Barndominium/Shop or "real" House?

[ETD66SS]

So why does it have to be China doing this. Why don't we have a similar experience here?

$1100 for a dryer vent elbow..... OK
I don't think I would have told anyone LOL

It is likely the most expensive residential dryer duct elbow in human history. But considering what I paid the HVAC guy to run the ducting and lineset for my AC, I think I would have paid him more than $1100 to figure out and implement a solution.

As far as China getting that AI CNC work. They tout fully robotic CNC machine shops, very little human labor. Not sure how much I believe they are fully robotic but in the West there are likely labor laws fighting such things. Not to mention China really has no environmental standards...

 

[rScotty]

I am using the store bought plastic adapter to go from the flex hose the the oval, but from what I have read, ducting in enclosed areas (walls, floor, ceiling etc) needs to be rigid metal conduit, plastic is a big no-no for fire hazard. Generally it is 4" galvanized steel duct, but aluminum is allowed. The elbow I designed has a resultant 1/4" 6061-T6 aluminum wall thickness. I used woven fiberblass material (exhaust header wrap) between the alum elbow and the lumber to reduce heat conduction to the lumber.

It's important to also insulate the outside of the duct to limit condensation on the inside of the duct. However, since this duct will be in an insulated ceiling of a heated garage, it probbaly does not need the insulation but I'm going to add it anyways.

Once the ceiling is drywalled, I never want to have to think about this dryer duct etc. (other than cleaning via pulling a brush through it).

That's a great project. I'm in awe......

My dryer vent is only about 5 feet long and even so, I completely understand your concerns. Hot dryer gases could be ugly. The long length would bother me more than the roughness inside the pipe. As you know from design work, the length over roughness calcs are true for most closed channel flow like inside pipes - regardless of whether the pipes flow air or liquid.. .

When building our house, there were areas that bothered me inside the drywall. So I built in some hinged access/inspection doors. I've also added some more since then. For long runs I also use an inspection camera on a 100 foot flexible cable.... it works great inside walls and pipes of all kinds. Not expensive at Amazon. I'm surprised at how useful that camera is.

 

[walnutman]

It is likely the most expensive residential dryer duct elbow in human history. But considering what I paid the HVAC guy to run the ducting and lineset for my AC, I think I would have paid him more than $1100 to figure out and implement a solution.

As far as China getting that AI CNC work. They tout fully robotic CNC machine shops, very little human labor. Not sure how much I believe they are fully robotic but in the West there are likely labor laws fighting such things. Not to mention China really has no environmental standards...

You cant really roboticize a one off

 

[ETD66SS]

You cant really roboticize a one off

I guess I wouldn't know.

AI uses tool path software to prepare the quotes, not sure how far off that tech is from actually being able to machine a part.

 

[rScotty]

You cant really roboticize a one off

I didn't know that.
What's the holdup in translating digitized drawings into CNC commands?
Pehaps China can do what we can not?

Caveat: I'm so old fashioned that my mill and lathe are still manual crank type with dials on the handles.....not even CNC. Although I am considering adding 3 axis optical measurement scales this year. That'll be a nice upgrade.

I might add, that having a work shop under a common roof - like in ETD66SS's barndo project here - made building our own barndohouse much more enjoyable as an after hours project. Once the basic frame was dried in, working evenings became a joy.

 

[WinterDeere]

I don't blame companies for outsourcing... it's survival.

... and that's just it. My customers might pretend to care if I say all items are made in USA from US-sourced materials. Maybe they even do... a little.

But in the end, they make their purchase decision on price and spec, not what makes them feel good.

 

[RB5]

That shot of your custom machined part with so many screws holding it down made me laugh. Overkill. And I say that as I think of the time we built a sheet metal cover and walls around an old travel trailer at deer camp. I was getting 10' pallets made with oil treated oak 4x4s and oak 1xs. They were used to ship drive shafts for dump trucks and big trucks. I had a source to get them free. I used those for the posts and framed the walls with them before putting on the sheet metal. The old guys laughed at us and said that wood in the ground would rot. I had to get a small sledge to drive the long spikes into the posts when I framed it. When I was done with the first wall I could not get it to even wiggle. It was still standing 20 years later. I think they eventually tore it down when they cleaned up the camp.

 

[ETD66SS]

That shot of your custom machined part with so many screws holding it down made me laugh. Overkill. And I say that as I think of the time we built a sheet metal cover and walls around an old travel trailer at deer camp. I was getting 10' pallets made with oil treated oak 4x4s and oak 1xs. They were used to ship drive shafts for dump trucks and big trucks. I had a source to get them free. I used those for the posts and framed the walls with them before putting on the sheet metal. The old guys laughed at us and said that wood in the ground would rot. I had to get a small sledge to drive the long spikes into the posts when I framed it. When I was done with the first wall I could not get it to even wiggle. It was still standing 20 years later. I think they eventually tore it down when they cleaned up the camp.

Oddly enough, when I had that part quoted by AI to be machined, it got cheaper when I added more mounting holes.

It must use final part volume in the cost calculation somewhere.

 

[RB5]

Oddly enough, when I had that part quoted by AI to be machined, it got cheaper when I added more mounting holes.

It must use final part volume in the cost calculation somewhere.

That is interesting and you might be right.

 

[ETD66SS]

Installed the laser cut brackets I designed to hold the duct at the correct pitch.

Also got the air test all setup for the living space radiant pex.

I will keep that air pressure on the tubing while I insulate to make sure nothing happens when stapling up bubble foil etc.

 

[WinterDeere]

Installed the laser cut brackets I designed to hold the duct at the correct pitch.

I'm bookmarking that post, as my defense exhibit "A", for the next time I'm accused of being tedious or ana1 retentive.

I've been accused of "overkill" most of my life, but you sir... you take the trophy!

 

[ETD66SS]

I'm bookmarking that post, as my defense exhibit "A", for the next time I'm accused of being tedious or ana1 retentive.

I've been accused of "overkill" most of my life, but you sir... you take the trophy!

The brackets?

Those were actually very cheap. Another AI quoted part, I think they came in at $3 each (Made in USA this time). They were $32 each when I uploaded a 3D model with bent tabs, so I bought a cheap set of leather pliers off Amazon and bent the tabs myself.

 

[WinterDeere]

I do only occasional sheet metal work, most of what I do is machined parts, but I do have two sheet metal jobs coming up. One would normally be laser or chemical etched .010 copper foil with a silver plate and a row of holes used as a large electrical contact in a stripline application, another is a stainless steel wear plate for an old belt sander.

I'm curious, where you submit these jobs to for fab? I usually just use one of two or three local shops, but they're not great on low-volume pricing or response times.

 

[ETD66SS]

I do only occasional sheet metal work, most of what I do is machined parts, but I do have two sheet metal jobs coming up. One would normally be laser or chemical etched .010 copper foil with a silver plate and a row of holes used as a large electrical contact in a stripline application, another is a stainless steel wear plate for an old belt sander.

I'm curious, where you submit these jobs to for fab? I usually just use one of two or three local shops, but they're not great on low-volume pricing or response times.

Xometry

 

[ETD66SS]

Started on the insulation today. Gonna take me a while...

 

[dieselscout80]

Dryer ducting was a project in itself. Designed my own custom oval to round elbow in 3D CAD and had it CNC machined as opposed to using the store bought elbows that are not smooth flow.

Also bought a large radius 45 degree elbow to connect to the custom to make a full 90 degree bend while clearing all the nearby plumbing. This ducting will be encased in the garage ceiling and I don't want to be cutting out drywall at a later date to mess with it.

I backed myself into a corner on this because the 2X6 wall for all this plumbing fell partially on top of a floor truss, so needed the oval to pass by the truss top chord without notching.

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I also designed some sheet metal brackets that I am getting laser cut that I will be using to attach the duct to the trusses so I can maintain the correct pitch. Then I'll be wrapping the duct in R6 insulation.

I got approval from the building inspector to start insulation, so once the ducting for both bathrooms is complete, insulating the living space will be the next step, however still waiting on the plumber to come back to finalize the waste venting.

This project is going very slow due to the fact I am rejecting a lot of quotes due to labor costs and doing the work myself. Even if I could afford to just sit back and pay others to do the work, I'm finding that the quality of the work I have paid for just isn't there...

Major COOL !!!

I finished reading the thread and you are insulating it. Are you going to insulate it?

 

[ETD66SS]

Are you going to insulate it?

Yes, it will be wrapped with R6.

 

[CH4Ohio]

Installed the laser cut brackets I designed to hold the duct at the correct pitch.

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Also got the air test all setup for the living space radiant pex.




I will keep that air pressure on the tubing while I insulate to make sure nothing happens when stapling up bubble foil etc.

You should go ahead and send the specs and your proposal to NASA. I think they're just now finalizing design for the Moon station laundry room.

 

[dieselscout80]

You should go ahead and send the specs and your proposal to NASA. I think they're just now finalizing design for the Moon station laundry room.

He needs get it patented first.

 

[RB5]

I'm planning to buy a van to convert into an RV. If I use inspiration from your designs I will need to get a Transit 350 instead of a 250 to carry the extra weight.