Welding

[orezok]

When I had my steel building put up, I hired 2 guys that worked for a steel fabricator to do it. They had to do some welding on the beams because the factory forgot to add some stiffeners.

They brought out this little 80 amp 110 welder to weld on these 5/16 plates. I looked at it and thought "well this ought to be interesting". When they finished welding I looked at the welds, and you couldn't tell them from the factory robotic welds. They were perfect and well penetrated.

That's when I realized that it's the guy behind the gun, not the equipment that makes the difference.

Course if that's all you do 8 hours a day...

 

[Iplayfarmer]

When I had my steel building put up, I hired 2 guys that worked for a steel fabricator to do it. They had to do some welding on the beams because the factory forgot to add some stiffeners.

They brought out this little 80 amp 110 welder to weld on these 5/16 plates. I looked at it and thought "well this ought to be interesting". When they finished welding I looked at the welds, and you couldn't tell them from the factory robotic welds. They were perfect and well penetrated.

That's when I realized that it's the guy behind the gun, not the equipment that makes the difference.

Course if that's all you do 8 hours a day...

I think I've mentioned this before, but I work in a food plant; and our welds have to be food grade. They have to be smooth and even with the surface to make them easy to keep clean. Most of our equipment is stainless steel too. The guys that weld in our plant make it look like any child could do it. They use a little 110v Tig welder due to power availability, but their welds are strong and perfect. It's the guy behind the gun.

 

[sizzami]

I seem to be less than clear Stick welding is great for You alot of people who cant learn other processes love stick

 

[sizzami]

oh yeah I forgot to say that any body who has ever built anything with metal knows welding is about 20 percent of it

 

[Iplayfarmer]

oh yeah I forgot to say that any body who has ever built anything with metal knows welding is about 20 percent of it

That is true.

I've learned the hard way that no amount of welding skill will make up for poor fit.

 

[bobodu]

That is true.

I've learned the hard way that no amount of welding skill will make up for poor fit.

That's why God made 5/32 rod.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

That's why God made 5/32 rod.

I actually got me some 1/16" rod. I haven't done much with it yet, but I'm planning on being able to lay down a lot of material without burning through anything.

I'm actually going to try and weld a tin can just to say I did it.

I'm still going to need a good fit, though.

 

[bobodu]

I keep a couple of pounds of 1/16" 6013 on hand because I like it for body panels and such.

 

[Baby Grand]

I actually got me some 1/16" rod. I haven't done much with it yet, but I'm planning on being able to lay down a lot of material without burning through anything.

I've recently discovered the 1/16" 6013 rod, too. Got some at HF - love the stuff. Used it to repair an old iron rake (you remember those ... wooden handle, no tph?). Made a surprisingly neat repair to the cracked 5/16" diam rods connecting the rake tines to the handle's ferrule in just a jiffy. Ran it at 30 amps.

-Jim

 

[Iplayfarmer]

I've recently discovered the 1/16" 6013 rod, too. Got some at HF - love the stuff. Used it to repair an old iron rake (you remember those ... wooden handle, no tph?). Made a surprisingly neat repair to the cracked 5/16" diam rods connecting the rake tines to the handle's ferrule in just a jiffy. Ran it at 30 amps.

-Jim

You mean HF has the stuff??? I hunted through three different suppliers and finally special ordered some through Fastenal. All this time my favorite disposable tool outlet had it. I should know to look in the easy places first.

 

[Bedlam]

I got some at Lowes
but here is the HF - Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices

 

[SuperDuty335]

If you are just starting out with stick, I recommend getting 1/8" 6013 rods and practice with those. The don't stick as badly as others and make it easy to manipulate the puddle, which in turn helps in learning the fundamentals. When you get fairly nice beads with 6013 go to a 6011 and master that... good luck. I have to make an initial pass with 6011 and dress it up with 6013's.

 

[greenmule]

Why don't you just weld the whole thing with 6013 instead of using 6011 than having to dress up with 6013?

 

[SuperDuty335]

Penetration. If I want to really get a deep root weld on thick steel I use 6011.

 

[greenmule]

Well,thats a good reason,but,if you are just making fillit welds[not full pen welds in a bevel,] you don't have to worry,that 6013 will give you all the strength a fillit weld will give you if you turn it up a little.Having a fillit penatrate in 1/2 inch will make it no stronger than 3/32 inch,very hard to make two pieces one with a fillit weld,[thats what full penatration welds are for].One way you can beef up a fillit a little is put enough in it as well,[up on sides,might need mulitple passes,one either over another or stacked on another,all tied into each other,etc]

Now if you are doing something more than that[welding pipe full pen],than you gotta get you a dc welder,E6010 is all the rod you need for 95 percent of things than.

 

[AKwelder]

A couple people in this thread have put down stick welding. I just hired on to weld maintenance for the Trans-Alaska pipeline, The company has tested every combination of welding for every use for 30 years. and stick is still here. we TIG attachment beads and hot passes, and alloys. We wire the structural, and we have combinations of all of them.

In the end stick has its place, and if you can't stick weld you can go somewhere else. after many decades it is still the standard that all else is measured by. I have sub-arc welded pipe and plates. TIG welded steels and Alloys, just came from a job on the arctic ocean MIG welding a pipeline, and I still have paid the bills under the hood burning stick more than anything else

A point was made and is right on the money, welding is only 20 % of working with metal, the fit up is the key

 

[greenmule]

Very true,the reason many cut down on stick among the amatures here,is cause they can't stick weld,most couldn't make a weld that was decent,out of flat postion even with their migs.

There are places for migs,just as there are places for tig,fluxcore,subarc,and try as the money pinchers do to get rid of stick on jobs,it ain't happened yet and it ain't going to happen in next 50 years anyways.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

Here my take as an amature. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

The thing about a stick weld is that if you can make it look good, then it's probably a good weld (usually). You can make really pretty mig welds that won't hold.

 

[bobodu]

I tend to agree,but the real problem is the assumption that a good looking MIG weld IS a good weld.
I would think we have all seen the stories where some guy has built a trailer or motorcycle with a little 110v MIG and has had a catastrophic weld failure. Yes, I know full well that it is possible,but it is also more than likely that a person capable of properly doing this would have a better machine.
Somewhere in my shop is a textbook that shows x-rays of welds and it was enough to make a stick man outta me for heavy use applications.

 

[jenkinsph]

I use both stick and mig depending on the job at hand. Proficientcy comes with practice, lots of practice.



Steve