Started my solar project

[RalphVa]

You're lucky your electric provider allows that much. Ours only allows a collection amounting to about the average of your usage. They only bank excesses, and then it gets used up at night. They don't allow much excess from month to month.

By comparison, another MG colleague has a different electrical provider. They put in a big enough array to generate essentially all their electriciy.

Actually, unless I cut down a couple trees to allow sun light to the house roofs, I have no other place to put any panels. Covered the approximately SSW facing carriage house roof with them.

Ralph

 

[Grumpycat]

The Federal law only mandates a utility purchase up to what you buy from them in kWh. But also stipulates the utility may pay as little as their "audited incremental cost of generation." For TVA that is $0.015/kW. A penny and a half.

To grid-tie to a TVA utility one must have the system "designed and installed" by a NABCEP "associate". No different than letting laws be written by lobbyists. Helps preserve the installer's 100% markup.

In the process of building new home in a county served by a TVA utility which permits one to install PV but will not pay for any power I generate. That would be a separate contract with TVA and for 1.5¢ I don't see any point in bothering paying the markup for a blessed design. Currently live under a different TVA utility which outright forbids any PV system connected to the power grid which is not from an NABCEP associate. As a result, I don't have any PV at all.

Alabama Power (a division of Southern Company) owns the PSC lock stock and barrel so they have instigated fees where one owed Alabama Power which essentially negate any grid-tie credits one earns for production. There are virtually no PV systems under Alabama Power.

 

[grsthegreat]

I love the idea of solar power, but here in north idaho.....not worth it. Not enough sun. Heck its cloudy today as i type this. Now if i lived in the Mojave desert id go for it.....

Also wondering....is there really 9 cooler months there. I thought you had 1 cool month and 11 scorchers.

 

[orezok]

Also wondering....is there really 9 cooler months there. I thought you had 1 cool month and 11 scorchers.

I live at 3500MSL so it does get cold in the winter. The lowest I have seen in the 20 years or so that I have been here is 12*. We also get snow almost every winter. Three 15 inch storms during that time. You gotta be careful about what you see in the movies

 

[Grumpycat]

I love the idea of solar power, but here in north idaho.....not worth it. Not enough sun. Heck its cloudy today as i type this. Now if i lived in the Mojave desert id go for it.....

Also wondering....is there really 9 cooler months there. I thought you had 1 cool month and 11 scorchers.

You really need to do the math before reaching that conclusion. Most of Idaho gets 4.5 hours/day of "full strength sun". Thats sort of a calculation shortcut to compensate for cloud cover and time from sunup to sundown. If you have a 300W panel then a good guess is 300W for 4.5 hours and nothing for 19.5 hours. Not really the way it works, more during the summer than winter but the 365 day average would be 1.35 kWh/day from one 300W panel. Same as for me in AL/TN.

1.35 kWh/day is about $50/year at 10¢/kWh.

Solar Insolation Map: How Many Sun Hours Do You Get? | Wholesale Solar

 

[cdaigle430]

You really need to do the math before reaching that conclusion. Most of Idaho gets 4.5 hours/day of "full strength sun". Thats sort of a calculation shortcut to compensate for cloud cover and time from sunup to sundown. If you have a 300W panel then a good guess is 300W for 4.5 hours and nothing for 19.5 hours. Not really the way it works, more during the summer than winter but the 365 day average would be 1.35 kWh/day from one 300W panel. Same as for me in AL/TN.

1.35 kWh/day is about $50/year at 10｢/kWh.

Solar Isolation Map: How Many Sun Hours Do You Get? | Wholesale Solar

Thats correct, I live in Maine and get up to 32kw on my 7kw daily. Even if you pay alot of money for having it installed you will get your return. I have 7 more years for my return to be fulfilled but....in 7 years I will thank my past self for having it installed every time I get the electric Bill

I bought the Panasonic HIT 340 watt panels with a 25 year warranty....and if the power company stops giving credit I will buy a battery pack to store as much as I can.

Sooo maintenance free-cleaning the panels every so often is about it. I honestly cannot think of a down side.....Whatever you do stay away from the lease or lease to own programs. That and when it snows and covers the panels for a week at time.

These systems are modular so you can add more if needed later on. Solar panels run better cooler...so our panels in the colder areas will produce more efficiently than Arizona with full sun and 115 degree heat.

Mine will generate even when its overcast. Right now its complete overcast, my panels are active and generating 1kw. My house is consuming .57kw so I am sending .33 kw to the grid for credit On a completely cloudy day mind you...not much but im not buying electricity right now.

 

[grsthegreat]

Sorry, but we pay $0.05 per kwh hydroelectric. I know people that have $35,000 solar arreys . And they never expect to se a return to investment. I just fixed a generator for one person offgrid yesterday. They were replacing 13 batteries That were failing... big expense. The only reason they stay off grid is utilities want over $45,000 to bring them power. When they put in their system, she told me that the utilities would not bring them power for any amount of money as there was no infrastructure inplace.

My monthly elect bills are very low. I personally have no use for solar. So far this season i have used ac unit 1 day. If i lived in desert than my views would mostlikely change. With my current elect usage, it would take me 25 years to see a return. But in those 25 years there would be added expenses to the system like the batteries this lady was replacing. ....based on $35,000 investment

 

[BoylermanCT]

Sorry, but we pay $0.05 per kwh hydroelectric.

Must be nice. I pay $0.2572 per KW in CT.

 

[grsthegreat]

Must be nice. I pay $0.2572 per KW in CT.

That’s horrible

 

[Grumpycat]

Sorry, but we pay $0.05 per kwh hydroelectric. I know people that have $35,000 solar arreys . And they never expect to se a return to investment. I just fixed a generator for one person offgrid yesterday. They were replacing 13 batteries That were failing... big expense. The only reason they stay off grid is utilities want over $45,000 to bring them power. When they put in their system, she told me that the utilities would not bring them power for any amount of money as there was no infrastructure inplace.

At 5¢/kWh your PSC isn't giving the utility company much of anything to build infrastructure. Here the incremental cost of generation is 1.5¢/kWh and among nearby TVA associate utility companies the residential rate is 8.5¢ to 11.5¢. The 11.5¢ utility quoted $10,000 to run 400A 4000'.

You say nothing of what kind of batteries your friends are using. Deep cycle marine batteries are cheap but they are expensive per kWh over their short life. There are some utility grade lead-acid batteries but even they are not up to what is available now in lithium chemistries. Lead-acid holds a lot of power cheap but doesn't like to be cycled. Lithium is expensive up front but is much cheaper per kWh over its usable life.

The street price for a Tesla Powerwall is $7200 for 13kWh useful storage including BCU and AC inverter. Problem is that it needs another couple thousand of Tesla Energy Gateway to monitor what is coming in and out but after that you can add as many Powerwalls as you want. The Energy Gateway is the thing that tells the Powerwalls to charge or discharge.

Today there are many others competing with Tesla at competitive prices. Which is easy because Tesla Energy vendors tend to be greedy snobs.

 

[Grumpycat]

Must be nice. I pay $0.2572 per KW in CT.

Par for New England, California, and Hawaii.

 

[sodamo]

Not our island

“The average residential electricity rate in Hilo is 42.47¢/kW.”

So glad I am off grid (since 2005). 14.08 kw of solar panels, Outback hardware, 45.6kw SimpliPhi lithium batteries, 3 backup generators (propane, diesel, gasoline). If all fail we are in the dark

 

[Root Cause]

I am building a house next year and getting more interested in solar panels. I don't live in a location to consider going off-grid but I am interested in how and why campers and motorhomes use 12v systems. (Wire costs and weight) Typically, lights, fans, USB ports, thermostat, and the water pump are wired for 12v that is, critical things you need for dry camping.

I already have a small system to power the lights for the barn and keep the RV and tractor batteries charged. Now, I am thinking about combining solar panels with emergency lighting for the house and the barn. Now, I'm trying to think of what else should be connected that isn't a big drain on a battery that would be of high value during an initial power outage.

Wondering if anyone has taken this approach?

 

[orezok]

OP here. My total cost for electric in my first year was $165 for actual usage. In addition about $12 per month minimum to be connected to the grid.

I switched my water heater from propane because the cost is ridiculous because there are only 2 companies out here and they know they have a monopoly. About $3.65/Gal year round. I added three 380 watt panels and it looks like I will again break about even.

 

[Root Cause]

OP here. My total cost for electric in my first year was $165 for actual usage. In addition about $12 per month minimum to be connected to the grid.

I switched my water hater from propane because the cost is ridiculous because there are only 2 companies out here and they know they have a monopoly. About $3.65/Gal year round. I added three 380 watt panels and it looks like I will again break about even.

That is fantastic and I am envious. I am in a wooded area with maybe 4-6 hours of direct light per day. I am using a waterstove to heat the house and the water heater. Wood for me is free. Past that, I hope to follow your lead and utilize solar power where I can. Thanks for starting this thread, I am going back now to thoroughly read each post.

 

[BackRoad]

To those that have implemented solar...

Do you have any trusted sources of information that can be used as a foundation for evaluating the core elements of a solar solution?

The need is to gain sufficient basic knowledge of solar to be able to wade through all the noise and avoid the $$$ seeking snake oil salesmen and marginal or shortlife hardware.

The objective is to install something that is modular and reasonably open source so it can expand or change over time as components get more efficient or improve.

Where is a good place to start?

 

[MAX-24-Dean]

To those that have implemented solar...

Do you have any trusted sources of information that can be used as a foundation for evaluating the core elements of a solar solution?

The need is to gain sufficient basic knowledge of solar to be able to wade through all the noise and avoid the $$$ seeking snake oil salesmen and marginal or shortlife hardware.

The objective is to install something that is modular and reasonably open source so it can expand or change over time as components get more efficient or improve.

Where is a good place to start?

The link below should be able to give you basic information, and advance information if you want to spend more time on technical installations.

NAZ Solar Electric Forum

Categories - An Online Community For Discussing Solar Power, Wind Power, And Other Forms Of Renewable And Alternative Energy.

forum.solar-electric.com

 

[sodamo]

Yep, that forum is a good place to start. There are others.
First are you looking at a grid tied or off grid system? No, off grid doesn’t just mean you choose not to use the power company some times. Different architectures. I’ve been off grid since 2005 with 3 completely different systems.
My first system was an open system and changed over time. The best change was going to a more integrated system, one that all the parts communicate with each other. Of course they do so in a propriety manner. If someone tells you their component fully integrates with another manufacture make them prove it. The only agnostic component would be the PV panels, maybe the batteries although they are getting smarter as well.
When you reach the point of getting a proposal or even your own design, take the time to get other eyes on it, ask lots of questions. Understand the answers before committing.
My current system is almost 2 years old, I love it, but I also know there have been many improvements in that short time.
Basically I have 14kw PV, a well integrated Outback Radian/FM80 based system with nice bank of SimpliPhi lithium batteries with both LP & diesel generators. I can monitor and control from anywhere in the world I have an internet connection on my iphone. My 1st, open system I had to see it, be able to touch it.

 

[BackRoad]

Thank you Gentlemen, for the link and the additional guidance...

Time to get edjumakated!

 

[zoranutt]

I disagree. That 42.47¢/kW is not common among all regions. We have a rooftop solar installation and this is the best outdoor string light pole for these cases. We never wanted to support a private distributor that sets their own rates as it comes out very expensive. And I still don't like the fact that a lot of people in our sector work with this kind of companies - they put limits on the maintenance of the houses as well as the solar panels. Only one state allows these and by 2025 they have to install them in every house.