DPFs, EGRs, DEF, etc...

[Hay Dude]

Me too. I sure do wish those emission systems were engineered better. But something had to be done. Anyone over a certain age (50ish?) can remember when huge stretches of the US were covered by a sort of gray/orange cloud of exhaust of all kinds. Cities were so shrouded in smog that you had to decide if you really wanted to drive into it.

The air is hugely better everywhere now. It's been a painful journey but it had to be done. Hats off to us for putting up with all the hassles it took to get where we are now.

Our solution may not be the best, but at least it is moving in the right direction. Everyone benefits, even the ignorant ones who just don't understand and don't care. Luckily most folks are smarter than that.

Maybe next time instead of wasting all our energy fighting about whether to fix a problem, we can put that energy to work figuring out a better way to do it.
rScotty

I wonder what all the stuff we used to make here now shipped 6000 miles from China on huge diesel ships does to the worlds air quality?

Would it be more ethical to “own our own pollution” and make things here, cleanly, under our stringent EPA standards?

Or make everything in China, where pollution is rampant, then diesel it over here in hugely polluting ships? Then Chinese people are stuck with polluted water & air and sickness and the air over oceans get polluted with diesel exhaust.

Are we off-shoring labor and off shoring pollution? Making it someone else’s problem?

 

[rScotty]

I wonder what all the stuff we used to make here now shipped 6000 miles from China on huge diesel ships does to the worlds air quality?

Would it be more ethical to “own our own pollution” and make things here, cleanly, under our stringent EPA standards?

Or make everything in China, where pollution is rampant, then diesel it over here in hugely polluting ships? Then Chinese people are stuck with polluted water & air and sickness and the air over oceans get polluted with diesel exhaust.

Are we off-shoring labor and off shoring pollution? Making it someone else’s problem?

I think the answer is, "you do what you can, and hope to set an example." The USA was one of the first places to industrialize and that made it one of the first to have that much smog in the air. So not surprising we are also first to clean it up.

I think other countries will have the same problem with smog and pollution of all kinds as they industrialize, and will find their own solutions. If enough do, then we can get past this problem.

IMHO, shipping our labor and manufacturing offshore is a separate issue and was a national mistake. We did it, and so did the rest of the developed world. IMHO, off-shoring just might be the biggest mistake the developed world has ever done. In the long run it doesn't really help us or the other countries, it only benefits the corporations involved. And then the corporations become the problem.

rScotty

 

[Hay Dude]

My solution is similar to yours.
Own our problems and solve them at home. Stop shipping everything offshore and help your own people and country FIRST. That’s not “nationalism” or “isolationism”. It’s just the right thing to do.

All our industry is gone. That’s old news. So then they all said we would become a “service based economy”.
Ummmm, no we are not.
Don’t believe me? Call customer service and see if you can even understand the accent of the person you are talking to from India, Pakistan or who knows where else!

We even off shored our service!! Lol

 

[Snobdds]

Butbutbutbutbut all you gotta do is change that diluted oil 2-3 times more often than the manufacturer calls for.

The underlying premise here is, I only want perfect and if anything deviates from my superficial reasoning, then it's junk. I'm sorry, but life does not throw perfect things at you everyday to prevent you from having a stress free life.
The engine is what it is. You adapt to it. If over changing the oil is the path to making it survive and run good...you would be a fool not to do it. You would also be a fool not to listen to people that have knowledge of the situation to alleviate a problem and just resort to the old fall back of...it not perfect so it's junk. See haydude for a professional take on how to routinely do it with out flinching.

Dare we ask what perfect vehicle you drive is? I bet it's just like that guy that missed the lottery but has a perfect inline god that has defied all statistical laws.

 

[4570Man]

The underlying premise here is, I only want perfect and if anything deviates from my superficial reasoning, then it's junk. I'm sorry, but life does not throw perfect things at you everyday to prevent you from having a stress free life.
The engine is what it is. You adapt to it. If over changing the oil is the path to making it survive and run good...you would be a fool not to do it. You would also be a fool not to listen to people that have knowledge of the situation to alleviate a problem and just resort to the old fall back of...it not perfect so it's junk. See haydude for a professional take on how to routinely do it with out flinching.

Dare we ask what perfect vehicle you drive is? I bet it's just like that guy that missed the lottery but has a perfect inline god that has defied all statistical laws.

Wouldn’t just buying something besides a 6.4 be considered adapting? Some products are junk and there’s no need to claim otherwise. My old and tired 6.5 was having overheating problems trying to pull my equipment. I could’ve made mods to increase the cooling or I could just hook on my other truck that doesn’t have that problem which is what I do.

 

[RickB]

The underlying premise here is, I only want perfect and if anything deviates from my superficial reasoning, then it's junk. I'm sorry, but life does not throw perfect things at you everyday to prevent you from having a stress free life.
The engine is what it is. You adapt to it. If over changing the oil is the path to making it survive and run good...you would be a fool not to do it. You would also be a fool not to listen to people that have knowledge of the situation to alleviate a problem and just resort to the old fall back of...it not perfect so it's junk. See haydude for a professional take on how to routinely do it with out flinching.

Dare we ask what perfect vehicle you drive is? I bet it's just like that guy that missed the lottery but has a perfect inline god that has defied all statistical laws.

The perfect vehicle doesn't exist. If you think the 6.4L is the perfect engine then what I drive is immaterial.

 

[fishhead]

My solution is similar to yours.
Own our problems and solve them at home. Stop shipping everything offshore and help your own people and country FIRST. That’s not “nationalism” or “isolationism”. It’s just the right thing to do.

All our industry is gone. That’s old news. So then they all said we would become a “service based economy”.
Ummmm, no we are not.
Don’t believe me? Call customer service and see if you can even understand the accent of the person you are talking to from India, Pakistan or who knows where else!

We even off shored our service!! Lol

Agreed, mostly
I think one of the issues was that we became addicted to buying more stuff and cheaper throwaway goods
We and the planet would be better served by buying better performing, longer lived goods and in turn would need to buy less stuff overall and the goods could support higher price points and domestic production due to superior performance and lifespan.

 

[jyoutz]

I wonder what all the stuff we used to make here now shipped 6000 miles from China on huge diesel ships does to the worlds air quality?

Would it be more ethical to “own our own pollution” and make things here, cleanly, under our stringent EPA standards?

Or make everything in China, where pollution is rampant, then diesel it over here in hugely polluting ships? Then Chinese people are stuck with polluted water & air and sickness and the air over oceans get polluted with diesel exhaust.

Are we off-shoring labor and off shoring pollution? Making it someone else’s problem?

Yes, but the demise of corporate pensions resulted in a need for double digit yields in the stock market for 401k investments. Corporate boards are offshoring production to “maximize shareholder value.”

 

[finn1]

Yeah, my Ford 6.4’s DPFs refined themselves into being pretty worthless by the time I cold find someone brave enough to buy them. My Ram dealer took one off my hands as a trade-in.
Im all for clean air, but come on, make it something reliable.

Last 6.4 was produced, what, eleven years ago, by a company whose CEO refused to embrace DEF. That CEO is now unemployed because of that decision.who is now unemployed

 

[RickB]

Any engine branded as Maxxforce has earned the reputation as being the most hated and universally least desirable engine family in recent memory.

 

[Hay Dude]

Any engine branded as Maxxforce has earned the reputation as being the most hated and universally least desirable engine family in recent memory.

Yeah the MAXXFARCE engines finally put the nail in the coffin for IH engines. The DT series were overall pretty good engines, but IH couldnt make em work with emissions equipment. The venerable DT466 is spinning in its grave right now Over how it was ruined. I really thought IH was headed to bankruptcy. I always was a big IH fan. Loved their technology back in the 70’s and 80’s. So many “firsts” it seemed like.

IH wised-up and went to Cummins. The L-9 is a huge improvement in their vocational trucks. Much more reliable and more powerful.

Now they have a lot of catching up to do. Lots of their customers went to Freightliner/Cummins/MB

IH almost took Ford down the drain with the 6 & 6.4L debacles.

 

[Hay Dude]

The underlying premise here is, I only want perfect and if anything deviates from my superficial reasoning, then it's junk. I'm sorry, but life does not throw perfect things at you everyday to prevent you from having a stress free life.
The engine is what it is. You adapt to it. If over changing the oil is the path to making it survive and run good...you would be a fool not to do it. You would also be a fool not to listen to people that have knowledge of the situation to alleviate a problem and just resort to the old fall back of...it not perfect so it's junk. See haydude for a professional take on how to routinely do it with out flinching.

Dare we ask what perfect vehicle you drive is? I bet it's just like that guy that missed the lottery but has a perfect inline god that has defied all statistical laws.

“Inline God”

Show me all the V-8s in todays medium and heavy trucks. I bet theres hundreds of different models????

 

[4570Man]

“Inline God”

Show me all the V-8s in todays medium and heavy trucks. I bet theres hundreds of different models????

Hundreds of different models? There was a few V-8 Detroits from decades ago non of which were very good, the 7.3, 6.0, and 6.4 served an a few medium duty trucks they also weren’t very good. The 3408 Cat motor is the only one I know of that served in class 8 trucks and made decent power.

 

[RickB]

The Mack E9 V8 was a hoss, but it was another love/hate deal too. 400-525 hp in trucks, more in marine and military configs.

 

[Hay Dude]

Hundreds of different models? There was a few V-8 Detroits from decades ago non of which were very good, the 7.3, 6.0, and 6.4 served an a few medium duty trucks they also weren’t very good. The 3408 Cat motor is the only one I know of that served in class 8 trucks and made decent power.

OMG it was a JOKE….hence the laughing emoji….

 

[hornett22]

Good video that explains the issues with DPFs, EGRs, DEF, and other emissions equipment...makes me glad I got the 25hp Kioti CK2610.

Yep, glad I got the Mahindra 1626 for same reason. Kioti 2610 was second ci

 

[truckdiagnostics]

Hundreds of different models? There was a few V-8 Detroits from decades ago non of which were very good, the 7.3, 6.0, and 6.4 served an a few medium duty trucks they also weren’t very good. The 3408 Cat motor is the only one I know of that served in class 8 trucks and made decent power.

Cummins had the Triple Nickle and the 903 V8's also since we are talking v-8 diesel they were ok. Not a lot out there. Remember the Detroit fuel pincher 8.2?(think it was 8.2) There answer to the 4 stroke automotive diesel. The two stroke 92,71 series Detroit sure were screamers they came in v configurations. How they would use the same inline 6 cylinder head to make a 12v 71 or put two 8 cylinder blocks together to make the 16 71. Talk about not meeting emissions. Those older engines where cool. Now to increase horsepower they send some kid out there with a computer to tune the engine. Those were the days.

 

[mikester]

I think all of us who are doomed to own those systems wish they were more thoroughly engineered for longevity.

The longevity ship sailed decades ago.

Consumers want new and they want cheap. The new generation is focused on always being on the upgrade train. Software, cellphones, appliances, fashion,....

Your vehicle is an appliance.

 

[Hay Dude]

Cummins had the Triple Nickle and the 903 V8's also since we are talking v-8 diesel they were ok. Not a lot out there. Remember the Detroit fuel pincher 8.2?(think it was 8.2) There answer to the 4 stroke automotive diesel. The two stroke 92,71 series Detroit sure were screamers they came in v configurations. How they would use the same inline 6 cylinder head to make a 12v 71 or put two 8 cylinder blocks together to make the 16 71. Talk about not meeting emissions. Those older engines where cool. Now to increase horsepower they send some kid out there with a computer to tune the engine. Those were the days.

The V-8 was tried in OTR trucks and has been retired for quite some time. Lower fuel economy, more moving parts and packaging under the hood are some of the reasons. In lines make more torque for their displacement and fuel they consume than V-8s in bigger trucks.
In line sixes and some fours probably make up the configuration in 99.5% of trucks bigger than a 5500 today.

 

[Hay Dude]

I’ve always liked a Ford cab but a Chevy has always been more friendly to work on, been more reliable and rides better IMO. Currently I’m driving a V12 250 and a 750 with a Cummins though. I still have my 92 3500 ton. It’s been a dang good truck but it’s low on power. I’d like to have a newer ton but I’m not paying what they cost when a medium duty is so much stronger and cost less.

I didn’t know you could get a V12 in an F-250.