Where to start?

[wyogal57]

Our plans for a few years down the road have suddenly happened much sooner. We're in escrow on a property and closing in a few weeks! We currently own 3 horses and plan to add a few more along with some cattle when we move onto the new property. We're going to need a tractor and I'm hoping to purchase within the next few months as we will be feeding large bales and need to stock up before winter. I know next to nothing about tractors, I've been doing some research but it's a bit overwhelming with all of the options! My SO grew up working on farms so he's a lot more knowledgeable about operating and what we'll need. This post is mostly for my own sanity!

We need a tractor capable of moving large hay bales (rounds 1,200-1,700lbs), plowing and moving snow, spreading manure, and dragging the arena. I'm sure we'll find more uses for it, but these are the basic things I know we'll need to do. The outbuildings on the property were built for large equipment so we have room for storing the tractor and can get a pretty large tractor into the hay storage area. We won't be using the tractor to clean stalls inside the barn, and the outside runs are around 12' wide. The terrain is relatively flat especially in the areas that we'll be taking the tractor into regularly. From what I can find we'll need at least a 70hp tractor to be able to handle the hay bales. We'd like to get a 4wd for winter as we are in Wyoming and can get quite a bit of snow. My SO would like a diesel. We have quite a few dealers near us, so our options as far as brands go are pretty open. Ideally we'd like to stay around 50K, but I want to make sure that we won't outgrow whatever we end up buying.

With that being said, where the heck do I start? I know trucks, but hydraulics, loader attachments, tire weights, etc. are a whole new game. Is there a tractor buying guide for newbies that goes over the larger tractors? I've found plenty of information on smaller subcompact tractors but we need a utility size. What HP would you recommend? Brand? Models to look at or avoid? Buy new or used? Any recommendations or a direction to start would be much appreciated!

 

[ericm979]

It does not take much power to lift that much weight. But you need a tractor that has the lifting capacity and is heavy enough that the load won't over power it.

My 37hp tractor can handle IBC totes full of firewood that weigh 2000 lbs. But it's a heavy tractor for the engine HP, and I had the dealer fill the tires to add weight in the back. HP is a proxy for size and weight but it's approximate at best. For example the Kubota L3901 which has the same engine HP as mine weighs 1200 lbs less and has much less loader capacity.

All modern compact tractors are diesel and most are 4wd.

For Wyoming you will probably want a cab.

 

[Diggin It]

The only thing I'll say is here is don't get hung up on color (brand). Green and Orange paint cost a lot more than Red or Blue.

 

[nybirdman]

I think you are in the ball park;70 H.P.+or -.What dealers are in the area?Talk to your neighbors;what are they using for equiptment?
4WD,cab(snow removal),R1(AG) or the new R14 ,loaded.

 

[jeff9366]

Where the heck do I start?

The fundamental importance of TRACTOR WEIGHT eludes many tractor shoppers. Tractor weight is more important identifying tractor capability than tractor horsepower.

The most efficient way to shop for tractors is to first identify potential tractor applications, then, through consulataton, establish bare tractor weight necessary to safely accomplish your applications. Tractor dealers, experienced tractor owners and TractorByNet.com are sources for weight recommendations.

Bare tractor weight is a fundamental tractor specification easily found in sales brochures and web sites, readily comparable across tractor brands and tractor models, new and used. Shop your weight range within tractor brands. Budget will eliminate some choices. Collect a dealer brochure for each tractor model in your weight range.

I spreadsheet tractor and implement specs, often a revealing exercise which cuts through specification clutter. I have a column for cost per pound.

Selling a used tractor is easy. Selling multiple light implements in order to buy heavier, wider implements for a new, heavier tractor requires a lot of time. Depreciation on implements is worse than depreciation on a tractor.

A quality dealer, reasonably close, available for coaching, is important for tractor neophytes. Most new tractors are delivered with a glitch or two requiring correction. My kubota dealer is six miles away. I feel my local dealer continues to add value to my equipment after eight years. Dealer proximity is less important for those experienced with tractors and qualified to perform their own maintenance.

BUY ENOUGH TRACTOR.​

 

[wyogal57]

It does not take much power to lift that much weight. But you need a tractor that has the lifting capacity and is heavy enough that the load won't over power it.

My 37hp tractor can handle IBC totes full of firewood that weigh 2000 lbs. But it's a heavy tractor for the engine HP, and I had the dealer fill the tires to add weight in the back. HP is a proxy for size and weight but it's approximate at best. For example the Kubota L3901 which has the same engine HP as mine weighs 1200 lbs less and has much less loader capacity.

All modern compact tractors are diesel and most are 4wd.

For Wyoming you will probably want a cab.

Thank you, that makes a lot of sense. Do you have a recommendation on minimum weight for the tractor? Yes, I think that a cab will definitely be worth the money!

 

[jeff9366]

We need a tractor capable of moving large hay bales (rounds 1,200-1,700 lbs)

Could be. In my area of Florida, which is hay country, round bales seldom weigh over 1,200 pounds.

An open station tractor with a bare weight of 3,700 to 4,000 pounds can lift and move 1,200 pound round bales using a bale spear on the Front End Loader and stack them at least two bales high. However, the tractor will feel very tippy to a new operator lifting bales to stack. Mid weight compact tractors of 3,700 to 4,000 pounds bare tractor weight are often used to groom arenas.

An open station tractor weighing 3,700 to 4,000 pounds can transport 1,200+ pound round bales safely with a Three Point Hitch mounted (rear) bale spear but can only lift bales a few inches. Transport but no stacking. The tractor is stable because the bale weight is low and bale weight is carried on the large, rear tractor tires, which do not pivot/steer.

A tractor with a bare weight of 3,700 to 4,000 pounds is suitable for actually working 10 to 25 acres of farm acreage. Working acres, not total acres.

For safety most recommend a 5,000 pound bare weight tractor for moving and lifting bales heavier than 1,200 pounds using a bale spear on the Front End Loader and for safely moving/stacking 1,200 pound bales by inexperienced tractor operators using a front bale spear. A 5,000 pound bare weight tractor can stack round bales at least three high.

A tractor with a bare weight of 5,000 pounds is suitable for actually working 20 to 40 acres of farm acreage. Working acres, not total acres.

BUY ENOUGH TRACTOR.​

 

[jeff9366]

Brand? Models to look at or avoid? Buy new or used?

The design of the Three Point Hitch tractor has been marketed in the USA since 1939 -- 82 years in 2021.

The basic design is generic.

Kubota and Deere have most of the market through 6,000 pound bare weight tractors. But this Kubota/Deere predominance is regional.

The up and coming tractor brands are Korean: Kioti, LS and Branson. There are other Korean brands. You have to critically assess dealer stability while shopping minor brands.

Korean manufacturing labor is paid 50% of what Deere pays its union work force. Japanese manufacturing labor is paid 70% of what Deere pays its union work force. Labor costs strongly influence tractor prices.

 

[wyogal57]

Where the heck do I start?

The fundamental importance of TRACTOR WEIGHT eludes many tractor shoppers. Tractor weight is more important identifying compact tractor capability than tractor horsepower.

The most efficient way to shop for tractors is to first identify potential tractor applications, then, through consulataton, establish bare tractor weight necessary to safely accomplish your applications. Tractor dealers, experienced tractor owners and TractorByNet.com are sources for weight recommendations.

Bare tractor weight is a fundamental tractor specification easily found in sales brochures and web sites, readily comparable across tractor brands and tractor models, new and used. Shop your weight range within tractor brands. Budget will eliminate some choices. Collect a dealer brochure for each tractor model in your weight range.

I spreadsheet tractor and implement specs, often a revealing exercise which cuts through specification clutter. I have a column for cost per pound.

Selling a used tractor is easy. Selling multiple light implements in order to buy heavier, wider implements for a new, heavier tractor requires a lot of time. Depreciation on implements is worse than depreciation on a tractor.

A quality dealer, reasonably close, available for coaching, is important for tractor neophytes. Most new tractors are delivered with a glitch or two requiring correction. My kubota dealer is six miles away. I feel my local dealer continues to add value to my equipment after seven years. Dealer proximity is less important for those experienced with tractors and qualified to perform their own maintenance.

BUY ENOUGH TRACTOR.​

Thank you, you've made some great points! Is there a weight minimum that you would recommend staying above? We'll be going to talk with all the dealers within an hour of us and seeing what they recommend.

 

[wyogal57]

We need a tractor capable of moving large hay bales (rounds 1,200-1,700lbs)

Could be. In my area of Florida, which is hay country, round bales seldom go over 1,200 pounds.

An open station tractor weighing 3,700 to 4,000 pounds can lift and move 1,200 pound round bales using a bale spear on the Front End Loader and stack them at least two bales high. However, the tractor will feel very tippy to a new operator lifting bales to stack. 3,700 to 4,000 pound tractors are regularly used to groom arenas.

An open station tractor weighing 3,700 to 4,000 pounds can transport 1,200 pound round bales with a Three Point Hitch mounted (rear) bale spear but can only lift bales a few inches. Transport but no stacking. The tractor is stable because the bale weight is low and bale weight is carried on the large, rear tractor tires, which do not pivot/steer.

For safety most recommend a 5,000 pound bare weight tractor for moving and lifting bales heavier than 1,200 pounds using a bale spear on the Front End Loader and for 1,200 pound bales for inexperienced tractor operators using a bale spear on the Front End Loader.

BUY ENOUGH TRACTOR.​

Ah, I just saw your additional comments. Really helpful information!

 

[jeff9366]

Thank you, you've made some great points! Is there a weight minimum that you recommend?

MX = 3,700 pounds bare tractor. 'M' begins at 5,000 pounds bare tractor.

Two 3,700 - 4,000 pound bare weight tractors. One economy model, one deluxe model.

 

[wyogal57]

As far as dealers go we have the following brands within an hour of us.

• Kubota
• LS
• TYM
• KIOTI
• Massey Ferguson
• John Deere

I know that a lot depends on the dealer and their willingness to help, but should I stay away from any of these brands? Thanks again for all the help y'all, I'm definitely feeling like I have a better idea of where to start with everything.

 

[oosik]

You need a knowledgeable, trusted friend. Somebody that understands what your plans are. That can help you get exactly what you need. I would suggest 4500 to 5500 pounds - bare tractor weight. This will be in the 55 to 70 hp range. A cab, fluid loaded rear tires( Rim Guard, RV antifreeze or windshield washer fluid ), 4WD, front end loader, large, heavy duty rear blade.

 

[jeff9366]

As far as dealers go we have the following brands within an hour of us.

• Kubota
• LS
• TYM
• KIOTI
• Massey Ferguson
• John Deere

I know that a lot depends on the dealer and their willingness to help, but should I stay away from any of these brands? Thanks again for all the help y'all, I'm definitely feeling like I have a better idea of where to start with everything.

Start with the nearest dealer and work out.

Transporting a tractor for service is expensive and inconvenient, whether you trailer it or the dealer trailers it.


CREDIT: 'FELIXEDO'

"It has been touched on a couple of times, but not directly as a buying factor.

Every major make has a machine that will do the job(s) you want. Check out your nearby dealers, and go with one you have confidence in.

A great machine with no support nearby is a hassle to repair and maintain.

And a good machine can't make a lousy dealer into a good dealer."

 

[jeff9366]

Tractors are versatile.

You will find far more applications for a tractor after it is on your property than you considered while shopping.

TRACTOR IMPLEMENTS:

https://www.lsuagcenter.com/~/media/system/e/6/6/e/e66ed13be4f5a5216aa214276e14dacb/pub2917tractorimplements1.pdf

 

[azbinder]

When I was selling tractors, I had a couple come in looking for a tractor to use around their horses. After talking with them, I showed them 2 different ones. A Kubota "L" series and "B" series. I let both drive one around and then had them switch and try the other. After they were done, I asked them which one and the wife looked at the "L" and said "that one". I asked why and she said that she could see around that tractor better, and since she would be operating it more that her husband, they chose the "L". That said, make sure that you both have some seat time before making any decision.

 

[rScotty]

You need a knowledgeable, trusted friend. Somebody that understands what your plans are. That can help you get exactly what you need. I would suggest 4500 to 5500 pounds - bare tractor weight. This will be in the 55 to 70 hp range. A cab, fluid loaded rear tires( Rim Guard, RV antifreeze or windshield washer fluid ), 4WD, front end loader, large, heavy duty rear blade.

That's about the kind of tractor you should be looking at, except I would pass on the loaded tires until you have tried it for a season without. There are some downsides to loading tires.

As for weight-handling ability the manufacturer's spec on how much it will lift can be way different from how much it is comfortable lifting and carrying. Just as a rule of thumb, look for twice the lift capability if you are wanting to carry and place a load. What you want is one that can lift twice the weight so that it can handle that much weight comfortably.

We used to have horses, and found that most of our work was lifting, carrying, placing loads, and moving dirt and manure around.... often it involved heavy loads on side slopes or slippery ground. So for us, a TLB with more muscle and a lot of weight down low on industrial tread tires rather than lugs was a better fit than a tractor. We chose the Kubota M59 (now M62) because it was heavier and better built for those purposes than an Ag tractor with attachments mounted on both ends - though it is sure hard to beat an Ag tractor for versatility at a reasonable price.

Try out as many as you can before buying, and if you can lease something for awhile that might be money well spent. Even if it was a used one you lease; tractors don't change much.
good luck,
rScotty

 

[Looking4new]

IF you do decide to 'load' the rear tires, specify that you want Rim-Gard. It is basically beet juice and weighs in at 12.3 lbs/gallon. It won't freeze in winter and IF you do have a leak it won't destroy the crops in the ground, the rims or your horses hooves like calcium chloride will. Calcium chloride is very corrosive and will eat steel and will rot hooves.

 

[mred2]

In checking on the size of tractor. Frame size, weight, not HP. Some people stack hay bales that weigh over 1600 lbs. This is one factor, the other is how high. I can only stack two high, but that is ok due to the height of the hay barn. If you can stack higher, make sure that your tractor can go that high. Talk to local dealers and test drive and then test drive again. Look at their service shop. I always recommend loading at least the back tires when transporting heavy loads on the front. The only other thing you can do is to put ballast on the rear of the tractor. You haven't said the size of the property or other tasks that you will be doing, as maintaining gravel drive, mowing pasture ( size of pasture ), breaking ground, etc. The bigger, the faster things can get done. But the bigger, the more fuel and harder to get around. I can't take my 50hp around the house as it packs the ground too much. Manure spreading can be done with an ATV on a small scale. I have almost as much money in my attachments as I do my tractor.

 

[peterlindsay]

I am a horse guy but in canada. 60 hp and 4 wd with a pto will provide the good basics of a tractor that will prob do everything you need safely. Buy something reliable so you can just get the job done with out all the fixing of a 40 year old machine. Although you maybe handy but not handsome .