Working on tractor with loader up...do you?

[johnk]

Gemoni.
I think some of Soundguys tractors are pretty old and didn't have provisions for them. Flatland is ok but getting on the grades is scary. How bout it soundguy? Got seatbelts and ROPS on the older stuff?

 

[Tom_Veatch]

... We are all responsible for our actions It is ok if we want to take risks. I do not feel it is ok to encourage others to do so.

And that really should be the last word on the subject.

We all, each and every one of us, take risks every day of our lives. It's a "risk/benefit" ratio thing. If, in any activity, we believe the risk low enough and/or the benefit high enough, we step over the bar and do it. Otherwise, we don't. Each of us, individually, must decide how high to place our personal "risk/benefit" bar. No one can decide where to place the bar for anyone else -- unless, of course, the one doing the deciding is a congress-critter courting votes for re-election.

 

[SpringHollow]

I have been reading this thread with interest and discussing it with my brother. Well, the debate is over for me. He just emailed me and said that last night a hose on the loader sprung a leak and the bucket instantly "dropped like a stone" and there was no way he could have gotten out in time if he happened to be under it.

Ken

 

[mwark]

I agree with soundguy there might be less than you think.

I am overweight by about 30 pounds, I do ride a motorcycle... I scuba dive, I have been known to hang glide, and I argue with my wife. Those are all unsafe things to do and I will freely admit that they are unsafe.

LMAOROTF, hang gliding & scuba diving! Man you're Evel Knievel.

It is possible; there may be fewer members that are risk takers than I think but your post supports my position not his (Soundguy).

Your Honor, The defense rests….

 

[gemini5362]

LMAOROTF, hang gliding & scuba diving! Man you're Evel Knievel.

It is possible; there may be fewer members that are risk takers than I think but your post supports my position not his (Soundguy).

Your Honor, The defense rests….

No you mentioned specific items, smoking, drinking adult beverages, overweight, not wearing seat belts. I just said there might be less people that do that than you think. I did not say that there were not risk takers.

 

[mwark]

With out question these activities and many more like them are going to do much more harm too many more to our members than working under an unsupported loader.

COLOR]

This is what I said.

As you can see I was referring to risk in general. I didn't think it would be necessary or productive to list every conceivable risky activity in order to make my point. I may have been wrong.

 

[RoyJackson]

Here's a quick experiment for all you guys who think working under a raised loader is an acceptable risk...

Raise your loader as high as it will go. Shut your engine down, then push the joystick forward.
Notice how fast it drops? And how quiet until the bucket hits the ground.

That's how long you have to notice it dropping and to get out of the way. Remember, that loader will probably have to fall no more then ½ way before it strikes you.

 

[Soundguy]

As long as speech is free.. and I'm not violating a rule on this forum.. if I see a person doing somthing unsafe.. then I'm going to comment on it.

lets face it.. this issue clearly passes the 'rational' test. Every manufacture that i can find ont he internet has warnings about standing under unsuported hyds. OSHA has a section / ruling on it. I don't think it is a debate issue.

And just because 30,000 or 300,000 people are also doing unsafe things .. well.. it doesn't change the facts. It's medically proven that smoking can cause health problems. The fact that there are umpteen million smokers does nothing to change the fact that it is bad for you.

And I think you are mistaken about the 'stay in holland' comment.. it is nowhere in my message.

By the way.. going along with what I said in the first sentence.. you are also freely entitled to your opinion of this situation. I accept that.. though don't have to agree with it specifically.

Soundguy

Maybe more than you think...

There is no reason for any members to criticize another member for behavior were the likelihood of injury far less than activities that many of us participate in everyday.

Like I said, I support my FEL before going under it but he’s not an idiot because he doesn’t and I’m certainly not going to say to him “Stay in Holland, we got some idiots to send you so you won't be lonely”.

 

[Soundguy]

Hmm soundguy do you always wear your seatbelt when you are on your tractor ?

If my tractor has a rops.. you BET.

On the ones with no rops.. no seatbelt.

Soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

Some? HA.. MOST of my stuff is older...

Only my 'new' stuff has rops. My Nh 7610s has a rops, and I DO wear a seatbelt even if I'm only moving it 3 feet. My farm CUV has a rops.. I wear a seatbelt in it too.

no seatbelts on the non rops 'oldies' i drive.

Soundguy

Gemoni.
I think some of Soundguys tractors are pretty old and didn't have provisions for them. Flatland is ok but getting on the grades is scary. How bout it soundguy? Got seatbelts and ROPS on the older stuff?

 

[Soundguy]

I agree...

And that is with the oil exhausting to sump thru the loader valve. imagine if a fitting broke off right on the cylinder... no hose resistance.. no valve port restrictions= quicker drop.

To reiterate I still stand by the concept that regardless if you want to do something risky yourself.. you shouldn't say it is 'safe' and possibly lead others to think they can also be safe and do it.

Soundguy

Here's a quick experiment for all you guys who think working under a raised loader is an acceptable risk...

Raise your loader as high as it will go. Shut your engine down, then push the joystick forward.
Notice how fast it drops? And how quiet until the bucket hits the ground.

That's how long you have to notice it dropping and to get out of the way. Remember, that loader will probably have to fall no more then ½ way before it strikes you.

 

[mwark]

And I think you are mistaken about the 'stay in holland' comment.. it is nowhere in my message.

Not to nit-pick but actually you are mistaken. I never attributed the “Holland” comment to you. It was merely an example of some of the vitriol that a few of our member directed towards Renze of Holland. He didn’t deserve to be treated that way.

And just to be clear, as I have said several times, I have always supported my loader and will continue to do so no matter how remote the possibility of an accident is.

 

[gemini5362]

Soundguy that is one that I admit to not doing I dont remember to wear my seatbelt on the tractor. I am pretty conservative with the way I drive it but I should wear it every time I move it. I do have a question though. Since I have a cab on my tractor and could not be thrown out where something could smash me in a rollover is seatbelts necessary ?

 

[Soundguy]

I'm kinda a stickler for seatbelts... If I have pasangers.. I pretty much won't move the vehicle till the latches click.

I've always worn them.. and have been in one bad accident a dozen or so ys ago ( not my fault) where I would probably have been road pizza had I not been wearing it, and as a result.. just broke some bones in my hand and jacked my back up for a few months.. that just serves to reinforce my conviction about safety devices.. etc..

Soundguy

Soundguy that is one that I admit to not doing I dont remember to wear my seatbelt on the tractor. I am pretty conservative with the way I drive it but I should wear it every time I move it. I do have a question though. Since I have a cab on my tractor and could not be thrown out where something could smash me in a rollover is seatbelts necessary ?

 

[D7E]

At least on our manlift.. there are safety check pilots on the hyd cyl itself...


Soundguy

Most of the excavators,Telehandlers,backhoes,loaders around today have or can have checkvalves fitted , Except the older ones of course.
Most of the sites i work on will not hire a machine without them,

 

[Renze]

Not to throw more coals on the fire, but today i was at a spring machinery demo at a dealer. They zip tied angle irons to all loaders on the lot. But on the leaflet of the brand new Claas tractors with factory fitted (Mailleux) loaders, they showed a picture of a raised loader and opened hood, the text written with it was that with the loader on, the servicing of the tractor was just as easy as with no loader at all... No mention of check valves, locking mechanism or safety warnings... Not that it means anything, but in the American leaflet, they wouldnt have showed this without a load of warnings, or they simply didnt show anything like this at all.... In Europe, people have their own responsibility, where america is known for its lawyers and billion dollar claims to manufacturers....

We all, each and every one of us, take risks every day of our lives. Each of us, individually, must decide how high to place our personal "risk/benefit" bar.QUOTE]

Tom Veatch has got my point.
I didnt tell anyone to work UNsafe or said that other people shouldnt support their loader when working under it because i dont do that either...
There were just some folks telling me where to put my personal "risk/benefit" bar, as Tom described it.
It's my responsibilty, and not your business at all. Telling me what to do with a tendency of getting personal, shows a weak mind,. would rather call -that- stupid

 

[Soundguy]

Weak? the only thing weak I see is your weak argument vs doing something safely..

And yes.. I agree.. liability laws int he us DO tend to drive the ';safety label' market...

Soundguy

 

[Renze]

Weak? the only thing weak I see is your weak argument vs doing something safely..

As said, this is a matter of where to put your personal bar. So any argument is useless.

 

[mwark]

MOST of my stuff is older...

Only my 'new' stuff has rops.

Soundguy

Renze, Your correct when you say that everyone need to decide how much risk they are willing to take. I'm sure we would all agree that many more of us will be injured or killed by operating a tractor with out ROPs than working on an unsupported loader. A gold star for you for not calling people names that are without question taking much more risk than you.

May the force be with you,

mwark