Removing sweet gum stumps

[FarmerCharlie]

I need to remove about ten pretty big sweet gum stumps along a wet-weather ditch that empties into my pond. A friend dug out this double stump with his backhoe in about two hours http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5384_800w.jpg. The golf cart and 5 gallon bucket are for scale. It was the largest, and I'm guessing the root ball weighs some 5000 pounds.

I'm thinking about renting an excavator to finish the project, and would appreciate some advice. The local rental company has two machines: One is a Hitachi ZX135US 13 ton machine with a fairly narrow bucket for $700/day. The other is a Mustang ME8002 8 ton machine for $500/day.

Based on reading several threads here, I think either machine could do the job over a weekend rental. I'm not sure the smaller machine would be able to lift and drop the stumps to free the dirt for easier burning. The smaller width of the bucket on the larger machine seems to me like it would be better at breaking the roots with a minimal amount of digging. I do have a JD 2130 tractor with a FEL and box blade for cleaning up the site afterwards.

I would appreciate any opinions of folks who have done this. I have used Bobcat and IH mini excavators to dig holes for some large trees, but I think this project needs more muscle. Too bad I didn't think of this back when they were digging the pond. The contractor was pushing over trees like this with his Daewoo 300 like I push over privet with my grapple rake.

 

[acme97]

First, I hate sweetgums! Bain of my property. I would go with the larger machine since as you know they are tough stumps to get out. Does either have a thumb to make it easy to get out of hole? Of course, they will burn some fuel, so make sure you have enough on hand to keep working for the day.

 

[FarmerCharlie]

First, I hate sweetgums! Bain of my property. I would go with the larger machine since as you know they are tough stumps to get out. Does either have a thumb to make it easy to get out of hole.

Both the machines do have a mechanical thumb, but I'm not sure the smaller machine could lift the root balls.

I have declared war on both sweet gum and privet. I can handle most of the privet myself, and the sweet gums are almost enough to justify buying a backhoe or excavator.

 

[ocaj11]

Have you thought about hiring someone to come out and grind them below the ground level? I have an older Komatsu PC220 that I've used to dig out a few very large sweetgum stumps. They go really deep into the ground and it took a big hole before I got the stump broke over. Basically, it was a huge mess. The larger machine you mention will dig the stumps out if that's the way you want to proceed.

 

[FarmerCharlie]

Have you thought about hiring someone to come out and grind them below the ground level? I have an older Komatsu PC220 that I've used to dig out a few very large sweetgum stumps. They go really deep into the ground and it took a big hole before I got the stump broke over. Basically, it was a huge mess. The larger machine you mention will dig the stumps out if that's the way you want to proceed.

I thought about hiring someone, but I enjoy this sort of work, and I need something to keep me out of trouble. I did get a quote from a stump grinder, and that would be a lot less money. But I need to do some grading and plowing to finish landscaping the area.

 

[General Lee]

I would probably grind them below surface level. If they are anything like a black gum, they'll have a tap root clear to china.

 

[TonyF]

I need to remove about ten pretty big sweet gum stumps along a wet-weather ditch that empties into my pond. A friend dug out this double stump with his backhoe in about two hours http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5384_800w.jpg. The golf cart and 5 gallon bucket are for scale. It was the largest, and I'm guessing the root ball weighs some 5000 pounds.

I'm thinking about renting an excavator to finish the project, and would appreciate some advice. The local rental company has two machines: One is a Hitachi ZX135US 13 ton machine with a fairly narrow bucket for $700/day. The other is a Mustang ME8002 8 ton machine for $500/day.

Based on reading several threads here, I think either machine could do the job over a weekend rental. I'm not sure the smaller machine would be able to lift and drop the stumps to free the dirt for easier burning. The smaller width of the bucket on the larger machine seems to me like it would be better at breaking the roots with a minimal amount of digging. I do have a JD 2130 tractor with a FEL and box blade for cleaning up the site afterwards.

I would appreciate any opinions of folks who have done this. I have used Bobcat and IH mini excavators to dig holes for some large trees, but I think this project needs more muscle. Too bad I didn't think of this back when they were digging the pond. The contractor was pushing over trees like this with his Daewoo 300 like I push over privet with my grapple rake.

I've taken out many sweet gum trees with my KX-91 mini (3.5 ton), many as big or larger as those pictured. The trick is to leave the tree intact, dig around it and push it over. (its recommended only to dig on 3 sides, leaving the side opposite where you plan to push from intact, that should keep the tree from falling on top of you) In practice I usually have to dig around all four sides, which is more risky. Watch for any existing lean and watch the wind direction, This time of year the tree is leafed out and the wind can take it from you. Push as high up as the machine can reach. Once its toppled over, I cut the stump off with a chainsaw. You'll won't have that luxury.

I've noticed that sweet gum roots have a tendency to grow out a little and then down which makes them harder to get to with the bucket. With a stump mostly likely they will all need to be cut before the stump will come out. Cut two sides then reposition the machines 90 degrees and cut the other two sides. You may be able to reach over and then under the stump to cut the tap root if it even has one, I have not seen much of a true tap root on sweet gums. Even a 13 ton machine may not be able to just rip stumps right from the ground.

If the machine won't pick it up, those machines you mentioned should pick it up,there are a couple things you can do. Using the bucket cut one edge of the hole like ramp and roll it out, once its out, or on its side in the hole start picking at the roots with the bucket, breaking up the roots and dirt clod to lighten it, and believe it or not starting filling the hole. When you start filling wiggle the stump around with the bucket, the loose dirt will work itself under the stump and it will slooooowly rise up.

Remember, the closer you keep the bucket to the machine, the more lifting force you will have, its all matter of leverage.

Let us know how it turns out.

 

[missingstexas]

Ok so someone please explain it to me... What's wrong with sweet gums? I know they tend to be messy, but I have one that I just love. It's about 40 feet tall and I'm guessing 20 or so years old.

 

[kenmac]

Ok so someone please explain it to me... What's wrong with sweet gums? .

The balls thay produce.Bumper crop this year for me. I can't name anyone around here that like them. 1 a year till there all gone:thumbsup:

 

[TonyF]

Ok so someone please explain it to me... What's wrong with sweet gums? I know they tend to be messy, but I have one that I just love. It's about 40 feet tall and I'm guessing 20 or so years old.

One sweet gum OK. I can handle a few spiky balls. Hundreds of trees like I had and still have - no way, in the late fall the ground is so littered with the balls you can not walk on it. Somehow they get everywhere too.

They are tough trees and pretty in the fall. We had the tail end of a F1 tornado come by our property this April, lost 40+ pines, the sweet gums were still standing.:confused2: The ground was saturated with water from weeks of rain and the sweet gums with their massive roots held fast and just bent in the wind, the pines jumped out and laid down.

 

[FarmerCharlie]

I've taken out many sweet gum trees with my KX-91 mini (3.5 ton), many as big or larger as those pictured.

Let us know how it turns out.

It sounds like you have dug a lot of stumps. The technique you described was exactly what the pond digger did, except he didn't have to do a whole lot of digging with his giant machine. Too bad I didn't think ahead to let him take these out while he was here. But now I will have to deal with stumps; I had the trees cut last year. Thanks for the detailed suggestions. I'll try to take some pictures and post the results when I finish.

 

[missingstexas]

One sweet gum OK. I can handle a few spiky balls. Hundreds of trees like I had and still have - no way, in the late fall the ground is so littered with the balls you can not walk on it. Somehow they get everywhere too.

They are tough trees and pretty in the fall. We had the tail end of a F1 tornado come by our property this April, lost 40+ pines, the sweet gums were still standing.:confused2: The ground was saturated with water from weeks of rain and the sweet gums with their massive roots held fast and just bent in the wind, the pines jumped out and laid down.

Ok. I could see that, the new ZD326 will do a number on those balls (from the tree that is) so I'm not too worried about this just one.

 

[FarmerCharlie]

Ok so someone please explain it to me... What's wrong with sweet gums? I know they tend to be messy, but I have one that I just love. It's about 40 feet tall and I'm guessing 20 or so years old.

They are fine in the woods. In fact, I really enjoyed watching a pair of red tail hawks raise a family in a giant sweet gum in the woods nearby. And really big ones make great structure for a pond: Giant Sweet Gum Root Ball - Pond Boss Forum
But I do hate them out in areas where you walk.

 

[JHTFarmer]

I'm a fan of Sweetgums. Don't understand why they always seem to get bad press on this forum. Suppose people like digging things up with tractors around here.

 

[JohninCT]

I thought about hiring someone, but I enjoy this sort of work, and I need something to keep me out of trouble. I did get a quote from a stump grinder, and that would be a lot less money. But I need to do some grading and plowing to finish landscaping the area.

What are you intending to do with ten big ugly stumps once you get them out? Ridding yourself of them won't be easy and putting them somewhere may only make a mess that you will have to deal with at some other point in the future. Believe me I know running an excavator is fun, but in this case it would seem to make more sense to grind them and put the $$ saved into some other part of the landscape job.

 

[FarmerCharlie]

What are you intending to do with ten big ugly stumps once you get them out?

I'll probably stack them in the burn pile and light them in a year or two. The stumps from the pond made a burn pile about thirty yards long, and it made a spectacular bonfire. And they provided cover for all sorts of critters in the meantime. But I may put a couple of the big ones in the pond like I did with the giant one.

 

[gabby]

What size machine took two hours to dig that stump? I hire a septic tank guy with a backhoe/loader to dig my stumps when I have just a few like you do. He has a 12 inch bucket with special forked teeth on it for digging stumps.

 

[bindian]

If the machine won't pick it up, those machines you mentioned should pick it up,there are a couple things you can do. Using the bucket cut one edge of the hole like ramp and roll it out, once its out, or on its side in the hole start picking at the roots with the bucket, breaking up the roots and dirt clod to lighten it, and believe it or not starting filling the hole. When you start filling wiggle the stump around with the bucket, the loose dirt will work itself under the stump and it will slooooowly rise up.

TonyF has it right.:thumbsup: I have dug ramps and drug them out and I have wacked away at the bottom of the root ball dirt with it laying on it's side to knock the dirt off to lighten it enough to lift it out of the hole. Ripping all the roots off you can after removing the dirt helps also.

Worst thing is you get seeping water in a deep hole that turns the dirt to mud and it forms a suction on the root ball. Good luck.
hugs, Brandi

 

[FarmerCharlie]

Let us know how it turns out.

I finally got back to the stump project this weekend, but the excavator I planned to rent was not available. So I rented a JD310 backhoe. Not as much fun as a big excavator, but it is doing the job. I got them to put on a 12 inch bucket, which I thought would be better at breaking the roots and digging a trench around the stumps. Most of the single stumps came out OK, and I was able to hook the 12" bucket around the stumps and carry them to the burn pile.

One of the stumps was much larger--a double stump about the same size as the one my friend had removed. This shows the double stump after I had about finished the basic trench around it.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5444_800w.jpg

Next I started working to pick some of the dirt off the bottom. That was pretty difficult, because the bucket would not extend enough to get under the stump unless I positioned the machine pretty far from the stump. This required moving the machine several times. By the time I finished this, I could wiggle the stump and break it loose. This is how it looked after this step.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5448_800w.jpg

Then I moved to the other side and managed to roll it out of the hole.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5452_800t.jpg

Here it is upside down just barely out of the hole.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5453_800t.jpg

It was still way to heavy to move, so I kept picking at the dirt between the two stumps.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5455_800w.jpg

It was still too heavy to pick up, but I was able to push it to the burn pile.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5458_800w.jpg

All in all, this has been so much fun that I have decided to convert from a weekend 8 hour rental to a weekly one and dig up all the old stumps that have made bush-hogging such a pain.

Thanks to all for the suggestions.

Charles

 

[bindian]

I finally got back to the stump project this weekend, but the excavator I planned to rent was not available. So I rented a JD310 backhoe. Not as much fun as a big excavator, but it is doing the job. I got them to put on a 12 inch bucket, which I thought would be better at breaking the roots and digging a trench around the stumps. Most of the single stumps came out OK, and I was able to hook the 12" bucket around the stumps and carry them to the burn pile.

One of the stumps was much larger--a double stump about the same size as the one my friend had removed. This shows the double stump after I had about finished the basic trench around it.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5444_800w.jpg

Next I started working to pick some of the dirt off the bottom. That was pretty difficult, because the bucket would not extend enough to get under the stump unless I positioned the machine pretty far from the stump. This required moving the machine several times. By the time I finished this, I could wiggle the stump and break it loose. This is how it looked after this step.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5448_800w.jpg

Then I moved to the other side and managed to roll it out of the hole.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5452_800t.jpg

Here it is upside down just barely out of the hole.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5453_800t.jpg

It was still way to heavy to move, so I kept picking at the dirt between the two stumps.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5455_800w.jpg

It was still too heavy to pick up, but I was able to push it to the burn pile.
http://i823.photobucket.com/albums/...rm/landscaping/StumpRemoval/IMG_5458_800w.jpg

All in all, this has been so much fun that I have decided to convert from a weekend 8 hour rental to a weekly one and dig up all the old stumps that have made bush-hogging such a pain.

Thanks to all for the suggestions.

Charles

Charles,
Glad to hear you had so much fun. They are a blast and I love mine. I think a excavator would be that much more fun.:drool:
hugs, Brandi