the most capable and durable of the smallest tractors (vs JD, etc). The kubota is also a little better priced. I probably could have bought a bx2370 and been just fine. I decided that going up one size from the bx/ 1 series made sense because I wanted a standard 3 point (just in case) that could use regular cat 1 equipment (example carrying a middle buster and it not drag the ground when in transport position).

I also learned that maintenance on the bx is just a little more of a pain due to its super compact size...not a deal breaker but I plan to diy and want everything more accessible.

Based on the above I was comparing the B2301, JD 2025r, LS xj2025h.



The Kubota 2301 and JD are nearly identical in capability and the Kubota was 1500 less. Also I like that they build their own engines and I like orange! Clemson grad... Overall I am happy with my choice. The B2301 will be easy to own, doesn't have the HST Fan concerns of the BX, will do more work, and is nearly the same practical size as far as turning, storing, etc..

Just curious Bloomj, I notice you mentioned you looked at many brands and really studied the choices but don't mention the Yanmar or Massey brands getting into your final selection grouping.

I would have thought

1. the Yanmar 324 or 424 or

2. Massey Gc1700s or

3. the massey 1723 or 1726 or E series

would have been strong possible considerations for price , builder rrputation, maintenance, and performance.

What were your general opinions of those units and why they werent in the running for consideration? When you tested them were they not comfortable or didn't like the dealers available in a 100 mile radius or ????

 

[Bloomj]

Just curious Bloomj, I notice you mentioned you looked at many brands and really studied the choices but don't mention the Yanmar or Massey brands getting into your final selection grouping.

I would have thought

1. the Yanmar 324 or 424 or

2. Massey Gc1700s or

3. the massey 1723 or 1726 or E series

would have been strong possible considerations for price , builder rrputation, maintenance, and performance.

What were your general opinions of those units and why they werent in the running for consideration? When you tested them were they not comfortable or didn't like the dealers available in a 100 mile radius or ????

Axlehub,

I did look at the Yanmar options and they seemed to built a little less heavy. The pricing was pretty good but I recall it being sort of in between the LS and Kubota money. Plus the closest dealer was about an hour away vs JD and Kubota having 3 of each within 45 min or so.

I didn't get a chance to dig into the MF options due to dealer location - the closest one was two hours away and I know that would have been a pain if needed service. Also, if I recall the smaller units are made by someone else for Massey. That may not be right...

I did also look at Kioti but didn't see an advantage over the LS tractor for tractor.

Again, I really think most of these machines are great. It is mostly about personal preferences, dealer availability and customer service feel, and price vs brand/value.

For me Kubota hit the best mix of all of that in one machine. I really wanted to go LS because of the value proposition but then I kept thinking - what if I need a part 15 years from now and I can't find it...the money saved on purchase would not have been worth it. That's probably never going to be an issue but for me it made sense to avoid the issue anyway.

 

[daugen]

I believe the smaller Massey tractors are built by Iseki, one of the oldest players in the market and known for top quality in market.
I'd say they were similar to Yanmar but perhaps some improvements due to many years of refining products. Not a heavy tractor though relative to others
I believe. Interesting that Mahindra puts such an emphasis on being heavier. Weight is great when you are pulling things. Not so great trying to get across your
nice lawn with a full bucket and not imprint the entire way, usually with the front tires. If you can keep the tractor off the lawn, go for as much weight as you can.
Or add as much weight as practical to your new tractor. Most of these Asian tractors are inherently light it seems, all unnecessary weight cut out, like on compact cars.