Ideas to remove sheared bolt?

[Industrial Toys]

A third of a million users on here, no one with a welder nearby that can help?

I'm guessing , if the OP doesn't have a welder, he doesn't have a "REAL" torch either. Why would he?

 

[Richard]

If the third picture is a photo of the bolt head that got twisted off, then it's the funniest looking bolt I've ever seen. Looks to me like a piece of all-thread with a jam nut spun down a few threads to lock it in place.

Anyhoo, you are going to need lots of heat and a set of left hand drill bits.

No, that is the assembly that holds the OTHER end on. It (evidently) consists of a short, what I will call, threaded rod ONLY. The pin goes into hole to hold the cylinder in place, then this "set screw" screws in from the side (as per the early pictures) and goes into the pocket that you see on the pin. Then you use the jam nut to lock it on the structure.

I don't care how this looks..... machine is from 1987 and visually, beat to snot (though it runs like a swiss watch).

Notice the grease zerk. I've owned this thing for probably close to 20 years now. I can guarantee you that has never been greased in 20 years. Notice how, if you swing the cylinder out, the zerk hides away to the INSIDE. I never even knew this existed. Another reason I have to get this off (slightly bent rod is first reason) but, I want to get the zerk to the outside so it can be greased.... at least once every 5 years!!

 

[Industrial Toys]

Without those tools mentioned, sharp professional drill bits would be your best friend. Working with poor quality or dull drill bits can be worse than the task at hand! I found that if you could drill straight through, then it's a great way to get heat in there, IF only with a proane torch..

 

[Richard]

A third of a million users on here, no one with a welder nearby that can help?

I'm guessing , if the OP doesn't have a welder, he doesn't have a "REAL" torch either. Why would he?

None that I'm aware of.....but I'm working on that. This is why I might just buy one myself. I haven't had much use for a welder (ever)... and the 2-3 times I HAVE had need, I was able to get it done. (primarily my brother in law brought his up while visiting from New Orleans)

I don't have a shop, no room for a shop, garage is already full... I'm not even sure how large a 220 circuit I can get in my garage. I have a 8-3 (I think it's 8-3, it could possibly be 6?) taking current from my main panel to my subpanel in the garage. It sits on a 50 amp circuit on the main panel if I recall.

Was looking at some stick welders and they say to put it on a 50 amp circuit.

Hmmmm.....

Can I put a 50 amp breaker in the garage that rides off a 50 amp breaker on my main box AND this garage box has a couple other things on it? (some lights & stereo that are in basement and likely wouldn't be in use during day if I'm outside welding something)

Still.... I have that situation to try to figure out. Don't want to get something that's too big for my setup. There's ZERO way I'm going to get a 50 amp dedicated circuit from the main panel to the garage through the finished basement (opposite sides of house with tile floors and drywall between)

 

[Richard]

Maybe I'll just buy a new backhoe!!

That will fix all these problems AND would probably have fresh grease in all the zerks!!!

 

[radios1]

None that I'm aware of.....but I'm working on that. This is why I might just buy one myself. I haven't had much use for a welder (ever)... and the 2-3 times I HAVE had need, I was able to get it done. (primarily my brother in law brought his up while visiting from New Orleans)

I don't have a shop, no room for a shop, garage is already full... I'm not even sure how large a 220 circuit I can get in my garage. I have a 8-3 (I think it's 8-3, it could possibly be 6?) taking current from my main panel to my subpanel in the garage. It sits on a 50 amp circuit on the main panel if I recall.

Was looking at some stick welders and they say to put it on a 50 amp circuit.

Hmmmm.....

Can I put a 50 amp breaker in the garage that rides off a 50 amp breaker on my main box AND this garage box has a couple other things on it? (some lights & stereo that are in basement and likely wouldn't be in use during day if I'm outside welding something)

Still.... I have that situation to try to figure out. Don't want to get something that's too big for my setup. There's ZERO way I'm going to get a 50 amp dedicated circuit from the main panel to the garage through the finished basement (opposite sides of house with tile floors and drywall between)

the problem is, you don't want the lighting to go out if the 50 amp breaker trips, it's very dangerous to be doing something that could hurt you, and then have the lights go out!.

 

[Richard]

the problem is, you don't want the lighting to go out if the 50 amp breaker trips, it's very dangerous to be doing something that could hurt you, and then have the lights go out!.

That wouldn't be an issue....(lights going out) They'd be inside.....I'd be outside.

Though I still get that you don't want to trip any breaker needlessly.

 

[mcfarmall]

then this "set screw" screws in from the side (as per the early pictures) and goes into the pocket that you see on the pin

Right on...I'm stackin' the wood you're cutting.

I think you're right...someone had the cylinder off once upon a time and they put it back together wrong (grease fitting inaccessible).


Yup, that's a set screw. Makes the job a whole lot easier as it's not threaded into the pin but simply sits in a dimple. This means you only have to drill a short distance to get to the dimple and yes, if it is a true setscrew then it's a Grade 5 or 8 equivalent. If it's all-thread then Grade 2.

 

[Tractor Seabee]

Ok, so again, I don't have a welder nor easy access. I've got a couple things that could use to be welded so am contemplating on buying one more for kicks & grins and "to have the right tool when needed" verses becoming a world class bridge builder.

So, my question there would be....

Stick or Mig? I think some do both but you can get those basic stick boxes for less.


Let me ask the question differently..... for THIS application, which would be best?

One thing I don't want to do is be that idiot that welds his nut to his backhoe.

I'm not sure that sounded exactly the way I meant it but I think you know what I mean.

Stick, MIG does not like oil/grease/ and dirt. If you do not get good penetration of the weld it will just twist off.

Ron

 

[TractorGuy]

Your idea to cut a slot in it and try an impact driver might work. The problem with trying that is if it doesn't work it may become difficult to get a flat spot to center punch it for drilling.

Personally I would grind it just enough to get it flat, center punch as near center as I could get, then drill a hole all the way to the shaft. After that, work the outside with a hammer and chisel. If it doesn't come loose then keep going up on drill size until you almost hit threads. Getting dead center and drilling all the way through the bolt is key to success whether you tap it out with a chisel or pull it with an extractor.

 

[WranglerX]

Ok, so again, I don't have a welder nor easy access. I've got a couple things that could use to be welded so am contemplating on buying one more for kicks & grins and "to have the right tool when needed" verses becoming a world class bridge builder.

So, my question there would be....

Stick or Mig? I think some do both but you can get those basic stick boxes for less.


Let me ask the question differently..... for THIS application, which would be best?

One thing I don't want to do is be that idiot that welds his nut to his backhoe.

I'm not sure that sounded exactly the way I meant it but I think you know what I mean.

MIG.... Easiest to learn, and very versatile.... No matter what stick welder argue against it....

My personal choice was a US company based HOBART HANDLER 140, its pretty much top end of 120V MIG welders.... It is capable of both flux core (FCAW- Flux Core Arc Weld) and solid wire with shield gas (GMAW Gas Metal Arc Weld) ... It does about 98% of my welding chores, .. For the other 2 % it needs a bigger machine, so I usually farm that out.... I have never run up against the duty cycle thing, and never had the welder into shut down because of duty cycle...Almost wish I had gotten the HH 210 MVP.... It will handle materials up to 3/16 of inch with ease and with proper cleaning and bevels and preparation of joint area, ｼ inch materials with single pass? Once you get tired of the spatter and scale of flux core welding and go solid wire with shield gas you wonder why FCAW is even available.... Once you have a welder you find all sorts of uses for it outside of blacksmithing.... And yes MIG is probably easiest to learn, it's said one can teach a monkey or a blond to weld.... IF unsure of welder type and processes, you might want to do a little snooping here...

Personally I would stay away from Horror Fright low end machines with 90 day warranty.... Hobart has 5 year warranty... Does the tell you something....Would also look at Miller, Lincoln or ESAB...

Welding Tips and Tricks - TIG, MIG, Stick and a pantload of other info

Dale

 

[Captain Dirty]

Been spraying it with Penetreat for couple weeks now.
View attachment 657648

After a couple of weeks I would change formula (to PB Blaster, Kroil, ATF & acetone, etc.) just out of frustration.

Heating the male part (the "set screw" or "bolt") expands it and makes the fit tighter. Heating the female part ("yoke") would enlarge the hole and make the fit looser. Problem is that conduction transfers the heat from one part to the other so there is little relative motion. Several (many) heat/cool cycles MAY do something to loosen the rust. I would try to heat the yoke with the torch and then cool the bolt. A trick I have tried is to freeze water in a short, straight length of tubing about the diameter of the male part and hold the "icicle" against it using a dowel as a plunger. (Heat from my hand holding the tubing melted the ice enough to allow it to move.)

This presupposes you have a way to turn the bolt. Grinding a slot as suggested may work. I have sometimes drilled 2 small holes, say at 9 and 3 o'clock, and then used a small center punch to alternately drive down on the left and up on the right holes. The impact of so doing seems more effective than the more even force of a screwdriver, bit with breaker bar, etc.

 

[Richard]

A bit of a (meandering) update.

I've hit it with a center punch to attempt to start a dimple..... the punch got blunt on me.

I've tried to drill on it.... perhaps I'm expecting too much too soon.... but the bit didn't scratch the "bolt"

I've banged on it with a chisel to try to budge it. After all, I KNOW it's not in much of a tension mode since it simply tightens into the pin.

I've heated around it (only have MAP gas)

I said I've sprayed it with Penetreat.... I got that screwed up. I sprayed my LOGS on my home with Penetreat..... I used PB Blaster on this.

Oh, and I like the ice idea! I have tried heating around it and then squirting PB Blaster directly on the bolt hoping that would do what (I think) your suggesting the ice to do.


I don't have the fix kit yet to rebuild the cylinder so I'm still on "down time" but right now, this thing is nothing more than a yard ornament in the front yard and you might imagine what the wife is starting to say.....

Also, things to do around here and I can really use the bucket.

I'm chasing my tail right now. Know a guy with a fabrication shop several miles down road. He said he could come by and do it.... then h as disappeared and I hear crickets.

My wife's brother has a welder AND he's coming here (from New Orleans).... I thought this weekend but it might not be for two more weeks.


So I debate all that verses just buying something and moving on. I found a stick welder but I concluded it wanted to be plugged into a 50 amp circuit. I don't have one of those and am unsure the issues of putting it into say a 30 or 40 (I have several open slots in my garage and can add one quite easily, in fact, I probably already have some breakers laying around)

Got to thinking just this morning..... can I go RENT one!!?? Then I again, chase my tail.... money to rent verses a bit more to just buy.....



If I don't get something done soon, this might turn into the Pallets in the Field thread.....

 

[Industrial Toys]

I am not sure penetrating oil works, but I do try and use it. The longer the better and sometimes I hit the thing in question with a propane torch just to get the oil in there a bit more (possibly).

 

[KWentling]

Sounds like either a grade 8 bolt or an actual set screw. Either will work harden if your bit is dull, and then it's almost impossible to drill with anything short of carbide. Speaking of which, a masonry bit (not chisel point) can work in a pinch. I'd try the slot and impact screwdriver bit. As far as welders, be aware that welding outside with a wire machine limits you to flux core wire
if there is much of a breeze. Stick welding a nut on what looks to be a 3/8" bolt is going to be tuff for a novice. Welding a washer and then the nut to the washer is easier.

 

[Industrial Toys]

NOTHING has to be as much fun as trying to drill out something like that and just hearing the bit scream. Like I said though, a sharp industrial bit will do wonders, even in work hardened material. Often, you get what you pay for.

 

[Jstpssng]

I would buy a welder and be done with it. If you own equipment- especially older machinery- you will find it to be an invaluable tool. (Plus welding is rather addictive.) At the very least your BIL won't need to haul his down, although he may opt to anyways.
As somebody mentioned you will want to practice first, but you can even do that while trying other methods to get it out.

We had a similar problem with the tierod end of my father's last snowsled . I told my brother several times that the welded nut was the proper tool for the job, but he took it to a "machinist" friend of his. The guy drilled it, bunging the threads up so John used JB Weld to put it back together.

 

[TractorGuy]

Go to the hardware store and get yourself a cobalt bit or two. I would start with a 1/4".

Do not put constant pressure on as you drill. Release pressure on the drill periodically. Use a slow to medium speed that won't overheat the bit and metal. Don't let the bit bind and break off in the hole. If it starts to catch slightly increase speed and reduce pressure.

Try to drill all the way to the pin.

 

[California]

If you don't have a welder and want something inexpensive and easy to use, I got one of these: Titanium Easy-Flux 125 Amp Welder

It has turned out to be surprisingly easy to use and effective. I used it to repair my gate. Cost me less than getting a professional welder to do the job AND I've got the machine to do other projects.

One word of advice, cobble up something to practice on before tackling the job.

Good luck.

I've read good things about that Titanium welder #56355 but its in the Closeout section of today's HF email.

OP, the way that bolt is stuck in there it has a large heat sink. That welder may not have the guts to weld to that. I don't think anyone aside from a experienced weldor should attempt welding to this bolt, too easy for a beginner to make a mess.

I would grind it concave so a center punch won't drift off center. Then with better quality tools, center punch, drill (with left hand drill if available), square ez-out. If that won't do it, clean up the flammable hydraulic fluid nearby and bring in a professional weldor to weld on a washer then a nut on top of that.

 

[TractorGuy]

X2 on the square type ez out. I have never had luck with the tapered spiral type.

I have also use a concrete nail and adjustable wrench for smaller diameters. Don't think that will work here though.