Working on tractor with loader up...do you?

[Renze]

I am an idiot too, having absolutely no problem working under raised loaders as long as there's no one in the cab, kids e.g. who like to pull levers.

The logic that there's just that .59$ O ring.... sounds like crap to me.
There is a similar .59ct o ring that's in the master brake cylinder of your family car, or a 1 dollar light switch on the reading lamp above your bed, that separates your finger from you and a lethal voltage...

 

[johnk]

Whats the danger then if you raise the loader and work under it? What else could make it crush your head?? I say O-Ring... I wouldn't lay under my Box blade with the rippers down either to work on it on the 3 PT. Maybe I'm just scared og O-Rings.

 

[gemini5362]

I am an idiot too, having absolutely no problem working under raised loaders as long as there's no one in the cab, kids e.g. who like to pull levers.

The logic that there's just that .59$ O ring.... sounds like crap to me.
There is a similar .59ct o ring that's in the master brake cylinder of your family car, or a 1 dollar light switch on the reading lamp above your bed, that separates your finger from you and a lethal voltage...

While it is true that the master cylinder has o rings that is not really an apt comparison. If the master cylinder fails then all cars that I have seen have an emergency brake. If it is a standard you can downshift to slow down. Depending on circumstances your brakes could fail and if you did not have to come to an emergency stop you can just coast to a stop possibly.

If the hydraulics fail on your tractor and the bucket comes down on top of you that is going to be very serious or more than likely a terminal injury.

 

[Soundguy]

Yes.. I agree.. you are an idiot.

Your argument about the brakes having an oring IS NOT the same comparison. At least in your car, you are strapped in to a padded cheair, with good restraints, and possibly an air bag, and have a metal shell enclosing you that has been engineered with crumple zones to help absorb the energy of an impact... plus you might have an emergency brake, or be able to downshift.

now.. if you are standing under you laoder bucket, and it drops.. you got what? some air between your head and the bucket.. maybee an inch of fluffy hair? I'll take the car with no brakes ANY day vs letting a pile of scrap metal come crashing down on my head.

Soundguy

I am an idiot too, having absolutely no problem working under raised loaders as long as there's no one in the cab, kids e.g. who like to pull levers.

The logic that there's just that .59$ O ring.... sounds like crap to me.
There is a similar .59ct o ring that's in the master brake cylinder of your family car, or a 1 dollar light switch on the reading lamp above your bed, that separates your finger from you and a lethal voltage...

 

[Z-Michigan]

Even dumber yet, about 10 feet in front of the tractor, just out of the frame of the picture below, was a yard swing made of 6x6 posts. All I had to do was drive it a few more feet and set the bucket on the beam of the swing.

Just gave me an idea - I think my new pole barn is going to have a wood frame inside at an appropriate height (guessing 7' or so) that I can lower the loader bucket onto to while doing simple work like an oil change or air filter change. Probably cost me less than $50 if I do it while we're building everything else.

My other thought was to chain the bucket to a strong rafter - but that sounds more difficult than lowering the bucket onto a purpose made beam.

 

[johnk]

Thanks Soundguy,

All I was saying is think of the mechanical and material elements keeping you safe. They could fail at any time causing death, If you want to live on the edge put your loader up and work on it with no other saftey blanket. Maybe your wife will sell your tractor to me cheap and maybe at what you told her you paid for it!! Just trying to remind everyone to be safe. It's not paranoia just common sense.

 

[Renze]

True, if the car brakes fail, you can downshift, have the car roll untill it stops, etcetera. All kinds of excuses can be found to think you'll survive a brake failure that you'll notice right on the moment you needed them.

I guess it's easier that when you are alarmed by the hissing sound of oil, lean back and miss the loader arms that are going to take 5 seconds to drop before they reach the ground, than to make it around the corner at 100 km/h instead of 50 like you'd do when the brakes DID work.

Statistically the chance that the loader arms of a loader with no load on it, will drop due to hydraulic failure, is smaller than winning the lottery and getting killed by a flower pot that falls off the balcony, all on the same day.
If the hose was to blow, it would have done when breaking loose a bucket of muck from the pile, not when there's no load at all on it.

Sure i know that you guys all read your operator manuals carefully and saw that you're not supposed to work under raised loader arms, but manufacturers try to do everything to keep ahead of any inventive creatures filing charges against manufacturers to get rich from the event of breaking a fingernail.

I dont want to bend this into a "idiots vs. paranoids" battle of wits, but if you live worried, you'll die in fear.

At least i'm a HAPPY idiot

 

[RoyJackson]

Simple answer....NO!

Most I'll do is move and curl/dump the bucket for access to the zerk fittings.

 

[Defective]

If the hose was to blow, it would have done when breaking loose a bucket of muck from the pile, not when there's no load at all on it.

Tell that to the front end of my old Mustang. I parked it under the raised loader to make room in the garage. Made a mess when the loader sat on it in the middle of the night.

if you live worried, you'll die in fear.

At least i'm a HAPPY idiot

Me too...

 

[gemini5362]

I have only had a loader for a year now so I can not say what will happen if there is a hydraulic failure other than when I have had a couple of hoses break and that was an immediate failure.

I have however been driving for more than 40 years and I have had breaks fail on me several times. 1 time when they failed I hit the emergency brake and stopped. Another time I downshifted to 2nd and then 1st. Actually I think i have done the download thing 2 or three times. I will admit only once have I ever let the car coast to a stop. That was because it happened to an automatic and no way to downshift. It was not my car and when I hit the emergency brake it did not work. Before the comment is made about why I have had brake problems. A couple of times it was from overloading the heck out of my trailer and actually having so much weight on there that when I hit the brakes it blew out my master cylinder. 1 time was from a hose that broke. 1 time was from a new rotor that I had put on that evidently had a crack that I missed I hit the brakes and the rotor broke which let the pads go all the way out and the wheel cylinder piston blew out leaving me with no brakes. That was pretty scary because I was in chicago at the time in some pretty serioud traffic going about 70. That was a downshift and hit the emergency brake as soon as i got over on the shoulder.

 

[N80]

With that kind of luck you should never work under a raised loader!

 

[Soundguy]

I guess it's easier that when you are alarmed by the hissing sound of oil, lean back and miss the loader arms that are going to take 5 seconds to drop before they reach the ground,

You are assuming that the hYD failure is a leak.. and not a catastrophic failure.. like a fitting that was cracked giving way and letting the cyl drop immediatly. leak or no leak.. it's stupid to work under a bucket with no safety support.

It has nothing to do about living in gfear.. it has to do with living with dilligence. Unfortunately.. it seems there are more bold/stupid people around than diligent ones.. and in most circles, 'stupid' passes for fearless...

Soundguy

 

[Renze]

Soundguy, I find it amusing how some people are eager to call another an idiot because they dont share your point of view...

Bushmen from Africa are scared the heck by any storm or high water, because they know they life below the sea level in the western netherlands. On the other hand, Dutch city slickers sleep sweet at 5,5 meter below sea level, while they cant close an eye in an African nomad hut because of the little critters, and a jackal howl in the far distance.

When you grow up with things, you cope easier with the risks involved.

 

[gemini5362]

Renze I believe the problem is people that look to this website for information. There will be some people that have never had a tractor with FEL before and know absolutely nothing about hydraulics. They read your post that says if a leak occurs it will be hissing and you have time to get out of the way. When they read that they assume that it is safe to work that way. The majority of people on here know differently and try to point out how big a risk you are taking when you do that. If you want to work under your FEL and take that risk that is your buisness. I personally would not do it nor would I reccomend anyone else do that. The people that dont know any better are the ones that I personally try to reach when I talk about safety issues. I am sure that even you will agree is that all it takes is one check valve spring to break or even a older o ring to fail and the hydraulics can come down very quickly. It takes very little effort to make something to hold the FEL up or to put it on the ground and try to work around it. Why risk your life even if it is a small risk. As far as living in fear. Why is it that people who take unneccessary risks talk about people who are safe as being afraid to take chances ? I can tell you one thing I take big big chances. I have actually looked at my wife and said no dear you do not look good in that dress. Top that when you want to talk about taking chances.

 

[D7E]

If hydraulics are so uncertain is using a man platform or a cherry picker dangerous ? I used to have a tree care business where we used a telehandler with a work platform attached to it for high work, the boys seemed to prefer that to hanging on a rope with a chainsaw tied to your belt.
Previously i said that i use angle iron when working under loaders but only for something major like an inframe motor rebuild , use common sense when greasing or whatever you can avoid standing directly under the bucket.

 

[gemini5362]

I dont know enough to answer about cherry pickers but I am of the opinion since they are made for people to stand in that the hydraulics are set up differently. I am sure there will be a lot of posters that will be happy to tell you about the hazards of working with a man basket on a fork lift and that is hydraulics

 

[Tom_Veatch]

... I have actually looked at my wife and said no dear you do not look good in that dress. ...

Well now, there's courage ... and then again, there's foolhardiness!

 

[Tom_Veatch]

I'm sure this guy does, but he always blocks it up and chocks the wheels.
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=72647&stc=1&d=1174494300

 

[Renze]

Renze I believe the problem is people that look to this website for information. There will be some people that have never had a tractor with FEL before and know absolutely nothing about hydraulics.

so...the conclusion is that the majority of people here agrees that i'm an idiot, because what i say might misguide some rookies that never been around FELs before, who follow blindly what they read here ?? Then who are the idiots

lifting chains might break. They are tested annually in a hydraulic test bench that strains them to somewhere about 150% of the nominal permitted work load. If they hold, they are safety approved for professional use for another year.

when i attack the muck heap with my loader, the rear end of my Zetor 5245 comes loose when i back out of the bunk silo because there´s a nasty 1 foot high ridge to keep effluent in and rain water out.
When there is just an empty bucket, the pressure in the cylinder will be somewhere about 10% of the scenario when it is loaded to full lift capacity and you ride over a bump.-
The chance that the hydraulic system will just break, is next to non existant.
IF it does break, there is so little pressure in the cylinder that it takes quite some time before all the oil is pressed out and the loader is down.

Now there might be a chance that it starts going down due to a leaking cylinder o ring. If there was enough leakage to make oil seep past the o ring on an empty loader, the fully loaded loader will drop down so fast that you´d sure noticed. In that scenario i might think it over, but with leakage within normal operating margins, i dont care at all to work under it.
When i hide myself behind a welding helmet, i do check the loader every few minutes just to be sure, but for a 100 hour service, the risk of getting hurt by a dropping loader is a 1000 times smaller than getting hurt by the flower pot that falls off the balcony of the 5th floor....

I can respect your opinion about safety, so i expect you to respect mine as well (unless you´re an idiot off course)

 

[johnk]

Sure hope you don't have any enemies that push forward on the joystick when you're under your raised loader. Accidents do happen and thats why they call them accidents. Taking a few steps to assure your safety aren't foolish by any means. S@@t happens......Anyone can do whatever they want thats what makes the world go around. Some just take a little more care than others to stay safe. Nothing wrong with living on the edge or being safe. Those are choices we have the freedom to make. Are you still there??? Just kidding.....