FEL Diagnosis

[woolyAcres]

I think there is pressure when its up but not moving to hold it up. Cut tractor off with it in air and see how long it holds up. The pressure may be to hold it up?

I know the rear 3PT will drop. I'll have to time it tomorrow. It won't drop from full height to the ground in a matter of minutes. But without timing it I can't say for sure. My guess is 30-45minutes for it to drop.

 

[clemsonfor]

Oh then thats good!! I have replaced the oring in the valve and the piston oring on the piston and mine will probably my drop that fast or faster.

 

[Egon]

With a load in the bucket greater than the tractor can handle pressure goes up to ~1000psi. Unfortunately I don't have anything too heavy for the rear. I think this box blade is the heaviest thing that will fit my cat1 hitch. I've got a cat2 back blade but that won't attach.

It surely looks like you have proved the pump is good.

 

[winston1]

The only (possibly) useful photo I have of the control valve is below. There look to be a couple 'plugs' on one side. Maybe that set screw is under one of these.

I would think the relief valve might be the long looking plug middle right of your picture.

 

[PILOON]

(I would think the relief valve might be the long looking plug middle right of your picture)

That probably is a screw cap under which will be the adjustment which may want spacers or have a nut and screw that you tighten to increase pressure setting.

Plugs on the side I would believe are for 'power beyond' installation.

 

[Leejohn]

(I would think the relief valve might be the long looking plug middle right of your picture)

That probably is a screw cap under which will be the adjustment which may want spacers or have a nut and screw that you tighten to increase pressure setting.

Plugs on the side I would believe are for 'power beyond' installation.

That looks more like detented float cover to me.

 

[woolyAcres]

That looks more like detented float cover to me.

Any idea if/how these covers remove? There are two covered 'ports' here. The long one the PILOON pointed out and a second shorter one. I tried (not very hard) to unscrew the longer one. But I'm not sure they DO unscrew. Finding and adjusting this relief would be a good test. I've ordered my new loader valve but it's going to require some new hoses and fittings so I won't be able to get it installed right away. Upping the relief pressure might help this FEL while I'm stuck using this old valve.

 

[winston1]

Wouldn't happen to be a Gresen valve would it. Maybe a cap nut right to the left of the left control handle? Just reaching, looks sort of like yours. 1958 310B Front Loader Valve - Yesterday's Tractors

 

[woolyAcres]

@winston1

That loader valve you linked to looks pretty similar but I don't think it's quite right. Mine is an AICO. I think this is the standard valve yanmar (and Great Bend?) used on their loaders. My valve is just like California's. I know he replaced his rather than repair it. I can't remember if it was more expensive to repair than to replace or if it wasn't repairable.

I didn't have time today to fiddle with the loader valve. By the time I get back home (Friday night) the new valve will probably be here. I'll need to get some adapters if I want to plumb it in as a replacement. But now I'm concerned about the back pressure that seems pretty constant in my hydraulic system. I don't want to damage a brand new valve. I guess I can use it with the 3PT always on the ground (to avoid the 800-1000psi), but when I need some rear ballast what would I do?

I'm still toying with the idea of using that front-mounted pump and side mounted reservoir. I really think all that setup needs is a filter and some splicing to get the fluid to the loader valve. I've got a valve for it and the pressure gauge so maybe I can rig that up to see if it will build up pressure....

 

[winston1]

I am confident you are going to succeed whichever route you take. Although finding a resevoir opening to use with power beyond may be difficult on your 240 it still remains the "correct" way to plumb your new valve. Of course if you go with the front pump you take that out of the picture.

What valve did you order?

 

[woolyAcres]

Here's the valve I ordered. It can be made to have PowerBeyond but I think that would require a replacement part.

My preference is to use the front pump and have the FEL separate from the 3PT. There are just a number of unknowns with the front pump. It does turn, but will it pump up pressure? I can't figure out what model it is so I have no idea what the volume should be. However, based solely on the hose size, it's probably 6GPM or more. I think it's using 3/4" hoses. It's certainly MUCH larger than the 3/8" that are currently plumbed from the diverter valve on the 3PT to my loader valve. I think I'd also need to plumb in a filter. Buried somewhere in my other thread I tried to explain the way that front pump is plumbed. The hoses simply go from the front pump to the reservoir and back. Which really makes no sense so maybe it doesn't work right and instead of tearing all that off, previous owners simply re-attached it so it wouldn't drag around and gave up on it.

At the moment it basically boils down to money. I'd really like to get this all setup on the front pump. But I don't know what parts work and what parts need replacing. I think I'll focus on figuring that out before going too far with the new valve. The hoses sizes between the front pump/system and the rear are pretty different so I don't want to buy a bunch of adapters just to test it out with the rear system only to turn around and change everything to the front pump. The back pressure that's so persistent in my system also has me concerned about damaging this new valve.

I might be able to find a few parts around my dad's farm to test out the pressure on the front pump. I have a single spool valve left over from that monstrous 3PT PTO pump I removed. I think all I really need is a relief valve and maybe a hose? I can hopefully put my pressure valve in the circuit to see if the front pump is good. If so, that's definitely the way I'll go.

 

[woolyAcres]

I had some time, and help today, and figured out that the front pump on this tractor DOES work!

I'm going to layout a setup that will utilize the front pump to power the FEL. This system will have its own pump, filter, fluid, and reservoir. This will eliminate the issues of back pressure from the 3PT that I haven't figured out and will hopefully make the loader operate faster and be simpler to maintain and repair. The reservoir is already mounted so all I really need to do is figure out where/how to mount a filter (suction, pressure, or return line) buy the correct length hoses and get system flushed and mounted. While doing this I'll replace the hoses that lead from the loader valve to the fixed lines and a couple others.

It'll probably take me a few weeks to get everything sorted out, purchased, and attached but I'm very excited about the possibilities.

 

[clemsonfor]

Thats good news!

How did you test it for sure? I know you had some rubber coupler that you fashioned up but did you use that to acutally develop pressure and work it with a load on it..or buy some couplers at the store or somethi9ng?

 

[woolyAcres]

I canalized some hydraulic parts from the rear PTO driven pump for testing. All the plumbing on the front pump is 3/4". The reservoir to pump was already in place. I took the valve off the PTO setup and put that in between the pump and the reservoir. Using the rubber muffler bushing I cut to fit last time I used some 1/4" shear bolts to connect the hydraulic pump to the front engine mount. Using the big 3/4" valve I was able to watch fluid flow in a circle when the control was in neutral. When I moved the lever in either direction the pressure started climbing (I'd plugged the ports on that valve). I watched the gauge move up past 2500psi. I don't know what the pressure relief setting is on that valve but 2500 is more than enough for me so I backed it down.

What I need to figure out now is where/how to mount a filter and where to mount my new loader valve. Good problems to have