Mahindra Tractors-Should You Buy One?

[Deleted member 371759]

Yes. When he gets “top poster of the month” it’s because he trolls every thread and makes genius commentaries. Not even worth my time to reply because he obviously has an axe to grind or needs a life

Reminded me of this. At 51 years old I could give two squats what people think about me or how I live.

 

[mike69440]

Mike69440,

Yes, the Kubota M59 is a real work horse with lots of room for expansion, implement wise, and is an overall very rugged machine. I looked into replacement cost to understand what my risk was if machine was stolen ( insurable amount) or severely damaged. M59 are only available used and at a premium and two months ago I priced a new M62 ( M59 replacement ) at dealer. No M62's available until 1 year after order placed and $95,000. OUCH!!

Based upon your response, it appears you may have misunderstood my previous scribe. I was not comparing the Kubota M59 TLB to the Mahindra Max 24 TLB. I indicated I own both and have used both for many years and was comparing the build quality of each brand based on my experience with the two machines. The Mahindra is clearly a very aggressively priced machine to gain market share and it shows in so many ways in its lesser build quality and choice of lower quality components and lesser protection for its components.

I would not let my L39 go for less than $40,000. There is nothing that could replace it.
Kubota M62 might as well be $100K like some of the F350's you need to tow one. No more middle class in America.
For that money a true construction TLB is available, however the yellow ones may be stronger, but on soft ground and in tight spaces are totally useless. I like these: MECALAC, Excavators, Loaders, Backhoe Loaders, Dumpers and Compaction rollers
For that money, you would think Caterpillar, Yanmar, or Deere, Mahindra even would make a small commercial TLB machine again. Just keep the weight at under 10,000 Lbs, install big tires and a 3 Pt Hitch at $50K to $60K.

 

[Ledgemere Farm]

Reminded me of this. At 51 years old I could give two squats what people think about me or how I live.

I’m 51 too.

 

[Ledgemere Farm]

I would not let my L39 go for less than $40,000. There is nothing that could replace it.
Kubota M62 might as well be $100K like some of the F350's you need to tow one. No more middle class in America.
For that money a true construction TLB is available, however the yellow ones may be stronger, but on soft ground and in tight spaces are totally useless. I like these: MECALAC, Excavators, Loaders, Backhoe Loaders, Dumpers and Compaction rollers
For that money, you would think Caterpillar, Yanmar, or Deere, Mahindra even would make a small commercial TLB machine again. Just keep the weight at under 10,000 Lbs, install big tires and a 3 Pt Hitch at $50K to $60K.

You hit the nail right on the hammer my friend. I used to think I was comfortably middle class, but I don’t think so anymore. $800 to fill your oil barrel,$400 to fill your shopping cart and $80-$100 to fill your truck spoils your income really fast

 

[Deleted member 371759]

You hit the nail right on the hammer my friend. I used to think I was comfortably middle class, but I don’t think so anymore. $800 to fill your oil barrel,$400 to fill your shopping cart and $80-$100 to fill your truck spoils your income really fast

Everything is crazy. I priced some 4 inch structural steel tubing a few days ago. In 13 months its went from $9.50 a foot to $22 a foot. Not a big deal if you need a foot, but when you need 175 feet.. You get the picture.

 

[M59]

Ledgemere Farm,

Just watched your video "5 things I hate about Mahindra" and saw your Max 26 with steel lines. What year is the Max 26?

I will post a pic of the Mahindra love for hydraulic hose on the Max 24 next time I am visit property where it currently resides, probably mid Sept.

Ledgemere Farm,

Here is pic of Mahindra's love of hydraulic hose on Max24. No hydraulic tubing anywhere on the machine.

Looks like you got the expensive model.

 

[Deleted member 371759]

Ledgemere Farm,

Here is pic of Mahindra's love of hydraulic hose on Max24. No hydraulic tubing anywhere on the machine.

Looks like you got the expensive model.

My Kubota has 33 of those lines and my neighbors friends grandpas farmer friend has those on his Cat D11. Mahindra can't mine asteroids so good luck planting corn.

 

[yanmars]

I cannot say the Mahindra is better or worse than other tractors I have owned or operated but a recent part problem causes me concerns. My 4510 was in the shop just one week shy of 9 months. Most parts came in but they were unable to complete the job awaiting one part. Got it back today.
I have heard of other brands having severe shortages and delays also.

 

[Chevyguy0819]

The biggest selling point for me on the mahindra was no dpf. I also like the dealer. My 3650 pst has 350 hours on it now and still no issues.

 

[tradosaurus]

Gee. Good for your Kubota. With deductive reasoning like a normal person, I am assuming there is possibly, a loader that does not use those steel lines? Instead uses hydraulic rated rubber lines?

 

[tradosaurus]

The biggest selling point for me on the mahindra was no dpf. I also like the dealer. My 3650 pst has 350 hours on it now and still no issues.

That's not entirely accurate. They don't have a regen which forces the tractor to burn hot for a period of time to burn the soot off of the collector but MF (and Mahindra) has a mCRD (DOC system) system which runs hotter all the time to burn off the soot. This is not new technology and is really is dishonest for a tractor mfg to tout this as a benefit over DPF.

DOC is a catalytic converter. The exhaust gas passes through a material which oxidizes/breaks down the environmentally "harmful" stuff. "The diesel oxidation catalyst is designed to oxidize carbon monoxide, gas phase hydrocarbons, and the SOF fraction of diesel particulate matter to CO2 and H2O"

A DPF is a more extensive breakdown system. It usually has a DOC, then a DPF. Some systems also use Diesel Exhaust Fluid (DEF), in addition, which is yet another addition, spraying that fluid the exhaust to further break down the "harmful" particles.
" Exhaust gas passes through the DOC and then into the DPF where Pariculate Matter is collected on the walls of the DPF. The PM collected is then oxidized to remove it from the DPF. This is known as regeneration. When operating conditions maintain sufficient exhaust temperatures, the DPF is continually self-regenerating. This is known as passive regeneration and results in clean exhaust out of the tailpipe. On very infrequent occasions, an active self-regeneration is required to remove a build-up of PM in the DPF, due to insufficient exhaust temperatures. Exhaust temperatures are raised by injecting a small amount of fuel upstream; The resulting chemical reaction over the DOC raises exhaust gas temperatures high enough to oxidize the PM from the filter."

 

[npalen]

I bought a Mahindra 3015 (30HP) four or five years ago at a good price. Put a Westendorf loader on it with the intent of reselling to make a little profit. It's probably worth quite a bit more today but I can't bring myself to let it go. It is an amazing tractor but then so is my little Kubota B9200!

 

[Deleted member 371759]

That's not entirely accurate. They don't have a regen which forces the tractor to burn hot for a period of time to burn the soot off of the collector but MF (and Mahindra) has a mCRD (DOC system) system which runs hotter all the time to burn off the soot. This is not new technology and is really is dishonest for a tractor mfg to tout this as a benefit over DPF.

IMO DOC is a 100% benefit over DPF. No fluid, no sensors and totally maintenance free, also plenty of solutions after the 10's of thousand of hours it will last. Unlike DPF which requires custom tuning to remove. Most diesels run a DOC pre DPF to protect the DPF and to help light it off. There is a reason pre-emission diesels are heavily sought over their emissioned to death counterparts. The whole runs hotter thing is not true. There is no raw fuel injected into the DOC unlike DPF which needs the fuel to reach temps high enough to burn the soot to ash. All that's heating the DOC is exhaust. You are correct that its not new technology and IMO again that is a huge benefit new does not mean good by any means. Also DOC efficiency does increase with heat until a point, at around 400c-750F its efficiency starts to decline. DOC requires a temp of around 200C to light off, so EGTs of 200C are pretty low. Even in your post you noted that pre DPF there is normally a DOC. How would a DOC only engine run hotter than a engine with a DOC pre DPF?

 

[tradosaurus]

IMO DOC is a 100% benefit over DPF. No fluid, no sensors and totally maintenance free, also plenty of solutions after the 10's of thousand of hours it will last. Unlike DPF which requires custom tuning to remove. Most diesels run a DOC pre DPF to protect the DPF and to help light it off. There is a reason pre-emission diesels are heavily sought over their emission to death counterparts. The whole runs hotter thing is not true. There is no raw fuel injected into the DOC unlike DPF which needs the fuel to reach temps high enough to burn the soot to ash. All that's heating the DOC is exhaust. You are correct that its not new technology and IMO again that is a huge benefit new does not mean good by any means. Also DOC efficiency does increase with heat until a point, at around 400c-750F its efficiency starts to decline. DOC requires a temp of around 200C to light off, so EGTs of 200C are pretty low. Even in your post you noted that pre DPF there is normally a DOC. How would a DOC only engine run hotter than a engine with a DOC pre DPF?

There's a reason why during regen process the heat is increased.

According to Neil Messick who compared a L3301 to a Mahindra 1533 he explains that the only difference between the mCRD and DPF is that DPF has a soot capturing mechanism and once enough soot is captured it goes through a burn cycle (hotter temperature) to burn off the soot. This typically happens between 20-30 hrs on average.
A DOC system (mCRD) doesn't have that screen or filter capturing mechanism but it still needs to produce clean exhaust. The way that Mahindra achieves this is that it is ALWAYS in a burn cycle. The way that it happens is that the exhaust stream has to be abnormally hot which is accomplished through tuning the engine to burn hotter.

Most owners will never own their tractor long enough to worry about replacing a DPF.

I believe Kubota and Deere would be using the mCRD "technology" if they thought it would be more beneficial.

https://youtu.be/GOcaeqmNGco

 

[Deleted member 371759]

There's a reason why during regen process the heat is increased.

According to Neil Messick who compared a L3301 to a Mahindra 1533 he explains that the only difference between the mCRD and DPF is that DPF has a soot capturing mechanism and once enough soot is captured it goes through a burn cycle (hotter temperature) to burn off the soot. This typically happens between 20-30 hrs on average.
A DOC system (mCRD) doesn't have that screen or filter capturing mechanism but it still needs to produce clean exhaust. The way that Mahindra achieves this is that it is ALWAYS in a burn cycle. The way that it happens is that the exhaust stream has to be abnormally hot which is accomplished through tuning the engine to burn hotter.

Most owners will never own their tractor long enough to worry about replacing a DPF.

I believe Kubota and Deere would be using the mCRD "technology" if they thought it would be more beneficial.

I was going to add to the end of my post. "Quit listening to neil messick". Hes not a diesel mechanic, hes a Kubota salesman. I knew this was where the info came from. I have no idea why Kubota or Deere does not use DOC. I can think of several reason and its all speculation on my end. I know DPF and its use created an whole industry around it. Replacement filters, DPF cleaning "technology, "DPF liquids, I can bet Deere and Kubota pay pennies for what is a several thousand dollar upcharge to the end consumer. DOC technology has been around for a long time and its known that excess heat diminishes its emissions reducing capacity. mCRD does not inject raw fuel to the DOC. DOC only uses normal diesel exhaust to keep its temps. Like I said DOC begins working at 200c and starts to lose its capacity to scrub emissions at around 450C which is why DPF was created in the first place as EGTs rise into the 600,700,800,900 range DOC becomes less efficient and then relies on the DPF to capture what is missed by the DOC. The engine is not tuned to burn hotter, low to normal EGT temps fall in the range of the DOCs most efficient working range. No reason a company would burn a DOC hot when it would just make passing its emissions standard harder.

 

[tradosaurus]

I was going to add to the end of my post. "Quit listening to neil messick". Hes not a diesel mechanic, hes a Kubota salesman. I knew this was where the info came from. I have no idea why Kubota or Deere does not use DOC. I can think of several reason and its all speculation on my end. I know DPF and its use created an whole industry around it. Replacement filters, DPF cleaning "technology, "DPF liquids, I can bet Deere and Kubota pay pennies for what is a several thousand dollar upcharge to the end consumer. DOC technology has been around for a long time and its known that excess heat diminishes its emissions reducing capacity. mCRD does not inject raw fuel to the DOC. DOC only uses normal diesel exhaust to keep its temps. Like I said DOC begins working at 200c and starts to lose its capacity to scrub emissions at around 450C which is why DPF was created in the first place as EGTs rise into the 600,700,800,900 range DOC becomes less efficient and then relies on the DPF to capture what is missed by the DOC. The engine is not tuned to burn hotter, low to normal EGT temps fall in the range of the DOCs most efficient working range. No reason a company would burn a DOC hot when it would just make passing its emissions standard harder.

So why would Kubota and Deere install a DPF if it could satisfy Tier IV emissions without it? Why does my 6.7L F250 have a DPF if it could magically have clean exhaust without one?

 

[Deleted member 371759]

So why would Kubota and Deere install a DPF if it could satisfy Tier IV emissions without it? Why does my 6.7L F250 have a DPF if it could magically have clean exhaust without one?

They could obviously have meet tier IV emissions without a DPF because other companies have. So that would be a good question for Deere and Kubota.

 

[tradosaurus]

They could obviously have meet tier IV emissions without a DPF because other companies have. So that would be a good question for Deere and Kubota.

Not buying your explanation of how Mahindra's mCRD works.

 

[Deleted member 371759]

Not buying your explanation of how Mahindra's mCRD works.

Thats not how mCRD works. Its how a DOC works. mCRD I'm sure involves a ton of other things. Im sure everything was reworked I know its common rail injection with a pretty high PSI fuel delivery up to 23,000 PSI I read somewhere. I'm willing to bet Mahindra rolled the dice on passing emissions standards to sell enough tractors to people that did not want complicated emissions systems for a long enough time to make money. These tractors will not pass a more strict emission standard and they will have to go back to the drawing board. But I dont care I have a tractor without DPF, SRC and I will keep it as long as I can. I drive a 6.6 Duramax LB7 with no emissions and a OBS 7.3 Powerstroke with no emissions.

 

[Mancelona Man]

So far I have about 40 hours on my 2638 and it’s been a good tractor.