Flail Mower Let's talk flail mowers

   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,241  
My guess is that the flail is being stressed to the point of the flails being stopped and the Tractor PTO is still turning and the Flail drive pulley is spinning causing belt wear, belt tracking off the pulley or jumping off the pulley and finally belt breakage.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,242  
Hello and good afternoon Quarryscapes,

I want to welcome you as the newest resident member of the flail mower nations from Great Britain.

The conditions/operating measures you describe are well defined and tell me that you have been mowing
too fast for conditions and have worn hammer knives and you need side slicer knives.

About your beautiful flail mower, you need to slow down and change the hammer knives to side slicer knives
to deal with your mowing conditions.

Please believe me when I explain to you in great detail how to overcome this issue as I have owned and used
flail mowers for over 4 decades here on this side of the pond.l

I have to leave right now but I will come back to this later. I want you to visit your stockist and purchase a
complete set of side slicer knives and new V belts-preferably kevlar reinforced V belts from an auto parts store
and get back to me as I want to help you with this as you have a forever mower that will outlive every tractor
you put it on.

I also want you to purchase a V belt tension gauge to help with your V belts life span.

I have to go
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,243  
I see often mentioning of V-belt tension gauge which makes me wonder why are the manufacturers not using spring loaded tensioner, like shown in my old Ford 917L Special below - perhaps it's just cheaper to make them without one?
Yes! Cost. Retired tractor engineer here. You typically see sprung tensioners on high quality drives that see variable loading. Why? The belt tension is held to a low constant regardless of the loading allowing long life for the drive.

Many belt manufacturers advise their V-belts run to a 5:1 tension ratio (although ratios as low as 10:1 run fine without slippage).

W1NUXSm.jpeg

Here is a typical drive with 5:1 tension ratio at full load. Wonderful. Look what happens to tensions when the loading is lightened or the drive stops:

0GRqJ7X.jpeg


Now add a backside sprung idler tensioned for full load.

signal-2025-10-09-12-45-23-181.jpg


Same result right? Now analyze at low or no load:

59rKm0u.jpeg

Huge difference... belt tension lowered by 1/3!

If a drive only see's constant loading (air compressor for example) a sprung idler doesn't offer much advantage. If a drive will see variable loading (like mowers).... a sprung idler lowers tensions considerably and increases life on belts, sheaves, and bearings. Adds cost though. Hope this helps!
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,244  
Yes! Cost. Retired tractor engineer here. You typically see sprung tensioners on high quality drives that see variable loading. Why? The belt tension is held to a low constant regardless of the loading allowing long life for the drive.

Many belt manufacturers advise their V-belts run to a 5:1 tension ratio (although ratios as low as 10:1 run fine without slippage).

View attachment 4209485
Here is a typical drive with 5:1 tension ratio at full load. Wonderful. Look what happens to tensions when the loading is lightened or the drive stops:

View attachment 4209531

Now add a backside sprung idler tensioned for full load.

View attachment 4209532

Same result right? Now analyze at low or no load:

View attachment 4209533
Huge difference... belt tension lowered by 1/3!

If a drive only see's constant loading (air compressor for example) a sprung idler doesn't offer much advantage. If a drive will see variable loading (like mowers).... a sprung idler lowers tensions considerably and increases life on belts, sheaves, and bearings. Adds cost though. Hope this helps!

Bravo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Well Done.

Now if we could only have trash doors installed on our flail mowers
everyone would have less work to do to change knives and have
no plugging in thick tall brush.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,245  
I see often mentioning of V-belt tension gauge which makes me wonder why are the manufacturers not using spring loaded tensioner, like shown in my old Ford 917L Special below - perhaps it's just cheaper to make them without one?

I bought this mower five years ago as a fixer upper and it has worked out very good without any need to mess with the belts, once I figured the correct belt length.

This is obviously light duty mower with side slicer flails and it does a nice job in mowing a field, as well as forested area, without any scalping.

This thread has been very helpful for me!


View attachment 4184713 View attachment 4184711 View attachment 4184719
I like the idea of an auto tensioner. It seems like it would be one less thing to remember to check.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,246  
Yup.... a no-brainer. These are not high quality drives. Even if you buy a gadget to measure belt tension, what tension do you set it to?
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,247  
Yup.... a no-brainer. These are not high quality drives. Even if you buy a gadget to measure belt tension, what tension do you set it to?

True. My Del Morino doesn't even specify what to adjust the belt tension to. I made an educated guess to adjust the deflection to 1cm midway between the pulleys with moderate thumb pressure.
After maybe 100 hours the belts look great, so hopefully I'm in the ballpark!
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,248  
Yup.... a no-brainer. These are not high quality drives. Even if you buy a gadget to measure belt tension, what tension do you set it to?
The tension gauge measurement markings are used to do that for the specific belt size.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,249  
The tension gauge measurement markings are used to do that for the specific belt size.
Correct belt tension is based on knowing the loads, not belt size.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,250  
All V belts have a certain amount of stretch that is managed by proper creating the proper tension.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,251  
V-belt characteristics vary based on their application and construction. Is the belt to be used for clutching? Full load start/stops? Does it see mis-alignment? (like rotary mower primary drives). The loading and the specific application determines belt construction and final tension.

Polyester cords stretch. Aramid cords dont. Wrap molded belts offer smoothest engagement; raw edge belts can carry higher loads. The scale on a tension gage considers nothing of importance.

Belt drives need 3 things to transmit power:
  • Sufficient sheave size
  • Sufficient belt wrap
  • Sufficient tension
Loss of any one of these three leads to slippage, heat, and failure. Proper belt wrap is easy on a 2 sheave drive; both pulleys give the belt approximately 180 degs of wrap. Most manufacturers cheese-out on sheave size: larger sheaves are expensive. They can spec them down to a bare minimum and get through the warranty period ok. The manufacturers described in this thread have left tension completely up to the customer. Smoke a belt? "Well, YOU didn't tension it right." Don't put up with this! Carefully review the design before you buy their products.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,252  
Hello Folks,

Using my mower yesterday (IHC model 70 or 71) around my wood pile I apparently backed into a modest sized log and got it wedged into the back of my mower (between the roller and deck). I now have a few hammers that are touching the deck (back/bottom edge). Looks like that in its life this has happened before. Not sure if it's my hammers bent straighter and hitting or if the deck is slightly bent (not obvious from the back nor very much from looking underneath). I think before bothering to repair the deck (as required) I will need new knives regardless- let them be guide in terms of hitting the deck.

I found the NH numbers. Ebay was ~$10/each, Messicks $29/ea. Plus shipping in both cases. I would need 88 knives (11 stations), and likely new clevis (or bend these open to insert the knives). Maybe they are pretty standard sized - have yet to look.

Attached are a couple of photos. You can see the shiney spots in the back. 5/16" bolts, nylock nuts. I've considered buying a knife to know the spec for the blade, then shopping at mower specific suppliers. That doesn't take into account the clevis, but the ones I have are in good shape to test fit and go forward, assuming I can get the knives off (will need to remove and test). I am missing one, but I think I can grind one to fit, weight wise. Or at least compare pricing for replacements. The originals are claimed on the parts list to also have bushing/tubes. I didn't notice any on mine (haven't taken any off to see - yet).

Part numbers 2, 3, 4. #2 & #3 have been discontinued, but still show.

Any recommendations for vendors?

Thanks!
 

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   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,254  
Hello Folks,

Using my mower yesterday (IHC model 70 or 71) around my wood pile I apparently backed into a modest sized log and got it wedged into the back of my mower (between the roller and deck). I now have a few hammers that are touching the deck (back/bottom edge). Looks like that in its life this has happened before. Not sure if it's my hammers bent straighter and hitting or if the deck is slightly bent (not obvious from the back nor very much from looking underneath). I think before bothering to repair the deck (as required) I will need new knives regardless- let them be guide in terms of hitting the deck.

I found the NH numbers. Ebay was ~$10/each, Messicks $29/ea. Plus shipping in both cases. I would need 88 knives (11 stations), and likely new clevis (or bend these open to insert the knives). Maybe they are pretty standard sized - have yet to look.

Attached are a couple of photos. You can see the shiney spots in the back. 5/16" bolts, nylock nuts. I've considered buying a knife to know the spec for the blade, then shopping at mower specific suppliers. That doesn't take into account the clevis, but the ones I have are in good shape to test fit and go forward, assuming I can get the knives off (will need to remove and test). I am missing one, but I think I can grind one to fit, weight wise. Or at least compare pricing for replacements. The originals are claimed on the parts list to also have bushing/tubes. I didn't notice any on mine (haven't taken any off to see - yet).

Part numbers 2, 3, 4. #2 & #3 have been discontinued, but still show.

Any recommendations for vendors?

Thanks!
Those knife clevis's sure do look like tire chain cross chain hooks;
https://wescovan.com/traction-tire-chains/tire-chain-parts/cross-chain-hooks
Also I would say that the housing got tweaked a bit.
Unless the knifes and clevis are worn enough to allow them to hit.
You could pull a couple that are not hitting and compare with the ones that are. Looks to be quite a bit of wear in the "round" mounting holes of the knifes.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,255  
They do look like cross chain hooks.

Also, from what I’ve seen those light duty flail knives are typically mounted with a bolt to the tabs on the rotor.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,256  
Hello Folks,

Using my mower yesterday (IHC model 70 or 71) around my wood pile I apparently backed into a modest sized log and got it wedged into the back of my mower (between the roller and deck). I now have a few hammers that are touching the deck (back/bottom edge). Looks like that in its life this has happened before. Not sure if it's my hammers bent straighter and hitting or if the deck is slightly bent (not obvious from the back nor very much from looking underneath). I think before bothering to repair the deck (as required) I will need new knives regardless- let them be guide in terms of hitting the deck.

I found the NH numbers. Ebay was ~$10/each, Messicks $29/ea. Plus shipping in both cases. I would need 88 knives (11 stations), and likely new clevis (or bend these open to insert the knives). Maybe they are pretty standard sized - have yet to look.

Attached are a couple of photos. You can see the shiney spots in the back. 5/16" bolts, nylock nuts. I've considered buying a knife to know the spec for the blade, then shopping at mower specific suppliers. That doesn't take into account the clevis, but the ones I have are in good shape to test fit and go forward, assuming I can get the knives off (will need to remove and test). I am missing one, but I think I can grind one to fit, weight wise. Or at least compare pricing for replacements. The originals are claimed on the parts list to also have bushing/tubes. I didn't notice any on mine (haven't taken any off to see - yet).

Part numbers 2, 3, 4. #2 & #3 have been discontinued, but still show.

Any recommendations for vendors?

Thanks!

good morning mojinco,

The knife type that your flail mower uses is a
long side slicer grass finish mower knife.

The simple knife hangers on your beautiful flail
mower are simple to use and once they are
unbolted from the mounting station you will be
able to slip the broken knives out through the
gap and insert new side slicers to replace the
missing or damaged ones.

There are several suppliers of flail mower knives
that you can buy replacement knives from.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


www.flailmaster.com

Phone 1-(615)-848-1813
toll free 1-800-251-4020

Flail Master
Post Office Box 1558
Murfreesboro, Tennesee 37133


------------------------------------------------------------------------


www.cleancutter.com

Clean Cutter Flail and Tiller Blades
169 South Sierra Way
San Bernadino, California

Toll free 1-(800)-345-2335
Phone 1-(909)-889-4084
E-mail sales@cleancutter.com



------------------------------------------------------------------------



www.hardhitter.com

Good Earth agri-products
3443 Yeager Drive, Madera, California

Toll free 1-800-910-3472
Office 1-559-675-3088
Fax 1-559-675-3087



You need to be sure that you order the longer grass
knives with the loop/oval mounting holes otherwise
they will not work for you.

You have two major concerns, price, and freight cost. The two suppliers
in California are closer to you than Flail Master in Tennessee.


You have an IHC flail mower that was designed by Mr. Mott.
 
Last edited:
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,257  
They do look like cross chain hooks.

Also, from what I’ve seen those light duty flail knives are typically mounted with a bolt to the tabs on the rotor.
Mid 60s-early 70s design/sales. I expect I will end up making/buying something with a bolt, spacers. I'll be removing a couple and if needed send them to a supplier for a match up. As long they can be sloppy but not enough to hit the drum nor the body I'm good.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,258  
good morning mojinco,

The knife type that your flail mower uses is a
long side slicer grass finish mower knife.

The simple knife hangers on your beautiful flail
mower are simple to use and once they are
unbolted from the mounting station you will be
able to slip the broken knives out through the
gap and insert new side slicers to replace the
missing or damaged ones.

There are several suppliers of flail mower knives
that you can buy replacement knives from.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


www.flailmaster.com

Phone 1-(615)-848-1813
toll free 1-800-251-4020

Flail Master
Post Office Box 1558
Murfreesboro, Tennesee 37133


------------------------------------------------------------------------


www.cleancutter.com

Clean Cutter Flail and Tiller Blades
169 South Sierra Way
San Bernadino, California

Toll free 1-(800)-345-2335
Phone 1-(909)-889-4084
E-mail sales@cleancutter.com



------------------------------------------------------------------------



www.hardhitter.com

Good Earth agri-products
3443 Yeager Drive, Madera, California

Toll free 1-800-910-3472
Office 1-559-675-3088
Fax 1-559-675-3087



You need to be sure that you order the longer grass
knives with the loop/oval mounting holes otherwise
they will not work for you.

You have two major concerns, price, and freight cost. The two suppliers
in California are closer to you than Flail Master in Tennessee.


You have an IHC flail mower that was designed by Mr. Mott.
Thank you!

And that's an interesting historical note. I assume he left and started his own operation? Or was it an OEM subcontractor situation?

Oh, that begs the question, is it the same/similar to a particular Mott model/series?
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,259  
Thank you!

And that's an interesting historical note. I assume he left and started his own operation? Or was it an OEM subcontractor situation?

Oh, that begs the question, is it the same/similar to a particular Mott model/series?

The interstater model.

The mott mower company, If his son had not been killed in an experimental
airplane crash most mowers today would be flail mowers.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #8,260  
Mid 60s-early 70s design/sales. I expect I will end up making/buying something with a bolt, spacers. I'll be removing a couple and if needed send them to a supplier for a match up. As long they can be sloppy but not enough to hit the drum nor the body I'm good.

If you know someone with a metal bender or your local welding shop
has a round stock metal bender you can purchase your own round bar
stock and make your own knife hangers.
 
 

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