And I thought the Purolator filter was small.....

[3930dave]

If a smaller filter is still able to filter properly, I would think the advantage to be more oil in the engine at all times.

Hi MrChris - not sure I follow you. (Need more coffee here )

Did you mean that with a larger can filter, you end up having (slightly) more oil contained in the lubrication system ?

Rgds, D.

 

[MrChris]

Hi MrChris - not sure I follow you. (Need more coffee here )

Did you mean that with a larger can filter, you end up having (slightly) more oil contained in the lubrication system ?

Rgds, D.

Less oil in smaller filter means more oil lubricating engine. This would be more significant in smaller engines.

 

[timswi]

Less oil in smaller filter means more oil lubricating engine. This would be more significant in smaller engines.

I'm not following this line of thought at all...If the filter port is capped or you have a 20 gallon filter, the same amount is in the pan. Please correct my line of thought.

 

[mikehaugen]

I'm not following this line of thought at all...If the filter port is capped or you have a 20 gallon filter, the same amount is in the pan. Please correct my line of thought.

these are my thoughts as well, a larger filter will require a little more oil to be put into the pan once the oil circulates, but will still have the same amount in cicrculation.

 

[timswi]

these are my thoughts as well, a larger filter will require a little more oil to be put into the pan once the oil circulates, but will still have the same amount in cicrculation.

Yes...I had a '77 K5 Blazer with a built and dyno'd 406 with a remote filter that held at least 2 quarts...The dipstick still had the same reading after adding 8 quarts at change time---It also had a deep sump pan.

 

[MrChris]

Lets say we want to follow a molecule of oil in our engine system. It's basically going to be in 1 of 3 places. Moving through the engine lubricating, sitting in the pan or sitting in the filter. Basically it's spending 1/3 of it's time in the engine. If we remove the filter, now it will either be in the engine or in the pan, thus spending 1/2 of it's time in the engine. Now lets make the pan really small so that our oil molecule is spending most all of it's time in the engine. Now in x amount of time if we add the filter back, as we increase the size of the filter, isn't the oil molecule going to spend more if it's time in the filter and less in the engine or pan? I know this is over simplified and we're definitely splitting hairs but I just think if we can use a smaller filter and still have proper filtration, wouldn't more oil be spending more of it's time lubricating the engine? And that's all I'm gonna say about that!

 

[mikehaugen]

Lets say we want to follow a molecule of oil in our engine system. It's basically going to be in 1 of 3 places. Moving through the engine lubricating, sitting in the pan or sitting in the filter. Basically it's spending 1/3 of it's time in the engine. If we remove the filter, now it will either be in the engine or in the pan, thus spending 1/2 of it's time in the engine. Now lets make the pan really small so that our oil molecule is spending most all of it's time in the engine. Now in x amount of time if we add the filter back, as we increase the size of the filter, isn't the oil molecule going to spend more if it's time in the filter and less in the engine or pan? I know this is over simplified and we're definitely splitting hairs but I just think if we can use a smaller filter and still have proper filtration, wouldn't more oil be spending more of it's time lubricating the engine? And that's all I'm gonna say about that!

This is not really a correct way of looking at it. Oil is going to travel through the engine at the same speed regardless and therefore spend the same amount of time in it. Whether it is in the pan or in the filter really doesn't matter, but with a larger filter you increase the overall capacity of the system, so it will take more oil to fill the system. Therefore, each drop of oil will spend less time in the engine (correct) but there will be other oil to spend time in the engine, actually increasing the longevity of the oil (though a negligible amount).

Hey... it's New Years Eve- let's all get drunk and have a good time, and think about what we can do with out tractors in the new year!

 

[timswi]

This is not really a correct way of looking at it. Oil is going to travel through the engine at the same speed regardless and therefore spend the same amount of time in it. Whether it is in the pan or in the filter really doesn't matter, but with a larger filter you increase the overall capacity of the system, so it will take more oil to fill the system. Therefore, each drop of oil will spend less time in the engine (correct) but there will be other oil to spend time in the engine, actually increasing the longevity of the oil (though a negligible amount).

Hey... it's New Years Eve- let's all get drunk and have a good time, and think about what we can do with out tractors in the new year![/QUOTE]

Yup...:drink:

 

[DEWFPO]

In my personal experience, the only negative I have found to using a larger than OE oil filter occurs when the filter orientation is not vertical (hole end up). If the filter is mounted, canted, sideways, or upside down (hole at the bottom), ALL filters drain regardless of the type of material used in the Anti-DrainBack Valve. This causes a delay of oil pressure buildup on cold startup, especially an over night start up or after several days. It is noticeable and measurable. Other than that there are no drawbacks that i have experienced. So, if your oil filter is oriented properly, you can use the biggest oil filter you can find (as long as it meets or exceed the engine manufacturers specs on filtration and capacity. But if your one of those types that changes your oil too frequently, your not really getting any benefit out of the larger filter other than increased oil capacity, which is always good.

DEWFPO

 

[Shadow99]

Had a '96 Mazda 2.0 ltr that used a remote-filter assembly with twin filters, increased oil capacity & filtration. Car had 662,000 miles on it before it started rusting away faster than I could repair it, motor still ran like a champ, didn't leak or burn any oil. Stole motor & 5 sp tranny out of car (for future project) & scrapped the rest.
Shadow

 

[Diamondpilot]

Chris - in terms of media, did you crack 'em open and roll them out, or was that based on estimating drained weight ?

(I trust your assessment, either way).

When you say Nissan, I'm thinking big pickup.

Rgds, D.

No and yes. I found on many manufactures sites such as Fram and Wix they will give you the info or you can talk them. They give the info in square inches of media. I have also cut about 100 filters in my life and just did a eyeball comparison.

Agian, this will vary with filter quality.

Chris

 

[crazyal]

Here's a cut away of a Toyota filter, just in case somebody has never seen inside one.

 

[3930dave]

Had a '96 Mazda 2.0 ltr that used a remote-filter assembly with twin filters, increased oil capacity & filtration. Car had 662,000 miles on it before it started rusting away faster than I could repair it, motor still ran like a champ, didn't leak or burn any oil. Stole motor & 5 sp tranny out of car (for future project) & scrapped the rest.
Shadow

Many people haven't seen high end upgraded industrial filter systems. Your example is a good illustration of what can be accomplished.

Rgds, D.

 

[3930dave]

Here's a cut away of a Toyota filter, just in case somebody has never seen inside one.
View attachment 295941

Funky fold pattern, hadn't seen that one b4. Not sure how it would perform re. trapping chunks, compared to a standard pattern. Doesn't matter to me (or anybody else changing on sched), just musing on near-end of life state.....

Lotsa media !

Rgds, D.

 

[MrChris]

Here's an opened Denso filter from a Mitsubishi diesel engine. It's a hard sponge-like solid material.

 

[3930dave]

Here's an opened Denso filter from a Mitsubishi diesel engine. It's a hard sponge-like solid material.

Japanese OE spec'd stuff is usually v. good quality. Would be interesting to know the micron rating on that material - hadn't seen that either !

Guess I need to get cracking !

Rgds, D.

 

[Shadow99]

Almost ANY motor can be adapted with a remote filter setup, this not only increases filter surface-area & capacity but allows you to mount the filter(s) where it is most convienent for you. Their's no doubt that the extra filtration I added to the old Mazda, helped in preserving the life of the engine.

Shadow

 

[clemsonfor]

ThaT 14459 filter is common on many applications. Its a common asain filter. Honda uses it, Toyota uses it, it also fits and is speced for my 97 Saturn and also fits and used on my kholer lawnmower engine as well as many briggs engines.

 

[3930dave]

ThaT 14459 filter is common on many applications. Its a common asain filter. Honda uses it, Toyota uses it, it also fits and is speced for my 97 Saturn and also fits and used on my kholer lawnmower engine as well as many briggs engines.

True ! That PN was stuck in my head already..... from a Hyundai I took off the road in '95 ! Does get around.

Rgds, D.

 

[clemsonfor]

This is not really a correct way of looking at it. Oil is going to travel through the engine at the same speed regardless and therefore spend the same amount of time in it. Whether it is in the pan or in the filter really doesn't matter, but with a larger filter you increase the overall capacity of the system, so it will take more oil to fill the system. Therefore, each drop of oil will spend less time in the engine (correct) but there will be other oil to spend time in the engine, actually increasing the longevity of the oil (though a negligible amount).

Hey... it's New Years Eve- let's all get drunk and have a good time, and think about what we can do with out tractors in the new year!

I agree