First tractor ... confused ....advice please!

[xtal01]

I started this post under "new holland" but then realized from a post that my question may be way more basic then if a model is good or not.

After reading a post, maybe I should be asking a more basic question ... do I want a geared tractor?

Honestly ... didn't even think about this!

Having never had a tractor, I didn't even think about shifting gears!

I know I would need to do this when I use the loader but do you shift while cutting grass or just leave it in one gear and go?

I have 3 acres .... longest run is say 250 ft .... then turn ... 250 ft ... turn .....

Is it like a truck .. would I need to downshift ... turn ... up shift?

I understand that you set the engine RPM's to get the PTO to 540 for the mower then it says there ... then do you just pick a gear (say 8th to set tractor speed to ???? mph) and cut at that speed?

Maybe I should be asking can you (or is it practical) to use the same tractor for a lawn mower and a bucket / back hoe tractor?

Backstory ....

Money is tight for us. My wife was paralyzed from the shoulders down in a diving accident when she was 12. I moved from SC to VT about 10 years ago when I met her as she has a job her and her health insurance is up here. I was originally from Canada but moved to SC in the 90's when I met a woman there. She passed way after 13 years of marriage.

Housing prices are very high here in Vermont. After looking at buying an old house and modifying it (wide doors, roll in shower, ...), we decided to build and are just finishing up building an accessible house. It took me 5 years ... I did much of the work myself even building my own elevator ($40K to buy one ... I got an old electric forklift and put it together for $2K). We even lived in an old RV onsite (froze when winter temps hit -30) for three years to save from paying rent.

My wife needs care every 4 hours so I work out of the house. I am a machinist by trade. With luck by next year I will have a shop to do work out of ... already poured the pad and will build next summer (my machines .. lathe, mill, welder, etc ... are in storage in a tractor trailer next to the house). Right now I do small repair work on just about anything (last week I repaired an electric drier and a tractor) and I build electrical control panels. Here is a link to my facebook page:

Vermont Country Workshop - Home | Facebook

Anyway ... lots of work still to do ... obviously I cut grass once a week (using a 12 year, 22 hp kohler, old 54" cub cadet I bought for $800 three years ago), I have two large piles of dirt still around the house ... lots of landscaping ... I need drainage ditches put in around the workshop, driveway is rough and I want to move it over a bit, even building the workshop I would use it to stand up the walls, ....

I had been hoping to stay around the $10,000 mark. With this tractor I would be say $12,000 ... a bit more then I wanted but I could just pull it off. All the other tractors I see are around $15K ... now we are definitely out of my budget.

So do I go for a geared tractor can I not use one tractor for everything or ????

I originally posted in the new holland area because I found a 1920 in good shape (picture below) ... bucket and backhoe (would need to buy a finish mower) .... 700 hours ... 1994 ... $11,500. I also saw a chinese made Farm Pro 2425 ... 2005 ... 2K hours ... bucket and backhoe (still would need to buy a finish mower) ... $8,500.

These are both gear units.

Thanks so much !!!!!!!!!!!

Mike

 

[flusher]

Think used tractor. You could find something like a 2 or 3 year old Kubota B7510HST tractor with hydrostatic transmission, 4-ft wide FEL bucket, power steering that would cost $8-9K. Add $600 for a 4-ft brush hog rotary mower. If you're just mowing not-too-thick weeds, you can sharpen the mower blades (like you do for your riding mowers) and get a cut that makes your 3 acres look like a large lawn.

Good luck.

 

[Tractorable]

You sound like a real fighter. Welcome to the forum.

Recommend you keep the Kohller for mowing the grass and get a larger machine for everything else. I don’t know much about new holllands so some one else will have to chime in, but that size in the pic looks pretty good.

 

[greggyy]

For most things, yes, you select a gear and go.....

I am pretty new to using tractors, but have an older 50s era and a later 80s era, both manual, but only one has syncro that allows shifting on the fly, the other may allow it, but the only time I shift, is when moving a long distance & where I need to start very slow, otherwise I would just select top gear, or, on the one I can shift on the fly, when going up hill often you need too shift, the older one even though similar HP has miles more grunt and no shifting required....it tends to want to lift the front instead of slowing down

I do not cut hay or grass, but it would be similar to ground engaged implements, where you select gear, set revs and go.

I think a manual box is prob better for hard work, like ripping or ploughing ground etc, but even though I have not done or used a FEL tractor, if you were shifting and moving dirt or gravel etc from one spot to another a lot, I think a Hydro type would be better.....one pedal for forward and a quick change to other pedal to go back....

Pretty soon you will realise there is no one tracctor for all situations, but seeing how many old manual shift units are still active and probably outlive many of us, you could hardly go wrong with one for general all round duties.

 

[greggyy]

PS I would stick too International, Ford, JD and the like or Japs like Kubota, Iseki, Yanmar etc...or even Korean.....over almost all Chinese jelopies for a number of reasons, but at this point, no way they going to be around and easy to get parts for like my old Inter.....but there are other reasons too.

 

[xtal01]

The lawn tractor I have it just a bit too small. It takes me 5 hours to cut the lawn (then an hour to trim). I was hoping for say a 72" cut (or ????).

I also wanted a backhoe for things like drainage ditches (I dug 100 ft by hand before the neighbor lent me a tow behind unit ... just too light ... almost the same speed by hand).

Is 21 hp big enough for a backhoe unit?

And maybe I am looking at this the wrong way ... do I get a "cheap" chinese unit with a bucket and backhoe and a better lawn mower or go with the 32 hp new holland and learn to live with gears or ????

Thanks ... Mike

 

[CobyRupert]

I mowed (and snowblowed) with a gear (garden) tractor for years. (A Cub Cadet 582)

It can be done. But it sucks! But you won't know that it sucks until you convert to hydro later, so don't worry about it. Ignorance is bliss.

That said, I later bought a geared utility tractor for "tractor work" and a hydrostatic lawn tractor for mowing/snowblowing.
I'd estimate that mowing (and snowblowing) with a hydrostatic (with a 2" smaller mower deck!) is 2- 3 times faster.

Yes, with a gear, people typically set engine rpms so pto is 540rpm and then have to shift to change speed, but there's nothing magical about 540 rpm pto (usually), you CAN let off the throttle to slow down and make turns, etc..

People love the hydros for their efficiency with bucket work too.

Having one tractor do everything is possible, but usually a compromise. (Like an "all-season" tire in VT winters) It may be either too big or too small, or both at the same time.

 

[Jchonline]

Hello and welcome to the forums!

The backhoe is handy, but driving up the cost of the used machine significantly. Based on what you said you have to do it might be cheaper to just rent a mini-excavator for any serious digging (which you didn't list any I saw anyway). I recommend finding a tractor with no backhoe. Have you looked at Tractorhouse.com? You can even search in your area for used machines. For those ditches, you can use a rear blade and make them much more consistent.

With regards to gears....if you are doing dirt work or using the FEL (Front End Loader) much, I recommend a Hydrostatic (HST) transmission or a Shuttle Shift geared machine. The shuttle shift has a lever usually where the blinker is on our cars that lets you shift from forward to backward on the fly with no clutch....even in a geared machine.

Now if all you are doing is mowing or grading roads or haying...then a standard geared transmission is fine. You pick one and hit the throttle. However if you need to change speeds or directions often it gets old fast. For your budget I bet you can find a decent shuttle shift. They will be cheaper than the HSTs, and still have lots of utility.

 

[dodge man]

Don't get a geared tractor, get a used sub compact tractor, like a Kubota BX, if you shop carefully, you can get an end loader and either a 54" or 60" deck within your budget. Lots of other makers of similar tractors also. Most of these will be HST tractors.

 

[alflen52]

I also think a used sub-compact utility tractor with loader and mower would do all you want except for backhoe type work,for that it would be better to rent or have done.

 

[Soundguy]

As has been said, generally on a straight gear tractor, pick a gear and go.

Your straight gear tractors are usually the most economics option.

If you are shopping prices, and have a rural king in town, check them. $ per hp, they are pretty much the price leader. Yanmar diesels, TYM chassis. Gear, shuttle, or hydro trannies, open station or cab. Loader and hoe are options.

I've been driving antique gear tractors and wrenching on them for some time now. Just about ready to buy my first new tractor from rural king. Due to price savings I'll be able to get cab, ac, hydro tranny and about 33% more hp than if I went with red, orange, blue, or green.

Good luck!

 

[arrow]

Personally, I think you've got enough on your plate not to have to worry about a tractor being geared or not. What Coby Rupert stated is dead to right.
Get what you can afford that will do the work you do. That Ford in your picture is very nice but as someone mentioned, the backhoe is adding at least another 3 grand to the mix.. What you need to be sure of is parts availability with older tractors.

A larger tractor will pull 10'-12' gang mower. You'd be done in no time. I know someone who mows 5 acres with one and is tickled pink with it.
Here is what I would concentrate on rather than if a tractor is geared or hydro: Should have a fel. Should be 4wd. Should have turf tires. Should have 25-30 hp. Should weigh over 2000 lbs, What's nice about a gang mower is that you'll have no pesky pto to hook up or deck to have to take on and off. Perhaps you can buy that Ford in your picture and sell the backhoe.

 

[xtal01]

Just as a bit of a twist ...

A local dealer just called .... took in a trade today and wanted to know if I was interested.

2014 Yanmar 424 ... 24 hp ...120 hours ... bucket, backhoe, snow blower .... R4 tires and chains ...$12,500 plus $750 tax ... $13,500 FIRM

plus I would need to get a finish mower ... $ ????

This is now way out of my budget .... I really wanted to stay below $10K

But ... three or four years old ... 120 hours .... sounds almost new.

I think I will pass but I wanted to know what you guys think.

Thanks so much again for all the advice!

Mike

 

[arrow]

It's quite a lot of tractor and implements for the money. If it's out of budget, it's out of budget. Stay firm with your criteria. There is always another tractor.

 

[xtal01]

I am thinking along the same lines ...

Unless someone in the group tells me this is "a deal I just can't pass up" ... then I will let it pass.

I owe nothing on credit cards ... nothing on vehicles .... only the mortgage on the house.

It is hard to justify putting myself right to the wall (I would need to take money from the workshop I want to build and spend it on the tractor) when I drive a 32 year old truck (1986 F150 4x4) just so I can put a little extra down each month on the mortgage. The truck is nothing to look at (dents, dings, fiberglass floors, really needs a new bench seat bad, ...) but it passes inspection each year! Straight six has almost 250K on it ... but it still plows snow pretty good.

Thanks .... Mike

 

[D2Cat]

I'd advise you to pass. My opinion is you don't need a back hoe. To dig trenches go to town and rent a trencher. $400 and you can dig all day, and get a lot of ditch dug and backfilled. How many acres do you have to take care of?

 

[xtal01]

I have three acres .... does not seem like much but it really takes me 5 plus hours just to mow ... then an hour to trim.

Like I said, I have a 54" cub cadet .... 12 years old but it still runs ... best $800 I spent.

Mike

 

[daugen]

Mike, if you are new to tractors, in this size range suggest you stick with hydrostatic. Will be similar to driving your car/truck and short learning curve. When you let off on the pedal you stop almost immediately. Perhaps a safer alternative for a new driver. I own both types and recommend you stick with a transmission that lets you focus on the work being done, not shifting.

Also agree with everyone here that backhoe is only a nice to have, and easy to rent for projects. You can't easily mow with a backhoe anyway and they are hard to take on and off.
A constant question asked here is do I mow with lawn mower or tractor. Almost always, the answer is get a good zero turn, even a used one. It's usually the best tool for the job while the tractor can be a big bundle of compromises. If your land is fairly flat and not a lot of trees, mowing with a rear finishing mower on a tractor is an option, I do it and the cut is excellent. But if you have lots of trees, mowing with a rear mower can be hazardous to mower and trees alike.

 

[arrow]

Mike, if you are new to tractors, in this size range suggest you stick with hydrostatic. Will be similar to driving your car/truck and short learning curve. When you let off on the pedal you stop almost immediately. Perhaps a safer alternative for a new driver. I own both types and recommend you stick with a transmission that lets you focus on the work being done, not shifting.

Also agree with everyone here that backhoe is only a nice to have, and easy to rent for projects. You can't easily mow with a backhoe anyway and they are hard to take on and off.
A constant question asked here is do I mow with lawn mower or tractor. Almost always, the answer is get a good zero turn, even a used one. It's usually the best tool for the job while the tractor can be a big bundle of compromises. If your land is fairly flat and not a lot of trees, mowing with a rear finishing mower on a tractor is an option, I do it and the cut is excellent. But if you have lots of trees, mowing with a rear mower can be hazardous to mower and trees alike.

I agree with the ease of a hydro here Daug. The hydrostatic however brings an additional expense. He can easily adapt to a geared and with mowing, the thing is like in cruise control anyway. The guy I keep talking about with the 12' gang mower has numerous tress on his 5 acre yard. They are interspersed every 50-75 feet. He simply manipulates around them and yes with a geared machine. He then gets his zero turn to trim around them but Mike can do the same thing with his 54" cutter.
This past spring I took a job at a tractor and implement dealership. One of my jobs was to put together zero-turn mowers and take in trades on like machinery. The trades were beat to crap with many needing several thousand bucks to make whole. There was only one viable zero turn out of the 14 we took in and that was from a lady who's husband had passed away and she was going to hire out her landscaping. This thing was a beauty with only 200 hrs on it. Even used, it still had a 6k price tag.
If the op has 10k to spend, I think a tractor would be the better all around machine for him.

 

[cathy liebchen]

that New Holland is overpriced for a 25 year old tractor. You want HST