Tracked Skid Steer or Tractor?

[AKRazn]

Hi there,

My wife and i have 5 acres of land in coastal Alaska that is covered in dense Alder, Devils Club and Spruce. We are wanting to clear the land to start our homestead and are having a hard time trying to decide between a tractor or a tracked skid steer?

We were originally all in with the idea of a TBL but a friend of our purchased one for his homestead and is having trouble with the soft beach access similar to ours. The area is a coastal rainforest so the ground can get soft quick when driving heavy equipment around on it frequently. This is what made us reconsider the TBL and start looking at tracked skid steers.

The other part of this equation is that the equipment needs to be light enough to be transported on our boat from town to the property in the spring and then back to town again in the fall. Our weight limit is 7,000 pounds.

The benefits of the TBL is that you get loader and back hoe all in one but the flotation issues have me very concerned. The benefit of the skid steer is great flotation and TONS of accessories but then you have to purchase the accessories.

Currently we are looking at some ASV/Terex PT and RC 30 - 50 HP model skid steers. We were also looking at Kubota B 2650 tractors but have been told to also consider Mahindra? Was told that you used to get great bang for your buck with Kubota but they are a big name now so Mahindra is now what Kubota used to be?

Any input is greatly appreciated as I'd like to make a purchase this summer and get going on the project.

I am hoping to run a brush hog to take care of the alder and devils club and then get a grapple bucket to move / stack the large spruce trees we will be dropping.

 

[4570Man]

First off a true TLB isn't the same thing as a tractor. You should really compare implement prices before making your decision. Is there any grass you don't want destroyed? The TLBs are way gentler on turf. And your comparison is flawed. A Kubota L45 is a better match for a 7,000 pound tracked skid steer. My vote is for a TLB. If you throw the 7,000 pound limit out the window it would be hard to beat the bang for your buck of a used full size backhoe.

 

[jeff9366]

Tractors require quite a bit of maintenance.

Wheeled Skid Steers require a bit more maintenance than the average tractor. Tracked Skid Steers require a lot of maintenance of the tracks. For coastal rain forest this may be your only option.

Perhaps it would make sense to hire a land clearing outfit to clear/mulch the five acres, then buy a tractor for maintenance.

A little B2650 can only power a 48" a medium duty Rotary Cutter. A medium duty Rotary Cutter will not cut "dense" anything.

This is the MINIMUM type of Rotary Cutter you should consider: RCF276� & RCF2772 Series Rotary Cutters | Land Pride

Here are other opinions on TRACTOR OR SKID STEER? tractor or skid steer? - Google Search

Pretty much decide on your equipment need first, then consider brands.

 

[olPete]

Having done about 2000 hours on mainly a rc100 but also an rc30, great machines on any surface.. unless it gets on a slippery slope, then they tend to either spin a track or lock a track and go straight! Very industrial too. Would be hard to wreck one on a stick, we punished them and they took it. Ended up chewing the tracks up on the rc100 but it was in rock quarries, spinning around on rough rocky tracks etc. It got new tracks at ~5000 hours or so. Only downtime was when a new employee pumped diesel into the hydraulic tank til full... rocks and stones wear grooves in the tracks and idlers if you leave them in there..
Small tractors I have no experience with
Middle to large tractors I do know
If you are looking for something to pull things, tractors are made for that. And versatile. And good on slopes.
Serious loader/landscaping/tight area work though, skidsteers are my weapon of choice. So nimble, heaps of lift, but no reach.

 

[redman135]

As usual jeff9366 has got straight to the point. To which I would add,if you get a tractor, look at flotation tyres (low preassure, and wide) or dual wheels to cope with the soft conditions. If you get a front end loader definately get the wide front tyre option to carry the weight with out sinking.

 

[Rustyiron]

With those weight restrictions, I would consider a small excavator. For shear grunt power, the arm of a 7k# mini-ex concentrates & dwarfs anything a 7k# wheeled or tracked machine would get "to the ground". Working in stages you could clear & stack, then possibly rent or replace it later for actually carrying around materials & brush.

 

[jeff9366]

If you get a tractor, look at flotation tyres (low preassure, and wide) or dual wheels to cope with the soft conditions. If you get a front end loader definately get the wide front tyre option to carry the weight with out sinking.

Consider radial tires too.

Radial or bias, the right choice / Properly use your tires - Michelin Agricultural Tires

Specialized tractor flotation tires are mostly sold for very large tractors. Perhaps some makes flotation tires for light tractors.
radial tractor tires - Google Search
31x15.5-15 LRD Carlisle TURF PRO large tractor mower FLOATATION Turf Tire - NEW | eBay

 

[Dadnatron]

Whatever you choose, I would DEFINITELY get a Danuser Intimidator if you are truly clearing land. Its on my tractor in my avatar.

Intimidator | Tree & Post Puller | Danuser

It has been the best investment I could have made for clearing my place. I would buy another one today, if I didn't have one.

Concerning your choice, think about the breakout force and traction you will have. It would be poor money to buy a tractor without enough power and breakout force to remove the things you are intending.

I agree about checking into someone to clear it for you. Or renting a large forestry mulcher and having someone barge it over. I completely understand wanting to spend your money on something which you will own, but spend your money wisely. I have a VERY hard time, myself, hiring something out. But there are times when it is truly the best money spent.

 

[AKRazn]

Thank you for the replies everyone! Unfortunately hiring out is not an option, the cost to transport the equipment is close to the same cost to purchase the equipment as the location is a remote island. I have to stick to the 7K# weight limit as that is as much as my boat can take.

I found some pictures of the vegetation in the back ground as well as the trees to help give a better idea. my goal is to clear cut about 3 of the 5 acres COMPLETELY to allow the sun to get in and dry things out. Once the land is cleared the equipment would be used to dig water line trenches, footings for a home and then general grounds maintenance. I have found some good deals on the little 30 hp skid steers but not sure if that is a large enough piece of equipment.

As you can see there is a lot of under brush which necessitates a brush hog, and the Spruce are pretty large as well. I don't mind if things take a bit longer to complete as long as what ever equipment I choose can get the job done. I think a tractor makes all the sense in the world expect for the flotation issue.

In the off season the equipment will be transported back to town and used to remove snow from my office building and rental properties.

Thanks again for all the input!

 

[joefromga]

Everything has its place. Skid steers are great for somethings and tractors are great for others.

I like the 7k mini ex idea because it's digging force will be better than the other two. But it's not a tractor and can't pull a plow or Bush hog or other rear implements.

The skid steer, if you get it stuck, will take another piece of equipment to get it unstuck and a pickup will be unable to pull it for most part.

A tractor with a backhoe can unstuck itself with a cable or chain and an excavator can do it without a chain in most situations.

Yes you can sink anything if you try hard enough but a tracked machine without an articulating arm, IMO, is more likely to be not what you need. Especially after seeing your pictures.

 

[Dadnatron]

Personally, I wouldn't use a tractor for that clearing. I think you would not be able to move enough and the terrain would likely stop you from adequately using its strengths.

Remember, the idea and basic design of a tractor is towing. Whereas the design of a CTL is to grab and lift.

With those pictures, I would go CTL hands down. I don't think anything else would stand a chance.

I'm still not sure that a 7000# machine will be able to do what you want... but that is another story.

heh... and there you have it. 2 posts with the same basic information coming to completely different conclusions. heh... gotta love forums.

 

[mike69440]

Call a logger, then Hire,/ Rent, Dozer and and excavator for stumps, At least a 20 ton with thumb & D6 or equal. Then a 50 HP or so tractor with skid and grapple to finish. A skid steer would work, if you plan to sell later.

 

[jeff9366]

"The equipment needs to be light enough to be transported on our boat from town to the property in the spring and then back to town again in the fall. Our weight limit is 7,000 pounds."

"Hiring out is not an option as our location is a remote Alaska island. The cost to transport equipment is close to the same cost to purchase the equipment. I have to stick to the 7,000 pound weight limit as that is as much as my boat can take."

 

[ChugiakTinkerer]

Given all of the constraints you've got, I don't think there is a single piece of equipment that can do it all. I'd go with the mini excavator with a hydraulic thumb for the initial clearing. Keep it at the property until you've got the 3 acres cleared then sell it and get yourself a tractor with loader or the CTL. I think with the weight limitation of 7,000 lbs you can get a heck of a lot of HP and loader lift capacity in a tractor. Deal with the beach access problem by rolling out something like tundra mats.

 

[4570Man]

Given all of the constraints you've got, I don't think there is a single piece of equipment that can do it all. I'd go with the mini excavator with a hydraulic thumb for the initial clearing. Keep it at the property until you've got the 3 acres cleared then sell it and get yourself a tractor with loader or the CTL. I think with the weight limitation of 7,000 lbs you can get a heck of a lot of HP and loader lift capacity in a tractor. Deal with the beach access problem by rolling out something like tundra mats.

You're off the mark there. It doesn't take much tractor to reach 7,000 pounds once all attachments are are on. Unless there's a second piece of equipment involved moving the attachments separate would be a real challenge.

 

[ChugiakTinkerer]

You're off the mark there. It doesn't take much tractor to reach 7,000 pounds once all attachments are are on. Unless there's a second piece of equipment involved moving the attachments separate would be a real challenge.

True enough, especially if you're considering a backhoe attachment. But a 35-40 hp tractor and loader can be had for around 5,000 lbs that will lift a ton easily enough. Won't need a backhoe if the digging is done beforehand with a mini-ex. If the only problem with a tractor is a sandy beach, there are probably ways to get around that without having to buy a CTL.

 

[Dadnatron]

True enough, especially if you're considering a backhoe attachment. But a 35-40 hp tractor and loader can be had for around 5,000 lbs that will lift a ton easily enough. Won't need a backhoe if the digging is done beforehand with a mini-ex. If the only problem with a tractor is a sandy beach, there are probably ways to get around that without having to buy a CTL.

I don't think a 5000# 40hp tractor would have much luck pushing over those trees. And certainly, there are too many to cut then dig stumps with a backhoe. His best bet is to push the trees over intact, then pull them out intact or cut up into manageable pieces. He will be hating life trying to get those stumps out with a small tractor backhoe and if he's already cut down the trees, he won't have any options but to bring in either a large excavator or dozer to push them out. Both of which will be far and away TOO HEAVY for his boat.

Cutting ANY of those trees down would be a mistake, in my opinion, as far as 'clearing' the land goes. Sure, it can be done, and was done with an axe and mule team. But the reality is there are better... much better, ways in which to clear now.

To the OP. I would research whatever you are really looking at, and then find one in use, and see how well it can get one of your big trees out of the ground. Find a farmer, pay him $100 and have him try to push over a tree (on the mainland). That will tell you the likelihood of whether your purchase will do what you want it to do. I just don't think a CUT will be able to work those size of trees. At least as they appear to me in your photos.

 

[Grandad4]

Very difficult situation. First, I don't think any 7,000 lb piece of equipment is going to be bulldozing those trees. So they will have to be cut, one at a time. Then each tree will have to be limbed and bucked into small enough pieces that they can be removed. And you're clearing how much land - 5 acres? That's going to be one big pile of dead trees and undergrowth. How will you dispose of all that debris? And if your equipment - regardless of whether it has wheels or tracks - is going to be moving all the logs, limbs, etc., how many trips back and forth will it take before the ground becomes an impassable mud bog?

Here are some things to consider:
You may have to bring in fill material or use some kind of matting to keep from sinking your equipment.
Would processing trees in-place make more sense than lifting/dragging spoils across wet ground?
Can you set up drainage channels to help dry out the ground?
Any way you do this will involve lots of time and manual labor. Are you working alone or do you have help?
Once you've cut the trees, what will you do with the stumps? Removing them is another big project that will open up the ground and make more mud.

For the initial tree felling work, I'd think a tractor would be more useful for moving the spoils without tearing up the ground, but it all depends on whether there's enough flotation. A tracked skid steer would have better traction and flotation but would make more of a mess and once it's stuck, it's really stuck. When it's time to grub out the stumps, nothing beats a small excavator.

No matter what equipment you use or how you do this, it sounds like a very big job!

 

[ovrszd]

A machine isn't going to clear that property. Manual labor is. Look forward to seeing progress.

 

[coldsteelva]

Do you not have access to a contracted (for hire) landing craft type boat? The kind used for the delivery of building materials. Does everything have to be transportable by your boat always?

Alaska Landing Craft Charter