Well problems

[fishheadbob]

6 wells and still learning.
The gauge is inexpensive and handy. If your foot valve ever gets clogged or stuck it becomes very easy to tell what's going on by watching the gauge.
A Myers runs about $650.
Yes, tape your drop cable to the pipe every 10 feet or so.
See if the paperwork with the pump makes any suggestions about a pressure switch, if not I'd say 30-50. Or, I've actually found employees at Lowes and HD who are licensed plumbers. Try to find one (not the 17 year old) and ask.
Hard to believe the original pump didn't have a safety rope, gotta have one.
Lightning seems to go looking for water wells. Better pumps are lightning protected but the lightning goes running up the waterline looking for somewhere else to raise havoc. I saw it jump 12 inches from my antenna box to the on/off on my tv ages ago. Turned the tv on, didn't cook anything ! But I have had lots of stuff fried over the years.
I wouldn't bother to rebuild your old pump which has lots of copper. If you don't want to recycle it leave it out for the garbage pickers and watch them fight over it.

 

[MarkF48]

Yup, got a pressure gauge on my system. I have adjusted the pressure switch and the gauge lets me know where cut in and cut out points are. It did take me a bit to grasp how to adjust the switch and I had to read a couple different instructions to get it figured out. Mine has two adjustments. The short one is the differential.
This is pic of what I've got. 44 gallon tank, 1/2hp Goulds pump down at around 280' I installed back around 1986.

 

[turnkey4099]

Thank you. I might just replace the switch too; because it don't know what it's set at. I do know if running about 20 seconds per cycle; which I didn't think was right. I've got the air right at 28 psi (which should be right for 30/50 switch) but #1: I'm not sure if it's 20-40; 30-50; or 40-60; and I've played with the adjusting nut, so no idea what it is at now.

Do you guys put a pressure gauge in, or is there any benifit? Switch is probably $15; and not a bad job to redo, but I'm wondering if there's any reason to put a pressure gauge inline, and adjust my pressure switch to a good factory setting?

Yes there should be a good quality pressure guage right by the pressure switch, I've never seen an installation without one. It would tell you in one cycle what your switch is set for.

Harry K

 

[turnkey4099]

Yup, got a pressure gauge on my system. I have adjusted the pressure switch and the gauge lets me know where cut in and cut out points are. It did take me a bit to grasp how to adjust the switch and I had to read a couple different instructions to get it figured out. Mine has two adjustments. The short one is the differential.
This is pic of what I've got. 44 gallon tank, 1/2hp Goulds pump down at around 280' I installed back around 1986.

Yep, short one is the differential and it should be adjusted to give 20psi difference between on/off. Tall screw slides the setting up/dow, from 20/40 up to 40/60. Pressures over 60 not recommended for residential use and there is really no need for them. It will give a needle shower, run sprinklers just fine.

Harry K

 

[Carl_NH]

Definitely get a gauge in the line and a new pressure switch while you are at it. If you have the normal brass tank tee there should be a spot for the gauge. If not get 1/4" brass tee and brass pipes and install below the switch. Do not use galvanized pipe as that will rust shut in a few years.

This may have been the reason your old pump died - short cycling like that will reduce the motor life considerably.

 

[paulharvey]

Definitely get a gauge in the line and a new pressure switch while you are at it. If you have the normal brass tank tee there should be a spot for the gauge. If not get 1/4" brass tee and brass pipes and install below the switch. Do not use galvanized pipe as that will rust shut in a few years.

This may have been the reason your old pump died - short cycling like that will reduce the motor life considerably.

Yeah, I'm sure it contributed too it. The reason I asked about the pressure gaige, is its not the norm around here at all. Matter if fact, of a about a dozen wells of friends/family; none of them have a gauge. It should be as simple as cutting in a 1"×1"×1/2" pvc tee, and a 1/2" ×1/4" reducer bushing and a gauge. Do I need the gycol filled or whatever? Or will a $3 pressure gauge work?

 

[KevT]

A $3 one is what I have on both of mine, when they freeze, I replace them with another $3 one, and yes that is how mine are installed.

 

[Old Junk Man]

Your pump will have a check valve, Install a second one above ground and have the pressure guage and pressure switch mounted between the second check valve and the tank. on the outlet side install a pressure regulator that will allow you to adjust the hot and cold like in a shower and when the pump kicks on the water pressure will remain constant .no more having the water temp fluctiauate.

 

[Redneck in training]

I discovered these little guys while building my off-grid system. They are surge suppressors / clamps -- they essentially give a quicker path to ground when it exceeds a specific voltage, clamping the lighting strike. Very cool! I've installed several of them as required by code, and a few extras on spendy equipment. Installs right into the knockouts on any panel and wiring takes 5 minutes.

This particular one is made for 120/240v applications and will stop a direct lightning strike. Made by Midnite Solar.

View attachment 429745

~Moses

I have the same one on each bank of solar panels. I also have Siemens whole house surge arrester. Last year crew clearing the right of way dropped a tree in the power line and resulting surge damaged many electronic devices in about a mile from the substation. Except my house. But the surge protector was virtually melted. Since the utility paid for new one I got the best I could find. http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...025-value-good-whole-house-surge-dsc_0020-jpg

 

[JimRB]

When was the last time you replaced your tank? I have on my third tank in 19 years. I just replaced the tank this spring. I know when it is bad when a shower has noticeable surging. When a tank is working properly it may take a few minutes before the pump turns on and I do not notice it in the shower. We have low flow shower heads based on 1997 regulations. I can also hear the tank short cycling when the tank is bad. I have a shallow bored well 30-60 feet deep.

Turn off the pump. Get out the garden hose and remove all pressure from the system. If you have a 30/50 pressure switch, pump up the pressure tank to 30 psi. If you cannot achieve 30 psi and maintain it with the garden hose valve open and the well turned off, then the pressure tank is leaking. I ordered a new tank from these guys who had a pretty good price and the same brand my installer used. I chose a different model. Amtrol Well-X-Trol Pressure Tanks My tank was a bit water logged. Better to drain the tank in the yard than in the house or back into the well. That water was black and pretty foul looking. Not unlike the water in the fire sprinkler system that used steel pipes.

 

[paulharvey]

When was the last time you replaced your tank? I have on my third tank in 19 years. I just replaced the tank this spring. I know when it is bad when a shower has noticeable surging. When a tank is working properly it may take a few minutes before the pump turns on and I do not notice it in the shower. We have low flow shower heads based on 1997 regulations. I can also hear the tank short cycling when the tank is bad. I have a shallow bored well 30-60 feet deep.

Turn off the pump. Get out the garden hose and remove all pressure from the system. If you have a 30/50 pressure switch, pump up the pressure tank to 30 psi. If you cannot achieve 30 psi and maintain it with the garden hose valve open and the well turned off, then the pressure tank is leaking. I ordered a new tank from these guys who had a pretty good price and the same brand my installer used. I chose a different model. Amtrol Well-X-Trol Pressure Tanks My tank was a bit water logged. Better to drain the tank in the yard than in the house or back into the well. That water was black and pretty foul looking. Not unlike the water in the fire sprinkler system that used steel pipes.

My bladder tank maintains air pressure fine, but I'm beginning to think it's "water logged". Is there a way to fix that? I drained tank with pump off, set air to 26 psi (pressure switch comes on at 28/off at 46). Still probably drain 3 or 4 gallons max out of it with out well pump kicking on. I guess I'm confused about a 'water logged tank' really means. I always assumed that if the tank held air, it was good.

I found Home Depot has 20-80 gallons bladder tanks from about $160-400. There is a kinda local plumbing supply house that has a sign "used tanks, $10 and up", but at $10, I'm guessing they are no good, and being sold for grills.

If I can find a used old style galvanized tank, any major down side to old type vs bladder tank?

 

[TheGoose]

Stay away from big box store tanks. Look for Well X troll.

 

[dmccarty]

My bladder tank maintains air pressure fine, but I'm beginning to think it's "water logged". Is there a way to fix that? I drained tank with pump off, set air to 26 psi (pressure switch comes on at 28/off at 46). Still probably drain 3 or 4 gallons max out of it with out well pump kicking on. I guess I'm confused about a 'water logged tank' really means. I always assumed that if the tank held air, it was good.

I found Home Depot has 20-80 gallons bladder tanks from about $160-400. There is a kinda local plumbing supply house that has a sign "used tanks, $10 and up", but at $10, I'm guessing they are no good, and being sold for grills.

If I can find a used old style galvanized tank, any major down side to old type vs bladder tank?

Our bladder died after five years or so in the tank installed by the well driller. The bladder was supposed to be replaceable and it is but I would have to buy from a company in China that I did not know and the cost was way to high. We called the plumber who help build the house...

Stay away from big box store tanks. Look for Well X troll.

We replaced the tank which was not that much more expensive than buying the new bladder. Pretty sure it is a Well X Troll.

Later,
Dan

 

[MarkF48]

Stay away from big box store tanks. Look for Well X troll.

Knock on wood, still on a Well-X-Trol installed in 1986

 

[chopped]

Knock on wood, still on a Well-X-Trol installed in 1986

1979 for mine and the box store here sells the we;; x troll also..

reciently added a second one in l1ne. this keeps the pump from on and off so many times.so simple to add one anywhere in the system...(one connection)

 

[Arky217]

While were on the subject of pumps, wondering if anyone else has their pump electrical feed from an outlet? I did this back when I put the pump in as a means to totally disconnect/isolate the control box and pump from the the rest of the house wiring when I know a thunderstorm is coming. Figured if it's not connected it's less likely to get taken out if a lightening hit causes a surge in the house wiring. The outlet is keyed to only take a special type of plug.

View attachment 429690

:thumbsup: Excellent idea; I did this as well. We have some intense thunderstorms here in western Arkansas.
I unplug the pump as well as everything electronic when a storm comes up.
Just flipping off the breaker does not completely isolate the device.

Arky

 

[Arky217]

Ok, so water is on. Started pulling at 9 am, finished at 4 pm. 1.5 hours going to Lowe's for pump. 30 min to Ace for rope; 30 min too Ace for 1-1/4" to 1" reducer bushing; 30 min back to Ace for some 1" coupling; some 90's.

Few observations: I sure hope those water proof butt splices are really water proof...

I pulled all 100 ft of 1" PVC riser as a single piece (it's thread sch-80 white pvc). Wasn't too bad to pull; but needed wife to walk the end back when I got around half out.

Old pump (.7 hp, 15 gpm) has smaller outside diameter then new one (3/4 hp, 10 gpm) and for some reason didn't sit as low in the casing as the old one. Kinda wonder is the old smaller diameter was in silt and sand, and new one set on top of that? It was most definitely sitting onb bottom... hope this doesn't come back to bite me in the butt, or at least doesn't for a long time. I've always had issues with sand and sediment in the well.

As a general question; what does the bottom of the casing look like. Obviously the casing is a 4" pvc pipe, probably basic DWV sch-40; but does the bottom just sit on the native sand, or is there a 4" well point on the bottom; or a piece with slits like a french drain?

Edit: actual pulling was about 15 minutes, and changing pump was maybe 30; had to do a lot of calling around, 2 TSC's, 2 Aces Hardware, Home Depot, and 2 Lowes'.

Re-edit: $369 plus tax for pump, $5.99 for water proof splices (baught two packs, just in case), 1-1/4" to 1" galvanized reducer bushing (could get one out of old pump) $5; pipe dope $5; 100 ft 1/4" nylon rope $9.99; 2 ea 1" 90' and 2 1" couplings at like $0.69 each.

Prices I got on phone; "$1,000 best case" and $950 plus $1/lf.

Your submersible pump should hang as least 10' above the bottom of the well; even more if the bottom is sandy.

 

[paulharvey]

Your submersible pump should hang as least 10' above the bottom of the well; even more if the bottom is sandy.

Is that normal, the pump hanging by the pipe? I know the one I pulled was setting on the bottom.

 

[MacLawn]

paul, it's normal for pump to be suspended from pipe. Mine's been that way since '75. And, right about the Well X Trol tank. Get the best.

 

[TheGoose]

Those big box store pumps usually last around 3-5 years. I hope you get longer than that out of it.

Ok, so water is on. Started pulling at 9 am, finished at 4 pm. 1.5 hours going to Lowe's for pump. 30 min to Ace for rope; 30 min too Ace for 1-1/4" to 1" reducer bushing; 30 min back to Ace for some 1" coupling; some 90's.

Few observations: I sure hope those water proof butt splices are really water proof...

I pulled all 100 ft of 1" PVC riser as a single piece (it's thread sch-80 white pvc). Wasn't too bad to pull; but needed wife to walk the end back when I got around half out.

Old pump (.7 hp, 15 gpm) has smaller outside diameter then new one (3/4 hp, 10 gpm) and for some reason didn't sit as low in the casing as the old one. Kinda wonder is the old smaller diameter was in silt and sand, and new one set on top of that? It was most definitely sitting onb bottom... hope this doesn't come back to bite me in the butt, or at least doesn't for a long time. I've always had issues with sand and sediment in the well.

As a general question; what does the bottom of the casing look like. Obviously the casing is a 4" pvc pipe, probably basic DWV sch-40; but does the bottom just sit on the native sand, or is there a 4" well point on the bottom; or a piece with slits like a french drain?

Edit: actual pulling was about 15 minutes, and changing pump was maybe 30; had to do a lot of calling around, 2 TSC's, 2 Aces Hardware, Home Depot, and 2 Lowes'.

Re-edit: $369 plus tax for pump, $5.99 for water proof splices (baught two packs, just in case), 1-1/4" to 1" galvanized reducer bushing (could get one out of old pump) $5; pipe dope $5; 100 ft 1/4" nylon rope $9.99; 2 ea 1" 90' and 2 1" couplings at like $0.69 each.

Prices I got on phone; "$1,000 best case" and $950 plus $1/lf.