New Guy Asking For Recommendations

Sulla · Dec 25, 2010

I just registered for the site after lurking for a bit and wanted to introduce myself. I'm a former farm boy who's spent the last thirty years living in a couple of East Coast cities. My family and I just moved up to the North Country to get back on the farm, if you will. Had enough of the city, thank you very much!

I hope to be buying a nice chunk of land, fifty acres more or less, that we will be timbering and farming. I'm fairly handy but never learned to weld. I expect to be breaking a lot of stuff, lots of rocks up here in Northern New Hampshire, and I don't feel like buying new stuff all the time.

I've read up on the various types of welding and it seems like, stick or mig is what I will be needing most. I also figure I'll need a cutting torch as well. Reading and doing is how I learn everything. That said I was hoping some of you folks might have a recommendation as to what type of welding machine to start with and how much I should expect to pay for a good used machine.

Thanks in advance. I hope I have something to add to this form as time goes by and I learn a thing or two

Shield Arc · Dec 25, 2010

Sulla I presently have 11 welding machines. Tig, Mig, electric SMAW, (stick) and engine drives SMAW. If I were you I'd look very hard at Everlast PowerArc 200! For this kind of money, and their warranty, I wouldn't even consider used equipment.

PowerARC 200 - Arc Tig Mig Welding Equipment, Plasma Cutters, Multi Purpose Units, Welders, Diesel Generators

LD1 · Dec 25, 2010

Sulla said:
I just registered for the site after lurking for a bit and wanted to introduce myself. I'm a former farm boy who's spent the last thirty years living in a couple of East Coast cities. My family and I just moved up to the North Country to get back on the farm, if you will. Had enough of the city, thank you very much!

I hope to be buying a nice chunk of land, fifty acres more or less, that we will be timbering and farming. I'm fairly handy but never learned to weld. I expect to be breaking a lot of stuff, lots of rocks up here in Northern New Hampshire, and I don't feel like buying new stuff all the time.

I've read up on the various types of welding and it seems like, stick or mig is what I will be needing most. I also figure I'll need a cutting torch as well. Reading and doing is how I learn everything. That said I was hoping some of you folks might have a recommendation as to what type of welding machine to start with and how much I should expect to pay for a good used machine.

Thanks in advance. I hope I have something to add to this form as time goes by and I learn a thing or two

Mig takes a lot of prep work. You have to have clean metal to start or the welds are poor. No paint, rust, grease, slag from the torches, etc. And you really cant weld outside of a closed shop on a windy day, it blows the shielding gas away.'

If I were you, I'd start with a set of torches and a old lincoln buzz box or similar. Most can be had for ~75 bucks on c-list and not reall much to go wrong. They will weld up to 200 or 225 A. But you will need a 240v hookup.

Once you have that, it will take care of most of your repairs. And If you then think you want a mig, again, keep an eye on c-list. For about the money you would spend on a little 135A 110V unit new, you gan get a decient used 220v and 225A+ machine. Unless you are doing autobody on the side, I wouldn't even consider a 110v mig. For far equipment repairs and building tractor stuff, you are going to want that 220v IMO

RickB · Dec 25, 2010

I agree that used welders are generally priced far above their real value. Consider how you will store and where you will use a welder while deciding which type to buy. I would love a MIG, but storing a wire feed welder in an unheated building will degrade the wire faster than I would use it. That, coupled with my cheap nature, made me choose a Miller Thunderbolt AC/DC unit that fits my needs very, very well. If your budget is larger than mine was, there are more and better choices.

I have also said before and still believe that if I had to choose only a oxy/acetylene torch set or a welder, I'd have the torch. In fact I did have a torch for many years before a welder.

k0ua · Dec 25, 2010

I have an Everlast PA160, the little brother to the PA200 that Shield Arc mentioned. It goes to 160 amps, enough for what I do. and it seems to be high quality and does a good job. I like DC welding better than AC. In fact my AC welder (Lincoln AC225) is for sale

Stick is hard to beat for good solid welds on thicker material for the money invested. There is a learning curve. I am still in that curve

But it does not take a lot of money to get into the stick game. And you can be making good strong welds with just a bit of practice.. good luck
James K0UA

http://www.everlastgenerators.com/PowerARC 160-390-pd.html

BeezFun · Dec 25, 2010

If I could only keep one of my welders I'd keep the Oxy/Ac torch. It can weld, braze and cut. With the micro torch head it can do really fine work. The few times I've needed to do something remote, I can wheel the cart in the tractor bucket and not have to worry about electricity when I get where I'm going. Also way cheaper to get started with gas, you can get a decent setup for a few hundred dollars, the gas depends on how your local outfit sells/rents gas bottles.

If you need to cut you've really only got two options: a torch or a plasma cutter. If you buy the torch you can weld with it. If you buy a multipurpose machine, you can plasma cut and tig, but it's not exactly portable and will require a generator if you're away from the barn. Might also require running a new electrical outlet. I'm in the market for a multipurpose machine because plasma makes much nicer cuts, doesn't get the material so hot, and tig welding gives very high quality welds and does very thin material easily, like sheet metal on mower decks.

Gas is a little harder to learn, but once you get it down you'll be able to pick up the other techniques pretty easily.

jcliburn · Dec 25, 2010

Another vote for the Everlast PowerArc 160. It's the first welder I can call my own after lugging my dad's ancient Sears Roebuck something-or-other back and forth between his farm and mine for far too long.

FredH · Dec 25, 2010

Regardless of What you choose , Mig , Stick , etc..... , there will be advantages and disadvantages to all .

Oxy-Acet torch is handy for heating , cutting , welding but torch is alive when lit thus to rearrange whatever you are doing , you need to shut it off and re light or risk burning something .

Mig is good and with flux core , welding outside is no problem also seem to get better penetration on thicker stock .

Stick is good , correct rod size and keeping your rods dry when stored are required .

Bigger machines require 220/240 so portability is questionable unless a generator is handy , while 110/120 models offer more portability but with less power and lower duty cycles .

Plasma is pretty sweet cutting but is limited to just that , cutting . Nice to cut with and once trigger is released torch is dead with-out turning machine off .

My set-up is a Lincoln Sp135+ and a Lotos Cut50 Plasma cutter . Bought 1 of the Harbor Freight welding carts , cut off the back tank shelf then welded it to a Harbor Freight Hand truck . Welder is bolted to top shelf while Plama cutter is bolted to bottom with storage for whatever in middle .

Wont get into a peeing match with others but I have welded 1/2" to 1/2" with my lincoln , ( Adapter plates to mount a Tire Chain Hanger onto my Semi ) . Chain hanger with 12 set of chains is in excess of 500 lbs. , been on there for over 3 years bouncing down the freeways , ( Grapevine on I-5 is disgustingly rough ) , no cracks in welds , I have in stood on it many a times while washing my truck .
Have Also rebuilt my 6' K.K. Disk with welder as well as built a 6' ripper from scratch , ( looks like a box blade ripper but with out the box ) .

Basically , the quality of the weld is not limited by the machine but rather the operator .

It really depends on what you see as being required for your situation .
Do you want portability or will this be only in shop repairs with adequate power supply ? The combination's are numerous and as I first mentioned , ALL have their Advantages but All have their Dis-advantages .

Fred H.

gwdixon · Dec 25, 2010

FredH said:
( Grapevine on I-5 is disgustingly rough )

Fred H.

That's the truth. I-5 going past Bakersfield is a nightmare. Lost all running lights last week on the trailer when the bouncing shorted out wires and blew a fuse. Ah well, all of CA is a nightmare.

Back to the topic. I have two Lincoln tombstones, AC only, and AC/DC, O/A setup, Everlast PowerArc 200, and Everlast PlasmaPro 70.

As soon at the PA200 was purchased the Lincolns went into the barn - probably never to be used again. It is small, light, and portable.

The plasma cutter has put the O/A setup in the back of the shop to be used for heating only (probably). The point is to get all you can afford now since you'll probably end up getting it later anyway.

Go with a DC welder if possible. It is much smoother. One with 200 amps will let you hardface implements with special 3/16" rod to battle your rocks.

Other considerations, some mentioned by others:

>Farm equipment is rarely "clean" so MIG is iffy at best without a lot of prep. Some say it doesn't penetrate as well as stick but in a pro's hands anything is possible. You just don't need welds breaking and going through the break/repair/break cycle on the same piece of equipment.

>220V is necessary for any oomph in a welder. Farm welds need to be deep and strong rather than sitting on the surface.

>A large air compressor is best for a plasma cutter. Mine will do 18 cfm.

>A decent sized generator is needed for work in the field. Mine is 13K watts and will run an air compressor and plasma cutter at the same time. It does the welder without a problem.

wdchyd · Dec 25, 2010

Sulla,

Welcome to TBN.....:welcome:

Glad to have another Cow Hampshirite here (well in the future when you move up)......:thumbsup:

What part of NH are you planning on living in..?

As far as welding you'll get lots of useful info here, there's a huge bunch of welders including the all the ones already posting.....

My suggestion would be to find a friend where you live (or move to) and have them show you and walk you through the basic steps......Getting a good bead and penetration is paramount to having your welds hold up...and when something doesn't seem right you'll be able to call him/her to help with it....remember it always easier to weld something once right the first time rather than "unwelding it" to redo it.......:ashamed:

My preference for repair/light fabrication is stick welding with an AC/DC machine......(I prefer DC)......MIG will be easier to master at first but strength can be a problem sometimes if not cleaned and prepped right.....Not that there's anything wrong with MIG......

At least you'll have the option to buy different sizes and type of welding rods for different applications but need only one welder.....

wdchyd · Dec 25, 2010

Also I forgot to mention, If purchasing a welder anyway you may want to think of considering a Portable Gas Drive Welder/Generator whereas you'll have the advantage of having a unit for both situations of welding and power outages.......You'll have only one engine to maintain and welders make great backups for the winter........

Pricey though........

Sulla · Dec 25, 2010

wdchyd said:
Sulla,

Welcome to TBN.....:welcome:

Glad to have another Cow Hampshirite here (well in the future when you move up)......:thumbsup:

What part of NH are you planning on living in..?

As far as welding you'll get lots of useful info here, there's a huge bunch of welders including the all the ones already posting.....

My suggestion would be to find a friend where you live (or move to) and have them show you and walk you through the basic steps......Getting a good bead and penetration is paramount to having your welds hold up...and when something doesn't seem right you'll be able to call him/her to help with it....remember it always easier to weld something once right the first time rather than "unwelding it" to redo it.......:ashamed:

My preference for repair/light fabrication is stick welding with an AC/DC machine......(I prefer DC)......MIG will be easier to master at first but strength can be a problem sometimes if not cleaned and prepped right.....Not that there's anything wrong with MIG......

At least you'll have the option to buy different sizes and type of welding rods for different applications but need only one welder.....

Thanks to all who have replied.

Wdchyd, we've already moved up to our former vacation home in North Conway. We've been coming up here for the last decade or so and just decided to pull the trigger and make the move. In my other life I'm an investment advisor so any friends I have don't get their hands dirty. I'm making some new ones, but for now I'll just have to post my practice welds for you'll to laugh at, every bodies a newbie sometime!

Seems like this is a great forum. The suggestion came faster than I could get back, on Christmas no less. I guess I'm not the only one who needed a break from the festivities.

Thanks again.

Sulla · Dec 25, 2010

wdchyd said:
Also I forgot to mention, If purchasing a welder anyway you may want to think of considering a Portable Gas Drive Welder/Generator whereas you'll have the advantage of having a unit for both situations of welding and power outages.......You'll have only one engine to maintain and welders make great backups for the winter........

Pricey though........

I like this idea a lot. Most of my work is going to be on a property about thirty minutes away. We plan on clearing the land, selling the timber we don't use and building a farm. If I could load this baby in my truck and have it with me when I need it it would make a lot of sense.

Good idea, thanks

mroldstyle · Dec 25, 2010

I would love a MIG, but storing a wire feed welder in an unheated building will degrade the wire faster than I would use it.
RickB

What are the concerns with wire storage? My wire feed stays in an unheated shop all the time, I didn't realize this was an issue, what should I be worried about?

Hooked_on_HP · Dec 25, 2010

The wire will get a fine layer of rust on it. When you run the rusty wire through the liner the rust rubs off plugging the liner. Also the rust creates impurities in the weld.
Bill

wdchyd · Dec 25, 2010

Sulla,

North Conway is a great place to live, been through there many times....:thumbsup:......I run my huntin' furbuddies in the White Mountains just about every weekend....

Welding is full of newbies like us.....Yes, I'm a newbie also that started 35 yrs ago.....I own many units (at work) and welding is one thing that has hurdled me over the top in the repair business.....

Years ago a friend said "Wow, You Weld? A guy that can weld can fix anything"......This has stuck with me a long time.

We'll look forward to your progression as you post pics......:cool2:

Gary Fowler · Dec 25, 2010

Rust on MIG wire or on stick electrode is bad. Stick electrodes will tolerate open shop better as you can put the rods in a air tight bag or vacu-seal and they are good to go, but rust on the wire or on the piece to be welded is not a good practice to follow. Regardless or SMAW, MIG or TIG you need clean wire, clean base metal and shielding from wind. Even stick rod needs some shielding from the wind although stick tolerates it more than MIG. Wind, rust, slag, dirt, grease all need to be eliminated from weld area to make the best weld. Generally speaking everyshop should have a stick welder and and OA torch as basic equipment. MIG is OK but doesnt have the versatility of a good DC stick machine. Just my 2 cents worth.

FredH · Dec 25, 2010

Rusty Wire ???

Years ago my Dad welded a whole rear quarter panel onto a 1959 Ford using Oxy/Acet and Old Baling Wire . My Job ....... Cut pieces of the wire 2 to 3 foot long and Straighten out .

Course the 1 thing good old Dad did not tell me was that he would only need so many pieces . I Unraveled that whole pile and had this nice stack of wire all laid out . When he got done , you could hardly tell he had used any out of the pile . So my next Job was to now wad the stuff all back up !:confused2:

Yes , the memories of growing up .

Fred H.

P.S. Knew if I looked through the pile on my desk long enough that I would find a catalog that was sent to me when I bought a new liner for my mig gun . Anyway here is something interesting : Mig , Tig AND Stick all in one . Don't own it , Don't know anything about it , Don't know the company , Just thought that would be a real nice feature or Luxury to have all 3 in 1 machine .

http://www.usaweld.com/MTS-160-Welders-s/25.htm

RoMad · Dec 25, 2010

For quite a few years I made my living as a Boilermaker. I have made a lot of welds with a lot of different machines. For a beginner I would recommend that you learn to stick weld first and correctly. I just read on this site the other day that there are some really good welding tutorials on you tube. I didn't go look at them since I already know how to weld.
As for me and my own welder, I have an old Lincoln AC buzz box that I bought at a garage sale about 25 years ago. I have made trailers with it, made a box blade for my tractor, and even a few tree stands over the years.
With the high humidity in Fl. I keep my welding rods in an old cooler that seals tightly and they stay good and dry.
As for the torch, you definately need one of those too.

RPW · Dec 25, 2010

As the op originally stated he hadn't welded before. So for the first thing is to maybe attend a local college and take a basic welding course. As far as equipment if you're going to having to weld in a remote area the engine driven welder is the best way to go. AC/DC and scratch TIG. Portable power for tools etc. Keep in mine that they weigh in at around 800# (Miller bobcat 225nt as an example) so it won't be an easy load and unload on a whim. A good used one can be had for around $2500. You can get a suitcase (wire feeder) for these units so you can have MIG also. For repairs your probably going to only be using stick or FCAW (flux core). I've used all the basic processes and like them all. I still have a long way to go to get acceptable welds with TIG but.....

Good luck on your quest. You may find that many of use started down this road and have spent many $$$ getting more equipment than we first thought we'd ever need. But the enjoyment of fusing 2 pieces of metal together can be very addictive.