Advice on a used Drill Press

[woodlandfarms]

I have been asking some questions about single and tripple phase, and realized today I don't even know what else I am looking for in a used DP.

I get I want something that will drill slow, something with a big chuck and is solid, something with at least 3/4HP ( or do I?)

I am looking at used as I sense there are some great deals at the moment out there.

Anyone have any advice on what to look for in a used machine? It is for primarily metal work, and my rational for the purchase is drilling out holes for a landscape rake as I think the machine shop will want too much.

 

[George2615]

I have a direct drive drill press (basically its a Stanley 1/2" drill mounted in a press frame). Most of the newer ones I've seen today are belt driven by 1/3 to 1/2 HP motors. The belt driven ones usually have a stepped pulley system. By moving the belt to a different groove in the pulley you change the speed of the drill. I've attached pics of mine and a typical bench top variable speed belt driven press. They also are available in floor mount.
If your looking at used, keep your price down. They bench top model I showed sells new at Lowes for under $300.
For your own home shop use you'd probably want a 110V unit.

 

[jenkinsph]

I have had a couple of cheap drill presses such as two Generals, Craftsman and a Woodtek unit. The Woodtek is the current one I own with 8 speeds, 1 hp and 3/4" chuck I can say I am not real pleased with it, a good used semi professional unit will be my next choice. The 3/4 hp 5/8" chuck General was the best one for the money I have had so far.

My brother has an older Delta 1 hp drill press and it is better than anything I have. Something I would look into are some real old drill presses maybe 50 to 70 years old that turned very slow with good torque, a friend of mine has one like this in his old welding shop and it gets down to about 50 rpm. Wish I had it.:drool:

The worst I have had is the Craftsman floor model with the shoestring belt, it had all the torque of a 1/4" hand drill.:thumbdown:

 

[ultrarunner]

Don't know if it is still true... when I worked in a tool and die shop... all the quality drill presses with 1/2 or larger chucks had a low speed of anywhere from 40 to 80 RPM.

If you find a drill press with speed starting in this range... I'm sure it will do everything you need...

 

[EddieWalker]

I have been asking some questions about single and tripple phase, and realized today I don't even know what else I am looking for in a used DP.

3 phase electricity is used in commercial applications. It's more power to the motor and a different type of electric motor that lasts alot longer. If you have 3 phase power available to you, it's the best way to go. If you don't have it, you don't want to pay to bring it in. It's very expensive and trying to get the power company to run it for you is like pulling teeth. You can get a converter to run 3 phase motors, but those are a couple grand.

The cheap drill presses are 3 phase because nobody can use them. Be sure you know what you are looking at and avoid those. It's too expensive to remove the motor and put in a single phase motor.

I've been looking around for a drill press too. I keep hoping to find a deal for a used one, but so far, I've only seen junk. I want a floor model that will drill under 200 rpm with at leat 1hp. I've used my brothers 3/4 hp drill press from Grizzly and thought it was underpowered and poorly built.

Right now, Harbor Freight has one that I really like. I hate Harbor Freight and worry about the quality of this drill press, but I've been to the store and looked at it several times. Nothing else seems to compare to it for the money. Big, heavy and powerful.

Good luck,
Eddie

 

[dfkrug]

Right now, Harbor Freight has one that I really like.

Are you still agonizing over this DP, Eddie?

With a little adjustment, I have gotten this HF DP to perform quite well. I
think it is a bit fast at 180RPM, but I could not find slower. This is their
20" "production" DP. Thumbs up.

I agree with the other posters that a really old DP can be a good thing,
but sometimes old bearings need to be replaced. Similarly, replacing a
motor will require some work, but if handy, go for one of the industrial
used 3 phase units and use a replacement motor.

 

[SpringHollow]

3 phase rotary converters are much cheaper than 2 grand. For my shop, i have a 15 HP unit that was $1000 (including the 15 HP motor). A 5 HP unit is less than $500. Static converters are even cheaper but you only get 2/3rds power on your equipment. You can use variable frequency drives to generate 3 phase power. Someone i know got a surplus one for $150 for his 3 phase (no idea what loads his can drive).

I saved the cost of the converter on the first piece of equipment I bought. But i would seriously look into the VFD if I was going to do it again.

Having said all that, if this was the only machine you were going to have, i would go single phase. Personally, i would look into a used combination Drill/Mill units or a used full size mill - Bridgeport mills are dirt cheap in California.

Ken

 

[ultrarunner]

3 phase rotary converters are much cheaper than 2 grand. For my shop, i have a 15 HP unit that was $1000 (including the 15 HP motor). A 5 HP unit is less than $500. Static converters are even cheaper but you only get 2/3rds power on your equipment. You can use variable frequency drives to generate 3 phase power. Someone i know got a surplus one for $150 for his 3 phase (no idea what loads his can drive).

I saved the cost of the converter on the first piece of equipment I bought. But i would seriously look into the VFD if I was going to do it again.

Having said all that, if this was the only machine you were going to have, i would go single phase. Personally, i would look into a used combination Drill/Mill units or a used full size mill - Bridgeport mills are dirt cheap in California.

Ken

When I bought my Bridgeport years ago it cost a lot!

All the shops that we used to do business with... Mom and Pop and 30 to 40 employee job shops are all gone... everyone of them. I've seen some equipment go for nearly scrap prices at times in the SF Bay Area.

Doubt you will find a Bridgeport with single phase... I know single phase was an expensive and rare option and that is why I ended up using a home made 1 hp rotary 3 phase converter.

 

[Willl]

Which one Eddie ?

I picked up the 43389 about 2 years ago and have been real pleased with it.

16 Speed Floor Drill Press

 

[woodlandfarms]

So all good info, but what should I be looking at in a used? Or heck in a new? The DP would be for metal work, and potentially cutting out 1.25" holes on some steel for an upcoming project.

 

[BobRip]

When you use large metal bits, you need low speed. I had a two pulley unit and burned up several bits from too high a speed. Look at charts and figure out the largest bit you will need and make sure the DP will go slow enough. My new one has three pulleys and goes below 200 (can't remember the exact speed.) At this speed you do not really need a lot of torque, but I like a full 1HP because they probably build the rest of the DP better.

 

[SpringHollow]

I know several machinists just running their Bridgeports on a static phase converter. You could do the same for a good old drill press. 1 1/2 HP drill press would still leave you with 1 HP. Slow is more important than anything else.

Ken

 

[lostcause]

my first thought would be to define the following: max budget, max physical size, max distance you will go to retrieve said item, maximum circuit size, and max hassle you are willing to go through before you can hit the on button.

budget... going used is good if you can find one. new imported will probably run between $500 & $750 (harbor freight, grizzly, jet, etc)

size... ballpark of 300lb would be a good ballpark for a drill only machine. a good mill/drill will range from 300-1000, and an old knee mill 1000-2000. how big of a unit can you physically fit in?

distance? the further you open your traveling range, the more you will find. granted, where you live there's probably some fairly close. if you have to travel a long ways or ship freight, a new local purchase may be a better deal. i needed to expand my range to 300-500 miles to find anything good makes new look as good as used.

circuit size... there are some decent sized ones that operate on a 120v circuit, but you are getting close to the range where they will (or can be) 240v, and not far form ones that are 3 phase only. 120 and 240 are no issue to wire for assuming you have open breaker slots( even if you go with a 120v you may have to run a dedicated circuit, because it will be a pretty good sized draw.) 3 phase will require a converter (extra $$) i can't say whether a static converter is really a good idea. i've heard lots of people say rotary only for this, but i dunno if they are overly cautions, or whether it is a must.

max hassle... order a new one and have it in a few days, plug it i and go. buy used and maybe have some cleaning or repair. buy three phase and have to worry about figuring out a rotary converter.

you said you want to drill 1 1/4 holes... to me, you will probably want 150 rpm or slower, and probably 1hp minimum. i put the model of a jet drill i had been looking at in your 3 phase thread. i think that is probably about as small as would be rated for the task. granted, we've all dome more with less - i drilled some 1" holes in steel with a tiny old 1/3hp benchtop, but it was not something i would want to do unless i had to. i've switched gears and decided to look for a small mill to do my drilling needs and maybe a little detail work too.

 

[SpringHollow]

Thinking outside the box, perhaps a mag drill? You could use a big metal plate as a base when milling smaller parts. Use annular cutters or hole saws when drilling large holes. Get the drill press style that have much larger travel. The variable speed Milwaukee's can turn extremely slowly.

I actually cut my holes by hand for my magnets etc using a Timberwolf variable speed right angle drill - a heavy duty right angle drill used for drilling plumbing holes through joists etc in construction. I used standard metal hole saws for the larger (up to ~ 3 1/2") holes in the 1/4" plate. Just had to take my time but it really did not take that long. I would not use a drill other than the Timberwolf. I bought this one many years ago because it had a slip clutch which might keep you from breaking your wrist if the drill bit binds.

Ken

 

[dfkrug]

Thinking outside the box, perhaps a mag drill? You could use a big metal plate as a base when milling smaller parts. Use annular cutters or hole saws when drilling large holes.

Yes! Champion has a mag drill on sale for $500 that includes 6 cutters.
That's a great deal.

The 39955 HF DP can be bought for a bit over $300 if you wait for a sale
and use a coupon. The specs still list it at 150RPM, but that is not true....
180 is the min speed. Also, the torque is so great at that speed that you
can slip the belts, not bog the motor. I feature it with my annular cutters
here:
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/build-yourself/169219-annular-cutters-better-way-drill.html

 

[jlrsn]

I had 3 phase power to my machine shop since the late 50s. When I retired I settled up in the Rockies many miles from the closest 3-phase power but I had 220v single phase power. I now use a 3-phase rotary phase converter in my 1,000' shop where I have more equipment than most full machine shops with most everything operating from 220v single phase power converted to balanced 3-phase power. For small equipment using 1/2hp or less 110v single phase power is all you need but some of my equipment uses 5hp 3-phase. Quality rotary phase converters are in the $500+ range or you can go to this site and build your own:

Transformers, Phase Converters and VFD

Good luck,
Jim

 

[2manyrocks]

Since it was brought up in this post, what's a dirt cheap price for a Bridgeport mill?

I have a huge old used Rockwell press that's got some wear in the bearings, but I haven't been able to find anything else to compare for what I paid ($75.00).

 

[jlrsn]

Since it was brought up in this post, what's a dirt cheap price for a Bridgeport mill? .

Dependent upon many factors such as the location, the economy, etc Bridgeport Vertical Mills, many that sold for well over $10,000, could be found in good condition for $1,500 or more. The last two Bridgeport Vertical Mills that I bought at auction cost me less than $5,500 each 10 years ago but I've seen older Vertical Mills from $1,500 on up and heard about $750. Bear in mind equipping a BP Vertical Mill could cost you as much as the Mill itself and they weigh upwards of 2,500 lbs or more. My last BP Vertical Mill that I still have is a Bridgeport Series 1 Model 2J2 Variable Speed. Before the price of everything dropped with the economy my mill would have cost in excess of $10K to $15K. You have to be real careful of mills that were worked to death and are basically not worth rebuilding. If you are interested a good investment is a book that is written by Steven Brooks regarding buying and rebuilding the older belt Series 1 Model J1 that has excellent advice, great quality pictures, and a real buy at $19.95 with $2.95 shipping on eBay at:

A Guide to Renovating the Bridgeport Series 1

He also has a great book on Southbend Lathes for the same price.

You won't find anything for $75 as the metal casting is worth much more than that nowadays.

You asked,
Jim

 

[SpringHollow]

Reasonable Bridgeports can be bought for $750 - 1500. (fortunately for Woodland Farms, most of the best deals are in California and Washington State, sometimes Ohio). Mine was $1200 in good shape (i knew the shop where it came from - old but not abused machine). 0.015 backlash in the handles which i thought was pretty good but since it came with a 3-axis DRO, even if it had much more, it would not be a problem. Took me a year or so to find one that was this nice but lucked out in that it was local.

Used Milwaukee Mag drills in good shape (the big drill press style) are about $350 - $550 if you wait for a good deal. I do not think i would get the style that does not have the long travel.

Not sure what used Mill/Drills are going for - mine was dirt cheap but needs repair.

Another nice source for how to rebuild: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280347760537&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT
$15 which he donates to charity. Very nice PDF which he emails you.

Ken

 

[jlrsn]

Reasonable Bridgeports can be bought for $750 - 1500.Ken

Even in real bad times a solid 1hp Belt Drive J-Head or 2hp 2J2 Variable Speed Head Mill that use the R-8 Collets which most of your attachments and adapters are made for sell for many times the $750 and up range in CA. I bought 1hp J-Head Belt Drive BPs in the past which ran quiet and were a fine mill. I bought most of my 2J2 Head Mills in CA.

I've seen a few well worn 1/2hp M-Head Mills go for in the $750 and up range but you're restricted to a No. 2 Morse, B & S #7, or a B-3 Spindle Taper with the maximum collet capacity of 0.5 inches which is OK for a home shop if you can get the tooling. I bought an R Head with an R-8 Spindle from the Bridgeport Factory Auction in CT. I collected BP Mills and still have my fully tooled 2hp 2J2 Variable Speed Head Mill with the R-Head mounted on the rear, and one of the first C-Heads in hardly used condition from the Navy Auction in CA that ran on 110v Single Phase. You can mount the C, M, and R-Heads on most of your smaller Horizontal Mills and use the Bed for vertical feed.

Ken,
What BP Mill did you get for $1,200?

Jim