Oil & Fuel Diesel break-in

DFB · Mar 9, 2003

Deere also sells it. Its supposedly a 10w30 non-detergent oil. Spec'd out for use up to the first 100 hrs of service. New engines come with it. According to the hype "High-quality premium engine oils should not be used as a break-in oil." You can check it all out here. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif http://www.frontierequip.com/library/breakinoil.htm

DFB

thcri · Mar 9, 2003

INSTRUCTIONS
New John Deere engines are filled at the factory with John Deere Engine Break-In Oil. During the break-in period, add John Deere Engine Break-In Oil (part number TY22057) as needed to maintain the specified oil level.

Change the oil and filter after the first 100 hours of operation of a new or rebuilt engine

I like the term "AFTER" In other words too early is not so good???

murph

bgott · Mar 9, 2003

"in the case of a Kubota that would probably be their Kubota branded oil."

I doubt it. They more than likely use the cheapest oil they can buy that meets specs. That Kubota branded oil is there to sell to you at a premium price.

TresCrows · Mar 10, 2003

"I doubt it. They more than likely use the cheapest oil they can buy that meets specs. That Kubota branded oil is there to sell to you at a premium price. "

Nah, I use Mobil 1. Oh boy, an oil thread and darn but I got to go out of town just when it is getting good and miss all the fun, drats. So, let's see, Kubota uses the cheapest oil they can find that meets spec and JD has a special "break-in" wonder oil but Kubota only uses cheap oil--hmmm--guess it was a good thing I changed that cheap oil out early and put in the Mobil 1. Being a born skeptic, I suspect that those barrels of break-in oil complete with part numbers are that cheap oil that barely meets specs.
Oil is such a fun topic, snake oil salesman everywhere and even two headed guys and ladys with beards and here I go going out of town! Shucks. Hey, y'all thrash this break-it oil thread out for me and give me a report when I get back. Somewhere out there is a guy that ran break-in oil in his tractor for the first 5,000 hours without a change and his tractor is just getting, ah, broke-in, I can feel it coming. Everyone, be safe and have a fine week. J, born to be a skeptic

bigpete · Mar 10, 2003

Well, since I started all this maybe I can close it up.

First, I just confirmed with my dealer's shop tech that JD does ship all it tractors with break-in oil. The same oil is available at retail. The part number mentioned above is a part number for dealers in Canada. The U.S. part number is TY22041 for the gallon size. The break-in oil is also sold in 5 gallon pails and 55 gallon drums.

I looked up the part in JD's on-line parts oredring system and there is considerable information in a brochure-type format. I have attached a picture of the product but should not attach the web page as I believe it is copyrighted. Here are the specs posted with the product:

 A special-blend oil developed to be used in rebuilt or remanufactured engines and new John Deere engines during the break-in period. Identical to John Deere factory-fill break-in oil.

The first 100 hours of operation is critical to the life and performance of an engine.
During the first hours of operation, the rings and liners must seat (establish a pattern of surface mating) for proper performance. If this does not occur, the life of the engine can be adversely affected.
High-quality premium engine oils should not be used as a break-in oil. The superior anti-wear characteristics of premium oils will inhibit the proper matching of components, which could result in excessive oil consumption

Illus. 92017

Applications

Excellent oil for new or rebuilt non-John Deere engines. Engine rebuild instructions should be consulted to determine if special requirements are needed

Features

Contains special additives to control piston ring and liner seating without scuffing
These additives allow rings and liners to seat while protecting valve train and gears from wear. Piston rings and liners establish a good wear pattern for maximum performance and extended engine life

Chemical and physical properties

Property Units ASTM method Break-in oil

Viscosity - mm2/s (cSt) D-445
40 degrees C 65.5
100 degrees C 10.4

Pour point degrees C D-97
-33

Flash point (min.) degrees C D-92
215

Total base no. mg KOH/g D-2896
7.5

Ash level percent mass D-874
1.02

Viscosity index - 145 HTHS, 150 degrees C D-624
3.1
Order information

Product number
Description
Size Pkg. qty.

U.S.
TY22041
Break-in oil
1 gal.
6

TY22042
Break-in oil
55 gal.
1

TY22088
Break-in oil
5 gal.
1

Canada

TY22057
Break-in oil
4L
4

CXTY22088
Break-in oil
20L pail
1 

I didn't see anything about snake oil in there, but I don't understand any of that gobble-dee--gook anyway. I suppose there could be traces.... /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Whether Kubota uses a break-in oil or not is beyond the scope of my research. If they do, I sincerely doubt it would be the "cheapest stuff available" as suggested above.

My shop tech said changing out the break-in oil certainly wouln't hurt a thing, but using a complex, high-tech oil early on would not allow everything to seat correctly. He told me to knock myself out and put in fresh break-in oil at around 25 hours, but to use the Plus 50 15W-40 at 50 hours. He thought the refresh on break-in oil would actually be a good thing to remove any small shavings from the filter and remove other by products. BTW, the break-in oil is about $11.75 a gallon, in-stock at my dealer.

Anonymous Poster · Mar 10, 2003

( The superior anti-wear characteristics of premium oils will inhibit the proper matching of components...)

Almost sounds like you should use the cheap stuff /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

wdn · Mar 10, 2003

My dealer did the original oil change at 50 hours, then I changed it at 100 hours and plan to stay on 100 hour intervals just like it says in the book. I use Mobil Delvac 1300 Super in 15W40 weight. When I changed the oil at 100 hours the oil was not black at all. I have 150 hours on it now so expect to change the again sometime around July. I have a BX2200. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Egon · Mar 10, 2003

Darn, got the information to late.

Changed oil in my Kubota at about 6 hours and then at 75 hour intervals and 1700 some hours later it's not using any oil.

Changed oil on the cummings at about 1000 miles and for some reason at 100,000 miles it doesn't use any oil either.

Egon

bigpete · Mar 10, 2003

That'll teach ya', Egon! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I started the thread just trying to figure out the BEST thing to do. Don't know that I've ever done the RIGHT thing when it comes to machines. When I changed my oil on my late, great 445 at 50 hours, I learned that I should have done the first one at 5 hours. I changed it every 25 hours for awhile to make up the difference /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif and never saw a drop of oil leave that engine, except through the drain plug.

bgott · Mar 11, 2003

I didn't say " cheapest oil available", I said "cheapest oil that will meet specs". We know that the JD break-in oil, at $11.75 a gallon, is not the cheapest oil available but we don't know the cost on it, either. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Egon · Mar 11, 2003

Must have done something right if all the oil had to come out of the drain plug.

The type of oil, breakin period, rpm and loading for breaking in have so many options as to resemble a book of fairy tales.

The best way to handle all this information is to form a committe to determine the absoulte best solutions. But while waiting for the report best do what you think is best cause the wait may be a long time .

Egon

CTyler · Mar 11, 2003

( The best way to handle all this information is to form a committe... )

Before we can go forward on this we need to put together a task team to form a committe. The committe will then assess all the past information and ideas on engine breakin and why they were scrapped. Then a sub committe can be formed to explore the validity of current breakin procedures and thier benfits. Once that is completed a new committe will be assigned to assess the benfits and procedures of the current breakin process' that are in place. The existing committies will not be disbanded as they can advise and provide insight toward future processes.

Signed "Enter your favorite Sentaors name here"

bigpete · Mar 11, 2003

I didn't say " cheapest oil available", I said "cheapest oil that will meet specs". 

Sorry for the mis-quote. You are not far off. I read on the Frontier link in an earlier message that you can use oils of a lesser spec if break-in oil is not available. Given a choice, I'd go ahead and use the specialy break-in oil just so I could show the receipt if something went wrong with a tractor under warranty.

bigpete · Mar 11, 2003

I have already applied for the Federal grant funding. I'll let you know how that goes... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Anonymous Poster · Mar 11, 2003

We will also need a way to fund the committes. I suggest that we add a 10 cents a gallon tax to fuel to pay for this. Of course, like all taxes, we will eliminate the tax when we are finished with the project. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Anonymous Poster · Mar 11, 2003

And of course like regulating bodies everywhere, we will of course exempt ourselves from the tax we apply on everyone else...

bigpete · Mar 11, 2003

...and the exemption should apply to members of our immediate and removed families. But they will be adjunct staffers to the committee anyway, so I guess all we need to do is exempt the committee and staffers. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

TresCrows · Mar 14, 2003

Oh joy, you guys have fully surpassed my expectations but I should not have expected less from TBN tractor elitist.

"We will also need a way to fund the committes. I suggest that we add a 10 cents a gallon tax to fuel to pay for this."

I suggest instead we tax the snake oil--wait--the special break-in oil that is like cheap oil except it meets specs whereas cheap oil does not but will do as well but may void warranty while snake oil--oops--wait--I mean break-it oil will not void warrantys but might cost more than cheap oil especially if granted a special John Deere part number even if it has been rebadged--wait that is Yanamar that is rebadged--drats, I am loosing my focus here /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gifand --well---I am glad this has all been cleared up. Now, uh, on that commitee thing for the Preservation of the Freedom to Pay More for Less even if it has a Special Part Number for the Oil commitee--how do I get in on that Federal grant? We could study this for decades and yet always need but another study to reach a conclusion. Focus Groups anyone? Howabout a support group?--uh, like something along the lines of "Break-in Oil Addicts United Against Cheap Oil Substitutes"
Hey, just messing with y'all /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif.
J, born to be a skeptic

bigpete · Mar 15, 2003

support group?--uh, like something along the lines of "Break-in Oil Addicts United Against Cheap Oil Substitutes"


J.,

That group actually has splintered and the addicts have adopted a twelve-step recovery program method, while the Cheap Oil Substitue Sub-committee will return to its deliberations after the spring break ends in mid-July. The per-diem salary vote took place in you absence, and because we had a quorum, we were able to extend our compensation for the full duration of the spring break period. /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif The next salary increase vote will take place August 1. You have already missed the caucus session for that vote so I assume you will tarry along the party line again.(?) /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif The tentative schedule ends the summer session August 18 when we break for the holiday season. We will meet on November 30 for a special winnter oil session. I know it's tough to break away during the holidays, but this will be our last meeting until the holiday break is up in February 2004.

TresCrows · Mar 15, 2003

bigpete, I have to tell you that you may well be one of the few people on the planet who can tit for tat me /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif. Dare say that even JMIII gets exasperated with me and has gone off seeking more brochures/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif.
J