OP
dustycoyote
Bronze Member
very grateful for all of the help here. feel like I'm getting a better understanding of some things, even if my initial assumptions on some things may have been wrong and I need to make some adjustements in plans...
I'm realizing that I probably should have given more info about the land and work to be done.
The property is about 50-60 acres. the large areas that I need to clean up and do all the earthwork in cover about 3-4 acres. Picture those areas like old gravel quarry landscape with a couple of dig faces that I want to largely build back up.
I'm out in the Rocky mountains in Utah. And in a dry part of the mountains as well. So my challenges are pretty different than a lot of folk that are working forested areas in the east where it is wetter and more lush. My forest is made up of Aspen trees, Douglas Fir, and Lodgepole pine. Those from the east would consider it pretty sparse. If in open areas, or if on the south or east face of a hill, any area that I clear (roads for example) would stay pretty clear with pretty minimal maintenance or traffic. It would grow some dry grass the following year, and over the course of several years might grow some sage and bitterbrush. For example, one stretch that I will be dozing the road through is an old historic road that hasn't been used for more than 30 or 40 years. It's on the exposed east face of a hill and only has grass and a few sagebrush on it after all those years of no use or maintenance. The surface of the old road has remained pretty much intact.
the areas where I am looking to drive new roads are much less dense than others may be thinking. and having a cab in the trees out here is a lot more doable than those in denser forests. I'll post a few pictures and examples.
A brushhog would be really nice, but I am expecting that I can make do without it, or borrow one from my cousin one or twice.
campsites will be cleared and either graveled or left flat as I don't expect too much growth. Could probably keep them clear with a riding lawn mower once a year pretty easily.
Some of the ground that I plan to dig in is pretty dense and concreted. It is the site of ancient hotsprings and so it is very calcified. That material, along with some trenching is why I think I may need a smaller hoe bucket. I will also be pulling some fairly large rocks down from dig faces.
Since I don't have any hardwoods or really big trees in the areas that I am expecting to clear, I am hoping to use the backhoe and thumb for tree clearing rather than investing in a stump grinder. There are very few trees over about 6 inches in diameter that i would plan to remove. Watching people on Youtube give good reviews of removing much larger tree stumps gave me the impression that my planned usage is well within the abilities of the backhoe and tractor (as long as I go about it smartly and am patient).
I'm concerned now because of the notes from rScotty who sounds like an informed and experienced voice in the chat. Especially the comment that this backhoe is not an appropriate tool for pulling out even brush.
Because I recognize I lack knowledge, I've tried to ensure that my usage will be less stressing that what others online are successfully using the tool for. Again, I've seen lots of reveiws and videos of users online clearig land for roads and pulling out trees that seem to be heavier duty than what I'm planning (and with the lighter backhoe and tractor than what I plan to get). I see that they are going pretty slow and are very patient and am expecting to approach it that way myself. But, If I'm be expecting too much, please don't let me move forward with a plan that will fail and cost me money that I can't replace. Though having said that, if this tool can work, and it is the tool I can afford, then the let me know that it can but how to be cautious and thoughtful enough to use it correctly. (again, I'll post some pics here of the trees and land)
And I am just planning to burn all of my trees and branches. or, since I have some really large areas I need to fill in, I may just cut them up and bury most of them and let them return nutrients to the soil.
as far as maybe buying some used construction equipment that is heavier duty;
Buying stronger used equipment now and then selling it later to recover cost is tempting, and I'd prefer to do it this way if possible. I'm someone who really doesn't like to buy things new unless I have to.
But I have a couple issues. First, and probably the show stopper is available funds. I just don't have the liquidity to spend the extra money in the short term to do it this way, even if I can recover most of those funds later. I'm pretty much maxing what I can spend with the trailer and tractor I am looking at now. The funding becomes even more of an issue for me because this is not my primary area of expertise and I don't have the knowledge to properly evaluate used equipment. When I consider potential maintenance or repair costs I may run up against with more and heavier used equipment (that had imminent issues when I bought it). That is actually a big reason why I am looking at new equipment now rather than used. Good used stuff seems to be kind of rare to come by around here and I don't trust myself to know how to check that equipment out and make good decisions on the quality and condition of the equipment. After reading all of your feedback I feel more comfortable on buying used attachments like the box blade that are pretty simple, but really uncomfortable about the risk in doing that on major complex machines.
I Understand that my current path leaves me with another concern or challenge. With guidance from this group I need to ensure that I am using the lighter equipment I am buying appropriately and not overworking it. that's part of why I created this post. I need to avoid abusing the equipment and potentially creating even more costs and trouble than I would have faced by buying the more expensive equipment in the first place.
for the trailer questions and input. And this is really important to me;
(and per the tow vehicle question above; my tow vehicle is a new-ish GM 3500. Not a dually, but I should be good for towing approx 10k trailer off the bumper if loaded correctly. I have the integrated brake controller and exhaust/transmission braking systems on it.)
I very much appreciate the advice to proceed cautiously. I think the ramps on the trailer will be too short to load it comfortably, but I believe that I will have some raised areas or curbs that I can use to approach the ramps that will help. I am pretty cautious and patient in my approach generally. I am planning on a pretty slow and measured learning curve to the tractor usage in general. But would invite any guidance on common mistakes and types of work that merit extra caution or consideration. I don't want to break the equipment or my head...
I can't afford 2 separate trailers, and I need a dump for the work I'm doing. First for spreading gravel on the road once we improve it. This could be done by just hiring dump trucks to bring in the gravel, but I would still need a dump later anyway. Some of the places I need to move dirt to/from are more than 1/4 mile apart so I need the dump to transport. thus I'm trying to find a dump trailer that will work (smartly and safely).
Because of my need to try to fit this into a dump trailer I understand that I am giving up the option to carry any additional attachments on the trailer. the attachments are expected to just stay up on the land so its not a big inconvenience. If I do need to move those, I have a brother who lives much closer who has a utility trailer for the attachments.
the tractor is expected to stay up on the land for the most part as well. I am not planning on trailering it up and back every time I go up there to do work.
I had the salesman measure the tractor last night. It is about 230 inches long from the front of the grounded loader to the back of the backhoe bucket. That would mean, with the loader bucket on the floor of the dump trailer, the end of the backhoe bucket would overhang the trailer by about 3 feet. If I swing the backhoe over (but not far enough to be wider than the tractor..) it brings the overhang down to only about 7 inches. If I were to swing it the rest of the way over to rest it on or up against the side wall, it would then be shorter than the cargo area. (But I'm not sure i would want it swung over that far to the side. I don't know how much that would affect the weight distribution of the trailer. I would have to mess with it to see.)
I am pretty concerned with potential tongue weight, and load balance issues. And here I would love a little more insight from everyone. To help ensure I am loaded correctly I bought a Weighsafe hitch, and am looking at a trailer modl that would allow me to load the tractor forwards or backwards, so that I can adjust the tongue weight if it is unsafe in the loader forward position. I am looking at one with the 2 foot walls all the way around so that the loader bucket clears it or can sit on top of it and still be secured. Many dump trailers have a taller wall at the front of the trailer that would get in the way of the backhoe bucket if I were to need to load the tractor backwards. I expect that will help me move the tractor forward or back in order to balance the load, but again am not very experienced and would love comments and thoughts confirming or correcting my approach.
I'm realizing that I probably should have given more info about the land and work to be done.
The property is about 50-60 acres. the large areas that I need to clean up and do all the earthwork in cover about 3-4 acres. Picture those areas like old gravel quarry landscape with a couple of dig faces that I want to largely build back up.
I'm out in the Rocky mountains in Utah. And in a dry part of the mountains as well. So my challenges are pretty different than a lot of folk that are working forested areas in the east where it is wetter and more lush. My forest is made up of Aspen trees, Douglas Fir, and Lodgepole pine. Those from the east would consider it pretty sparse. If in open areas, or if on the south or east face of a hill, any area that I clear (roads for example) would stay pretty clear with pretty minimal maintenance or traffic. It would grow some dry grass the following year, and over the course of several years might grow some sage and bitterbrush. For example, one stretch that I will be dozing the road through is an old historic road that hasn't been used for more than 30 or 40 years. It's on the exposed east face of a hill and only has grass and a few sagebrush on it after all those years of no use or maintenance. The surface of the old road has remained pretty much intact.
the areas where I am looking to drive new roads are much less dense than others may be thinking. and having a cab in the trees out here is a lot more doable than those in denser forests. I'll post a few pictures and examples.
A brushhog would be really nice, but I am expecting that I can make do without it, or borrow one from my cousin one or twice.
campsites will be cleared and either graveled or left flat as I don't expect too much growth. Could probably keep them clear with a riding lawn mower once a year pretty easily.
Some of the ground that I plan to dig in is pretty dense and concreted. It is the site of ancient hotsprings and so it is very calcified. That material, along with some trenching is why I think I may need a smaller hoe bucket. I will also be pulling some fairly large rocks down from dig faces.
Since I don't have any hardwoods or really big trees in the areas that I am expecting to clear, I am hoping to use the backhoe and thumb for tree clearing rather than investing in a stump grinder. There are very few trees over about 6 inches in diameter that i would plan to remove. Watching people on Youtube give good reviews of removing much larger tree stumps gave me the impression that my planned usage is well within the abilities of the backhoe and tractor (as long as I go about it smartly and am patient).
I'm concerned now because of the notes from rScotty who sounds like an informed and experienced voice in the chat. Especially the comment that this backhoe is not an appropriate tool for pulling out even brush.
Because I recognize I lack knowledge, I've tried to ensure that my usage will be less stressing that what others online are successfully using the tool for. Again, I've seen lots of reveiws and videos of users online clearig land for roads and pulling out trees that seem to be heavier duty than what I'm planning (and with the lighter backhoe and tractor than what I plan to get). I see that they are going pretty slow and are very patient and am expecting to approach it that way myself. But, If I'm be expecting too much, please don't let me move forward with a plan that will fail and cost me money that I can't replace. Though having said that, if this tool can work, and it is the tool I can afford, then the let me know that it can but how to be cautious and thoughtful enough to use it correctly. (again, I'll post some pics here of the trees and land)
And I am just planning to burn all of my trees and branches. or, since I have some really large areas I need to fill in, I may just cut them up and bury most of them and let them return nutrients to the soil.
as far as maybe buying some used construction equipment that is heavier duty;
Buying stronger used equipment now and then selling it later to recover cost is tempting, and I'd prefer to do it this way if possible. I'm someone who really doesn't like to buy things new unless I have to.
But I have a couple issues. First, and probably the show stopper is available funds. I just don't have the liquidity to spend the extra money in the short term to do it this way, even if I can recover most of those funds later. I'm pretty much maxing what I can spend with the trailer and tractor I am looking at now. The funding becomes even more of an issue for me because this is not my primary area of expertise and I don't have the knowledge to properly evaluate used equipment. When I consider potential maintenance or repair costs I may run up against with more and heavier used equipment (that had imminent issues when I bought it). That is actually a big reason why I am looking at new equipment now rather than used. Good used stuff seems to be kind of rare to come by around here and I don't trust myself to know how to check that equipment out and make good decisions on the quality and condition of the equipment. After reading all of your feedback I feel more comfortable on buying used attachments like the box blade that are pretty simple, but really uncomfortable about the risk in doing that on major complex machines.
I Understand that my current path leaves me with another concern or challenge. With guidance from this group I need to ensure that I am using the lighter equipment I am buying appropriately and not overworking it. that's part of why I created this post. I need to avoid abusing the equipment and potentially creating even more costs and trouble than I would have faced by buying the more expensive equipment in the first place.
for the trailer questions and input. And this is really important to me;
(and per the tow vehicle question above; my tow vehicle is a new-ish GM 3500. Not a dually, but I should be good for towing approx 10k trailer off the bumper if loaded correctly. I have the integrated brake controller and exhaust/transmission braking systems on it.)
I very much appreciate the advice to proceed cautiously. I think the ramps on the trailer will be too short to load it comfortably, but I believe that I will have some raised areas or curbs that I can use to approach the ramps that will help. I am pretty cautious and patient in my approach generally. I am planning on a pretty slow and measured learning curve to the tractor usage in general. But would invite any guidance on common mistakes and types of work that merit extra caution or consideration. I don't want to break the equipment or my head...
I can't afford 2 separate trailers, and I need a dump for the work I'm doing. First for spreading gravel on the road once we improve it. This could be done by just hiring dump trucks to bring in the gravel, but I would still need a dump later anyway. Some of the places I need to move dirt to/from are more than 1/4 mile apart so I need the dump to transport. thus I'm trying to find a dump trailer that will work (smartly and safely).
Because of my need to try to fit this into a dump trailer I understand that I am giving up the option to carry any additional attachments on the trailer. the attachments are expected to just stay up on the land so its not a big inconvenience. If I do need to move those, I have a brother who lives much closer who has a utility trailer for the attachments.
the tractor is expected to stay up on the land for the most part as well. I am not planning on trailering it up and back every time I go up there to do work.
I had the salesman measure the tractor last night. It is about 230 inches long from the front of the grounded loader to the back of the backhoe bucket. That would mean, with the loader bucket on the floor of the dump trailer, the end of the backhoe bucket would overhang the trailer by about 3 feet. If I swing the backhoe over (but not far enough to be wider than the tractor..) it brings the overhang down to only about 7 inches. If I were to swing it the rest of the way over to rest it on or up against the side wall, it would then be shorter than the cargo area. (But I'm not sure i would want it swung over that far to the side. I don't know how much that would affect the weight distribution of the trailer. I would have to mess with it to see.)
I am pretty concerned with potential tongue weight, and load balance issues. And here I would love a little more insight from everyone. To help ensure I am loaded correctly I bought a Weighsafe hitch, and am looking at a trailer modl that would allow me to load the tractor forwards or backwards, so that I can adjust the tongue weight if it is unsafe in the loader forward position. I am looking at one with the 2 foot walls all the way around so that the loader bucket clears it or can sit on top of it and still be secured. Many dump trailers have a taller wall at the front of the trailer that would get in the way of the backhoe bucket if I were to need to load the tractor backwards. I expect that will help me move the tractor forward or back in order to balance the load, but again am not very experienced and would love comments and thoughts confirming or correcting my approach.
