Woodland Mills sawmill trailer stability.

[plowhog]

I went with Woodland Mills for several reasons.

A deciding reason for me was an earlier purchase of a Woodland Mills wood chipper. It works well, was pretty easy to assemble, has not broken down, and was delivered when they said it would be. Choosing Woodland Mills for a chipper was a solid choice-- and I figured the sawmill would probably be similar. It was.

btw check out Youtube videos "sawing with Sandy" which are excellent. He has a Woodland Mills sawmill. I've watched a number of them.

 

[N80]

A deciding reason for me was an earlier purchase of a Woodland Mills wood chipper. It works well, was pretty easy to assemble, has not broken down, and was delivered when they said it would be. Choosing Woodland Mills for a chipper was a solid choice-- and I figured the sawmill would probably be similar. It was.

btw check out Youtube videos "sawing with Sandy" which are excellent. He has a Woodland Mills sawmill. I've watched a number of them.

I got the WC68 wood chipper along with the sawmill. It works great. Seems well made.

The Sawing with Sandy videos influenced my choice.

 

[N80]

It is to the company that came up with it...

I bet it is to Peter Dale, as he holds many patents and has to continue to defend them...

SR

That's just the way things work in the world of commerce. Always have.

 

[Rebeldad1]

i would say 19" in front of the axle makes better sense

 

[KennyG]

I thought about that but good grief an extra wrench and a couple of sockets would solve that problem. Maybe another $30?

I guess they might think that if I'm so cheap that I bought a mill that I have to put together myself that I might be too cheap to buy an extra wrench.

The hardware is generic and used for some really cheap stuff. If you spend some time in some countries, you will find the average mechanic is lucky to even have a single complete set.

 

[s219]

After re-reading your post today, I think I now see the confusion...

You see it as Frontier copied Woodland. BUT, the part you are missing is, the Lumbermate (designed and built by Norwood) came BEFORE the Woodland OR Frontier!

Woodland copied the Lumbermate, and Frontier also copied the Lumbermate, BUT the Lumbermate was THEIR own mill, so they copied themselves.

The Lumbermate came first and was dropped when Norwood came out with an even bigger mill, (todays design) and brought back the Lumbermate design as a lower cost mill built in china.

The whole idea of a homeowner BSM got started with the Mark 3 in the early 90's, like 91 or 92 by my friend Peter Dale.

SR

Well there is very little resemblance between the Woodland models and the old Lumbermate, so if Woodland copied it they must have been blind. I also see little resemblance between the Frontier models and the old Lumbermate (or new Lumbermate).

I am not talking about who came first, that is a different thing. Woodland is a very young company, so pretty much every other established mill company came before them.

What Woodland did first is develop a light duty tinker toy mill assembled from many small parts made in China. Those mill designs were unique because of the way it was manufactured, parted, shipped, and assembled. Just a guess, but the Woodland design probably has at least 2X the parts and 4X the number of fasteners of the old Lumbermate.

If you look at the Norwood lineup in the years before Woodland entered the market, they had nothing like those tinker toy mills. It wasn't until 5-6 years after Woodland impacted the market that Norwood created the Frontier brand to compete. Also made in China, it uses angle iron tracks on footpads, rectangle tube bunks, a bolted-together carriage from square tube and laser-cut gusset plates, etc. Harbor Freight and WoodMaxx mills (which predated Frontier) do the same thing. All of them are copies of the Woodland design.

 

[s219]

Old Lumbermate Mark III -- notice the type of track (slotted beam) and the type of carriage (welded space frame):



Old Woodland HM-126 (their first 2012 model) -- notice how it uses angle iron track and the carriage is bolted together with square tubing and laser-cut gusset plates, very little resemblance to the Mark III:



New Woodland HM-126 (2021 model):



New Frontier OS27 (2021 model):



Compare the angle iron tracks, the rectangle tube bunks, the laser-cut gusset plates and square posts on the carriage, etc... All of that was copied from Woodland's play book. The Frontier is a Chinese clone of a Chinese mill.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

Once again, the Mark 3 you are showing, ISN'T the first generation Mark 3.

Was Woodland selling BSM's before 1990? They copied the LM2000 NOT the Mark 3.

BTW, I owned a Mark 3...

SR

 

[s219]

I don't see a strong resemblance to the LM2000 either.

The old Norwoods are substantially beefier and heavier than the Woodland/Chinese tinker toy designs, both the track/rails and the carriage parts. It's a different design philosophy for a different market and different business model. Nobody offered that type of mill before Woodland came to market in 2012.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

OK, I'll try again... I first reacted to you saying this,

Actually, Woodland started the whole trend many years ago with the low-cost "tinker toy" mills made in China. At the time, they had a unique design not based on anyone else. It was much lighter duty than a Woodmizer or Norwood, for example, with much more assembly required -- you'd never mistake the Woodland for anyone else! I didn't particularly like their early mills, but they were very successful and made a big dent in the market. It was Woodland that got copied by Harbor Freight, Woodmaxx, and other Chinese clones in time. Woodland was so successful that Norwood eventually entered the low-cost market with their eerily-similar Frontier line made in China, and even Woodmizer has a low-cost model line now. In my opinion they are all decent mills as long as you know what you are getting.

The Mark 3 came out long before woodland had a mill, and it was intended to be a cheap homeowner BSM, and it was, is sold cheap. That being the case, how did woodland "start the whole trend" ?? They didn't, Peter Dale did, when he sold MANY thousands of BSM's directly to buyers' doors, in the early 90's.

Then, the Mark 3 grew to be the LM2000. You claim woodlands mill was copied by Norwood, BUT woodlands bunks, band wheels, guides, log dog, log post and most other "meat and potatoes" parts of woodlands mill, are a direct copy of the LM2000!!!

SO, just because the bracing and some "other" cosmetic parts of the Norwood mill looks the same as woodlands, you can't get past the part that all the "important" parts are copied off the first made/sold LM2000, and the Frontier copied the LM2000 parts!

And why wouldn't Norwood do that? They are proven parts of their own design!

I hope this clears this all up...

I'd be happy to try and answer any other questions you may have too...

SR

 

[Hilbilly]

I have a Norwood Lumblite 24. Not sure where this fits into the chronology of BSM's. It was the cheapest BSM they sold at the time, about 14 or 15 years ago. It came with angle iron tracks and real cheesy angle iron bunks with poor support brackets. It also came with a 6 hp engine that I later replaced with a honda 13 hp. It always had head shake and sometimes it was really bad. After looking at the saw head on the Woodland mills BSM's, I decided to beef up mine by adding a second set of uprights and cross members, similar to the Woodland Mills. It made a huge difference. I can't recall what I paid for mine but think it was around $3,000 CAD.

Seems to me that the Woodland Mills low end model is a better design and sturdier than LL24 and probably cheaper ( in terms of current $ ).

I think you should at least see if you can pick up the tongue of the trailer. If it really hard or you can't, then it is likely weighted right right (assuming the total weight is 1800 lbs as someone stated earlier). If it is really light or lifts up on its own, I suspect you will have problems towing it any distance and especially at high speed.

 

[s219]

OK, I'll try again... I first reacted to you saying this,

The Mark 3 came out long before woodland had a mill, and it was intended to be a cheap homeowner BSM, and it was, is sold cheap. That being the case, how did woodland "start the whole trend" ?? They didn't, Peter Dale did, when he sold MANY thousands of BSM's directly to buyers' doors, in the early 90's.

Then, the Mark 3 grew to be the LM2000. You claim woodlands mill was copied by Norwood, BUT woodlands bunks, band wheels, guides, log dog, log post and most other "meat and potatoes" parts of woodlands mill, are a direct copy of the LM2000!!!

SO, just because the bracing and some "other" cosmetic parts of the Norwood mill looks the same as woodlands, you can't get past the part that all the "important" parts are copied off the first made/sold LM2000, and the Frontier copied the LM2000 parts!

And why wouldn't Norwood do that? They are proven parts of their own design!

I hope this clears this all up...

I'd be happy to try and answer any other questions you may have too...

SR

I am not going to keep arguing about this. I don't think you've ever seen a Woodland Mills sawmill in person. Some of the things you claim were copied are extremely different. For example -- Woodland uses very primitive fixed hardened steel blocks with rear bearings for blade guides, mounted in machined aluminum housings, whereas the Norwood 2000 had nice beefy roller guides on each side mounted on steel axle posts. Could not be more different. If Woodland copied that, they were blind!

So I admit defeat. I had no idea Norwood was selling low cost hybrid-design Chinese mills decades before Woodland ever went into business, nor that they had claimed the original market on things like log posts and band wheels. Woodland even copied the round shape of wheels, without which they would have probably tried using squares with very poor results. I also just realized that Woodland has a ruler scale on their mills, also copied from Norwood no doubt! They used inches just like Norwood. This is a deep case of industrial espionage and possibly involves time travel.

I do have to give Norwood credit, they were using welded assemblies for their carriage bases on their original mills. When Woodland "copied" that it turned into a half dozen laser cut plates and 16-20 bolts to hold it all together. Some chewing gum too. Clearly Woodland did not understand how to copy and implement welding technology. But Norwood got back on track and did a better job copying with the Frontiers. I think they have even more plates and bolts than Woodland, so they are going in the right direction.

Happy sawing all!

 

[N80]

What difference does it make?

 

[Hilbilly]

What difference does it make?

None. The only thing that matters, is if you are happy with the mill or not.

By the way, did you try to lift the tongue of the trailer with the head secured at the recommended location?

 

[Sawyer Rob]

What difference does it make?

None really, I was just trying to set the record straight with some history that I know the facts to, but I can now see he's not willing to learn anything and is taking it personal.

So, I'll just drop it and anyone who wants more info can message me or look the facts up for themselves.

Last thing I will say is, I've milled logs on the Woodland, owned the Norwood models and used many other BSM since I bought my first mill in the 90's. Anyone who wants to try out many different BSM's should go to some of the shows and try them for themselves.

SR

 

[N80]

None. The only thing that matters, is if you are happy with the mill or not.

Right now I'm very happy with it but it is way too early to tell. We've only cut up one log!

By the way, did you try to lift the tongue of the trailer with the head secured at the recommended location?

Not yet. The mill will stay down at my cabin/property. I live in town about 45 minutes away. Hope to make it down there this weekend and will test things out.

 

[nisaacs]

Right now I'm very happy with it but it is way too early to tell. We've only cut up one log!


Not yet. The mill will stay down at my cabin/property. I live in town about 45 minutes away. Hope to make it down there this weekend and will test things out.

What engine hp option did you get? A lot of them seem to be under powered with the standard offering.

 

[N80]

I got the 14 which is the biggest they offer. I think they go as low as 7.

 

[plowhog]

I got the 14 which is the biggest they offer.

Mine is 14hp also. It seems like the right power for the mill (although you can never have too much ..)

fyi their manual recommends first oil change at 5 hours.

The 14hp cuts easily through pine and cedar. You do have to find the right "pace" of moving the mill down the track. Not too fast.

Had to go a little slower through this 24" oak limb-- making a slab. And it gave a little hesitation when encountering two knots where smaller limbs use to protrude. But my blade was also getting a little dull-- probably 2/3 the way toward needing a newer sharper one. (I've only changed the blade once so far.)

fyi that's a 30" bar on my Stihl 462 saw.

 

[N80]

@plowhog I did buy a pack of blades for hardwoods. I have a fairly large white oak down that I hope to get to in a few weeks.

I did not realize you had the trailer too. Where did you set your lockdown position? Have you towed it yet?