Real estate General topic

[paulsharvey]

I might of missed it, but what is the asking price on that 12ish acres?

Check tax value and last sold with sold date on the property?

I generally look at the tax value and last sold price vs time since sold to determine if it's worth the money on my end.

I never sold a gun and made much money on what I paid for it, and what I've learned when selling a home and property (now that we're thinking about doing so) is to look at the inflation rate when bought vs selling along with how much over the appraised tax vlaue (sell price will ALWAYS be over tax value, question is how much more?).

We don't flip homes, and look at a home as an investment,.

It's mid $400s asking ("Bring all offers"), but looking a tax appraiser, seems like right around $400 even is probably right. I would say, this one is maybe a bit hard to put a finger on.

On the low end; I'm assigning roughly $7000/acre to $9000 as a value for unimproved land; but this could be as high as $12-15k/acre?


Around $100/lf for water frontage (on top of the above $7000); 237 lf is $23,700.

Replacement value of the home; something in the neighborhood of $185-215,000.

Well, septic, fencing, driveway, ect

But this one has multiple outbuilding, that might be $2-5k each, and an additional power hook up down by the pond, that does add additional value. There is also a nice, pretty large front porch, and a whole home length, ground level, 8 ft roof overhang back porch, with concrete floor.

There is allegedly a 1 acre fenced "yard" and an additional 1 acre fenced livestock area. I dont really see that on aerials, but they could be a few years old.

 

[paulsharvey]

I might of missed it, but what is the asking price on that 12ish acres?

Check tax value and last sold with sold date on the property?

I generally look at the tax value and last sold price vs time since sold to determine if it's worth the money on my end.

I never sold a gun and made much money on what I paid for it, and what I've learned when selling a home and property (now that we're thinking about doing so) is to look at the inflation rate when bought vs selling along with how much over the appraised tax vlaue (sell price will ALWAYS be over tax value, question is how much more?).

We don't flip homes, and look at a home as an investment,.

I kinda view a house not as a flip or long term investment either; I view a house as an expense, and a necessity. You can call it an investment if that makes you feel better about the payment, but it's not a stock or commodity that you can just sell easily/quickly/without replacing.

That might sound like I'm not assigning value to a home; which is incorrect. I do assign value to a degree, but more a factor of; you gotta live somewhere, and it might as well be what you want if your gonna spend 2/3 of your time there.

 

[Sigarms]

What is the current tax value on the land? I missed it per your last response.

Generally everything I looked at around my area, asking value is substantially higher than tax value.

I've never looked at a home/land as a investment possibility, but a littler higher up on the chain vs a used car where it's to be used by yourself.

That said, as I've gotten older, I'm kind of seeing why homes and land are investment opportunities. The only time I look at a used car or home is when I need one to fit my needs

 

[plowhog]

look at the inflation rate when bought vs selling along with how much over the appraised tax vlaue

I understand why you would do this. It might be the best data available. But it is also fraught with risk, just like looking at Zillow or Redfin.

We upended the entire market, at least according to Zillow and Redfin, when we purchased the "other" 50% equity in our ranch property from a family member. Zillow and Redfin could not or did not discover the sale was only for 50% equity-- so it appeared a regular sale had happened but at a much lower price. That threw off their reported numbers for lots of properties in the area. There are many examples of other ways the numbers can be thrown off.

Regarding tax cost, I've only had experience in the CA and NV markets. I've never used tax cost as a way to determine value-- too many variables.

A lot of buyers look at what other similar properties are being marketed for. But that only gives you asking prices, not sold prices.

A professional appraiser has access to all the prior "sold" comparable properties and ways to adjust for differences. And an appraiser would pick up that our property was for half equity. So, for about $300, you can get the best data possible by ordering an appraisal.

I do understand that we all do the best we can when looking at many properties-- and usually only do an appraisal when narrowed down to purchase time.

 

[tradosaurus]

I had to give 20K seller concession for drain fields. They almost got me on stucco, but with my construction background I was much wiser. I made the testing company come back out and re-test a wall they clim had failed (readings ~20%). I tested them with my own tester after they left. They were 12-14%.
I think the buyer and the stucco testing company colluded together to fail the stucco to get $30 grand out of me.
I put an end to that BS.

If this happened to me I probably wouldn't have budged much on the price. They could have pounded sand for the $20K for drain fields.

 

[paulsharvey]

I believe the current "fair market value" listed by the county is $405k, at "highest and best use".

 

[paulsharvey]

If this happened to me I probably wouldn't have budged much on the price. They could have pounded sand for the $20K for drain fields.

Mr Dude ended up with a check for an ammount he seems happy with; how we arrive at the end number is not important. We could have had Mr Dude throw $20k into the closing cost, or just plain reduce the sale price; doesn't matter how we get to the end number

 

[paulsharvey]

BTW; for many inspectors, they will search until they find something wrong, to be able to prove they did their job; not necessarily collusion or anything shady.

 

[tradosaurus]

My mom's an immigrant.
Came to the US in 1949.

I would guess you mom came legally.

 

[tradosaurus]

Mr Dude ended up with a check for an ammount he seems happy with; how we arrive at the end number is not important. We could have had Mr Dude throw $20k into the closing cost, or just plain reduce the sale price; doesn't matter how we get to the end number

Be curious if Hay Dude had other potential buyers interested in his property. This would have given him leverage.

 

[paulsharvey]

I would guess you mom came legally.

Maybe, maybe not? I can tell you my mom's ancestors came from Germany, after getting caught smuggling, and they ran, and came to the US to avoid justice. Dad's side, don't really know, but it is pretty funny that they changed first and last names the second they got on a boat...

If you took criminals fleeing the law; US, Canada, New Zealand, South Africa, Argentina, Australia, and Texas wouldn't have many people, would they.

I'm not saying they are/were 'jumping the fence', but a Large number did Not reveal the entire truth on their immigration forms.

 

[Sprinkler Fitter]

If this happened to me I probably wouldn't have budged much on the price. They could have pounded sand for the $20K for drain fields.

So if your septic fails when you sell, you’re gonna tell them it’s not your problem?

 

[tradosaurus]

My wife and I spent a lot of time looking for land. We looked at many parcels and drove hundreds of miles in the search. It got to the point that we were kind of desperate. But the desperation was false, which we came to realize. We weren't being forced to move from our house. Land prices weren't going up fast. But once we decided to buy some land it became kind of urgent after we looked at several parcels that wouldn't work for whatever reason. Then we realized, after a failed offer, that we were not in a hurry and we could slow down and wait for the right parcel to come along. What really showed us how we needed to slow down and wait for the parcel that was right for us was when we put an offer on a piece of land that the real estate agent assured us the seller would take. The piece of land was beautiful but access was down a steep dirt road that would be very hard to drive on in winter. And the well was shared by 6 other parcels. And the price was 10 grand higher than our budget allowed. This was in 1996, so 10 grand was more than it is now. Fortunately for us the seller rejected the offer. I was relieved. That ten grand higher price was going to be a burden for several years. My wife was relieved too. That steep dirt road and the high price scared her. The shared well was also a problem. Anyway, we calmed down, realized we weren't desperate, told the real estate agent we weren't desperate and we would just wait until the right chunk of land became available. And about a month later the right piece of land did become available. 15 grand less than the land we couldn't afford. And 5 grand less than our budget. It wasn't even on the market yet. We built a house on the land and still live here. We had a well drilled and we have great water, 15 gallons a minute. Where we live great water is not the norm. My wife and I have done plenty of work making the place ours but it is really very nice and the land is truly beautiful.
Eric

So true. My wife and I decided to move out of our town of 5,000 back in 2017 to get out into the country and get away from inconsiderate neighbors. We spend 3 months every weekend driving around looking at places with at least 15 acres of land. My wife was the prudent one and we found a real gem that wasn't that far from the house we sold.
45 acres with the house about in the middle.

 

[tradosaurus]

So if your septic fails when you sell, you’re gonna tell them it’s not your problem?

Did Hay Dude say his septic had failed before he sold the house?

 

[paulsharvey]

I donr know how Hay Dudes buyer fianced stuff; but if your buyer is using VA, they will (from what I'm told often) have a dang long list of demands, from light switches being changed to paint, to septic, ect; things that don't affect the value or structure of a building.

 

[tradosaurus]

I don't know how Hay Dudes buyer financed stuff; but if your buyer is using VA, they will (from what I'm told often) have a dang long list of demands, from light switches being changed to paint, to septic, ect; things that don't affect the value or structure of a building.

And if you have a prime piece of property you can agree or not agree to sell.

 

[LouNY]

I donr know how Hay Dudes buyer fianced stuff; but if your buyer is using VA, they will (from what I'm told often) have a dang long list of demands, from light switches being changed to paint, to septic, ect; things that don't affect the value or structure of a building.

Had a similar discussion not to long ago, and yep it would pretty much be go pound sand or just get the hell away from me.

 

[Sigarms]

I understand why you would do this. It might be the best data available. But it is also fraught with risk, just like looking at Zillow or Redfin.

We upended the entire market, at least according to Zillow and Redfin, when we purchased the "other" 50% equity in our ranch property from a family member. Zillow and Redfin could not or did not discover the sale was only for 50% equity-- so it appeared a regular sale had happened but at a much lower price. That threw off their reported numbers for lots of properties in the area. There are many examples of other ways the numbers can be thrown off.

Regarding tax cost, I've only had experience in the CA and NV markets. I've never used tax cost as a way to determine value-- too many variables.

A lot of buyers look at what other similar properties are being marketed for. But that only gives you asking prices, not sold prices.

A professional appraiser has access to all the prior "sold" comparable properties and ways to adjust for differences. And an appraiser would pick up that our property was for half equity. So, for about $300, you can get the best data possible by ordering an appraisal.

I do understand that we all do the best we can when looking at many properties-- and usually only do an appraisal when narrowed down to purchase time.

Funny you mention Zillow and Redfin.

Yes, look at both sites, and there is some misleading info on our own house.

I went to redfin to change the 3 bedrooms to 4 bedrooms, and the 2.5 baths to 3.5 baths, and it jumped the "appraisal" substantially higher. The other thing those two sites have incorrect is the amount of land. Listed is 6 acres, where they missed the other 30 plus acre tract that we bought with the home. Nothing more than garbage in, garbage out I understand.

When I did talk to a professional real estate appraiser (not an agent) he told me generally in his experience at the very BOTTOM of selling price, figure at least 100K over tax value. He told me he wouldn't touch me with any numbers until I was ready to sell because whatever he gives me now could change substantially 5 years from now.

I do have a realtor coming over to give us suggestions in the near future. At least in NC, our furnished walkout basement apparently doesn't qualify as an additional story on the home. Kind of interesting because the basement has a bedroom and full bathroom as well, but perhaps why they only listed it with 3 bedrooms. However, they did have 3,200 square feet listed for the home which includes the basement, so not sure how the square footage contradicts the bedrooms and baths.

We paid about 370K in for our home and land back in 2005. With the rate of inflation to 2024, if we can't get at least 575K for the home, I'll be darned if I sell it. Keep in mind, the rate of inflation does not account for the interest rate that we had to pay on the home and land.

When we bought the house in 2005 I just prayed we wouldn't lose money on the money paid because it was a crapload. Now I'm getting to the point that even if we break even, I'd contemplate at looking at building something on the property and just leave the house dormant where we're living at now and not sell.

 

[plowhog]

With the rate of inflation to 2024, if we can't get at least

Remember the buyer doesn't care about your personal history, if you paid high, low, or in the middle, etc.

My neighbor just tied herself into knots when she sold. She had a big round figure she liked that was more psychological than connected to any sort of reality or appraisal. So she fixated against that number, which was pleasing to her, instead of market value. She really really wanted that number (I think for future bragging rights) and it complicated things. But-- I recognize and understand we all face our own psychological factors when selling. All of us.

The good news is you are far ahead of the game from home ownership. Do your exercise about purchase price, plus inflation, and then value today. Once that is done, add it the savings that accumulated for so many years had you been paying rent elsewhere. Once you add the "saved" rent, it's a fantastic home run and grand slam.

Years ago I owned a very high end residential property that I lived in. Owned it about 15 years, then sold it for a price that had increased enough that it paid all of my costs to own it-- all the property tax, repairs, utilities, maintenance, upgrades, etc. So I lived in a very high end property for a long time pretty much absolutely free. And that was before considering what I would have paid to live somewhere else.

Such is the beauty of home ownership.

 

[paulsharvey]

Property Appraiser is going to have info based on last sale, and square feet, and depreciation; but they have no way to know tile vs carpet, or many many other things that affect market precieved value. Zillow/Refin, same deal; but to a worse extend, because it's not publicly available to understand how they got to your "Zestamate".

All this info is a tool, but far from complete; and you need to include your own factors in as a buyer. If you don't want a pool, then a pool does not add value. For me, a barn adds value; for others it's an expensive liability, that needs removed. There could easily be a $1M home that I wouldn't give $250k foe, because it isn't worth it To Me.