58 MPG by 2032

[nickfank]

Did I miss the cost of your solar system as a factor in the cost of your transportation or were your panels free.

Free panels would be wonderful, but alas...

The cost of the solar array is the basis for the $0.02/mile fuel cost.

To arrive at that value, I spread the up-front cost over the 30 year warranty period for the system, including inverters, then divided by the energy they'll provide over that period. (The warranty provides me with the minimum they'll produce at the end of that period.) That works out to a cost of $0.06 cents per kWh. My two EVs both average 4 miles/kWh, so the actual cost for the energy to run the cars is $0.015/mile, but I don't want to over-sell the benefit, so I round up to $0.02.

Note that I later updated that post to include the cost of road use tax, since that's built in to everyone else's fuels expense, and should be included for an accurate comparison.

If you're interested in the gory details, I'm willing to share the spreadsheet, but that's the high-level answer.

Of course the other cost is the two EVs, but I paid $15k for one of them and $25k for the other, both with under 10k on the odometer, so they really weren't more expensive than a used ICE car of similar mileage. I called that even, and focused on the fuel & maintenance as the actual difference.

 

[nickfank]

A few things to think about----
1.Government can and does control what you do and purchase by -- Making current technology too expensive or controls the amount available for the consumer to purchase. For example limits the amount of available motor fuels by legislating for "cleaner" emissions.
Buys up (with your tax dollars) or controls the amount of fuels shipped to an area. This alone can make fuels unaffordable. Legislate emissions and efficiency for engine to a to a point manufacturers cannot reasonably meet them or it raise the price so high you cannot afford to purchase a vehicle. Example 1. incandescent light bulbs. 2. Ice emissions 3. vehicle efficiency as MPG. The VW Rabbit diesel got 50+ MPG but was killed over emissions.

2. Controlling what you purchase -- as the incandescent bulbs, "safety" fuel cans, the toilet you can purchase, the dishwasher, the range that is available, oxygenated fuels (ethanol), what weed killer you purchase, must be included treatment system for vehicle exhaust, the starter rope attachment on your push mower, the reverse switch on your riding mower, the back up alarm on equipment, and on and on. Small pickups were killed because of fuel mileage.

3. Any computer controlled vehicle can be shut down by law enforcement -- ask the criminal that got shut down.

4. Trying to convince you that EV's are pollution free. Guess the mining and transport of raw material doesn't pollute? or the manufacturing? or the fossil fuel used to generate the electric to manufacture and recharge? or the tire dust from the heavier EV's? Just read an article that New York city has had more battery caused fires which have caused more deaths than the Corvair caused nationwide. Thanks Ralph time for an sequel.

If it sounds like I am trying to pick a fight -- Nope. Just get tired of people polishing the fender to a bright luster when the engine belches smoke and the frame is rotted thru.

And one parting word -- Get out and vote, but before you do be sure you know who and what you are voting for. People you vote for are responsible for the laws and regulations that become law. It is time our lawmaker stop hiding behind parties and are responsible for their own actions. By the way have you talked with your representative lately? He doesn't know your thoughts unless you tell him.

Regarding #4, Nobody is stupid enough to claim that EVs don't pollute. They simply pollute much less, are cheaper to operate, and more fun. There's no reason to let demands for perfect keep us from better.


I'd be interested in your sources for the following:

The VW Rabbit diesel got 50+ MPG but was killed over emissions.

Small pickups were killed because of fuel mileage.

Any computer controlled vehicle can be shut down by law enforcement

Like you, not trying to pick a fight. Just interested in the truth and eager to learn. Sometimes that involves a spirited debate, but it doesn't have to be a fight if we're all civil and care about the truth more than we each care about winning an argument.

 

[Deleted member 371759]

Regarding #4, Nobody is stupid enough to claim that EVs don't pollute. They simply pollute much less. There's no reason to let demands for perfect keep us from better.


I'd be interested in your sources for the following:




Like you, not trying to pick a fight. Just interested in the truth and eager to learn. Sometimes that involves a spirited debate, but it doesn't have to be a fight if we're all civil and care about the truth more than we each care about winning an argument.

Here's the deal man... I need trucks. I don't commute daily to work but I do drive to get hay, grain, farm supplies (fencing, posts, wood, pipe) firewood, transport livestock. I live in the hills of north Arkansas and 100% need 4x4. Why are you on a forum that is about tractors which are mostly diesel used in rural communities trying to enlighten me on the virtues of electric cars? I don't even have a freaking car.

 

[nickfank]

Here's the deal man... I need trucks. I don't commute daily to work but I do drive to get hay, grain, farm supplies (fencing, posts, wood, pipe) firewood, transport livestock. I live in the hills of north Arkansas and 100% need 4x4. Why are you on a forum that is about tractors which are mostly diesel used in rural communities trying to enlighten me on the virtues of electric cars? I don't even have a freaking car.

That's completely fine. I'll quickly go back and delete the posts where I told you that you don't have a legitimate need for your truck or tractor... Hmmm... Where are those posts?

If you look back over this thread, you'll notice that:

1) I didn't start this thread.
2) I've never told anyone they shouldn't use their ICE Trucks or Tractors. (I use both. That's why I'm on a tractor forum...)
3) I didn't bother responding to this obviously off-topic thread until it had been rolling for two weeks and other people started posting false information about EVs and renewable energy. At that point, I thought it made sense for someone who had actual experience with both to contribute to the conversation.

3-1/2) I'm not the guy who took us off on the topic of the open source software you use on your Internet routers in a tractor forum... I share your interest, but I'm almost certain you'll never have to prime the injector pump on your router.

I joined this forum years ago in order to get some advice about repairing my old Powermaster 861, and my (yes... diesel) TC30, both of which get daily use on our small farm. This forum has been a great resource, especially for the 861.

Someday, I expect I'll have an electric tractor and truck, but that day is far off, and until then I'm almost as dependent on big oil as you are. I am only responding to the misinformation other people are posting about EVs, or in this case, government regulations that I believe to be untrue.

 

[bnold]

Ahh, when the EV owner must be anti-ICE, but in fact still owns and operates ICE and likes them!!! Oh the horror….

This has been a hilarious spar.

 

[Deleted member 371759]

Totally agree... and I feel the same way about all of diesel pickup trucks with their exhaust systems carefully tuned to sound like a semi. Every time I hear one, I think "There goes a guy who doesn't realize that sound is a clear signal to the rest of us that he's insecure about his masculinity."

Ahh, when the EV owner must be anti-ICE, but in fact still owns and operates ICE and likes them!!! Oh the horror….

This has been a hilarious spar.

Likes his, just dislikes/insults other people who like theirs in the wrong way. Typical

 

[mikester]

People buy what they need to tow or haul passengers, not what the gov thinks they should buy.

People buy what they "think" they need which is why our roads are full of 8,000+ lbs 4x4 SUVs and jacked up quad quad cab 4x4 pickup trucks with 4 foot beds. 99% of the time these are single person commuter vehicles with nothing in the beds.

IMHO if you don't have an 8' bed its not a real pickup truck. SUV's are just oversized and over powered 4WD minivans used by soccer moms to drive their kids to school because they are too lazy to get their kids on the school bus at 7:30am.

 

[oosik]

I own a single vehicle. A 2019 Ram 2500 Power Wagon. For 60+ years I have owned high mileage, eco-friendly, socially approved vehicles. I've always wanted a power wagon. And BY GOLLY - before I croak, I decided I'd get one.

I REALLY DON'T care if it offends. I've done my due diligence. I'm going to enjoy what is left.

 

[nickfank]

Likes his, just dislikes/insults other people who like theirs in the wrong way. Typical

Honestly dude, I've got no problem with diesel trucks.

Yes, I openly laugh at people who spend money to make their truck louder than it has to be or "tunes" it to roll coal. Yes, I'm insulting those people openly. Not sorry. Get over it. Can't believe I'm having to defend myself for that position on a forum of people who are interested in maintaining their equipment well.

The semi and straight I drove in 1983 were both quieter than many of the pickup trucks rolling through our town today, and I'd have been embarrassed if anyone caught me abusing my engine by rolling coal. (Didn't even call it that at the time... It was just how you knew the driver or mechanic were inept.)

 

[nickfank]

This has been a hilarious spar.

Yeah, I think we jumped the shark sometime yesterday morning... Sorry about that!

I keep telling myself not to visit the political threads and just comment on the discussions about maintaining our ICE equipment well, but then the temptation to inject a few thoughts born of (gasp!) actual experience into a discussion of EVs gets the better of me and then I just can't stop. I held out for a whole week after the first anti-EV rant this time.

On the bright side, the thread about PTO-powered chippers this week has been very helpful, and I just ordered one for the TC30. My first non-used purchase ever, so I'm feeling all grown up. Now I've just gotta figure out how to link the controls on it to tik-tok via 5G and power it with the blood of innocent puppies slaughtered by liberal socialists bent on destroying our way of life.