Trailer brakes

Eric_Phillips · Aug 25, 2017

I finally got my new brake controller installed, Tekonsha P3, and headed out to adjust the output. I am pulling a small pop up trailer probably not much more than 2500lbs. First I set the output to about 6 traveling about 20mph and applied the brake manually. I didn't feel any real pull on the van and the wheels did not lock up. I increased the controller output to max and still very little braking. I jacked up the trailer and had my son apply the brakes. It took some effort but I could turn the wheels with the brakes fully applied. I assumed they just needed adjusting. I adjusted them until the wheel would turn about one revolution after a moderate spin. At this setting I could not turn the wheel by hand with the brakes applied. I took it back out for a test and still could not lock up the brakes even at max setting. I tried this on pavement and gravel. This trailer is about 20 years old and this is the first time the brakes have been used. Any idea why the brakes are so weak? I have not yet pulled the hubs since it needed to be used this weekend and I didn't want any other problems.

bigdeano · Aug 25, 2017

You might start by measuring the voltage near the brakes when fully applied. Seems like it should be near 12v if the controller is working properly.

Diamondpilot · Aug 25, 2017

Adjust the brakes with a little drag in them and try again. They will wear in.

If not pull them apart and check the electrical connections, especially the grounds.

If thats not it get new magnets. Even though never used they may be worn. They are a replacement item.

dodge man · Aug 25, 2017

If its a light weight trailer maybe the brakes aren't meant to do a lot? You'd think they would at least lock up on gravel though.

George2615 · Aug 25, 2017

Since the trailer is about 20 years old the shoes themselves may be worn or any number of things that Diamond Pilot mentioned. You may be able to buy complete replacement brakes for the trailer from Etrailer for a very reasonable price. They would include new backing plates, shoes, magnets etc. all assembled and ready to bolt on.

frugalangler · Aug 25, 2017

Great choice on the controller, one of if not the best available.

This sounds like poor ground, you MUST have a separate (usually white) ground wire in the plug, don't rely on the hitch, they are famous at becoming a resistor or insulator. I always run a separate ground wire from the plug to each brake magnet and never rely on a frame to be a good conductor - it's a safety thing - don't compromise! Same with the brake wire, make sure it's good all the way from the plug to each magnet coil.

Eric_Phillips · Aug 28, 2017

Thanks for the responses. My wife was the lucky one to pull the trailer this weekend since I had to work. She said she did notice a big improvement over no brakes so they are doing something. Now that the camping is over for the season I will do more investigation into the brakes.

Deere Dude · Aug 28, 2017

George2615 said:
Since the trailer is about 20 years old the shoes themselves may be worn or any number of things that Diamond Pilot mentioned. You may be able to buy complete replacement brakes for the trailer from Etrailer for a very reasonable price. They would include new backing plates, shoes, magnets etc. all assembled and ready to bolt on.

What he said^^^. I had lousy braking even with a new 16,000# GVWR GN trailer and a 15yo 17000# Fifth wheel camper. I thought it sucked but that was just how they are supposed to be.

I replaced my POS Tekonsha with a P3 Tekonsha and it helped a little, but still not good. Although leary to take brakes apart because lack of expertise I figured I would take my GN apart that had 10,000 miles on it. The shoes were pretty worn/shot out so I put the whole backing and brake assy. on which was a very easy job. Had the drums reground to like new. The trailer pulled like new and brakes would lock up if I desired.

Then I tackled the 15 yo very heavy camper with original brakes that never seemed to work from new. I found one set of shoes totally ground down to metal (I think because I adjusted them too tight and could not back them off) and that wore off very quickly. The other 3 looked good yet with 15000 miles on. But I pulled all off and replaced all of them with the whole kit, shoes, magnets, and reground the hubs.

Since that time 4 years ago both work like a dream, can lock them up anytime I desire, which is not often, and they are smooth operating. After 25 years of pulling my fifth wheels and trailers I now understand how they should be and how dangerous it was before the fix.

My lesson learned; The brakes were good from new but the controllers were bad. By the time I got my P3 the brakes were bad. Replace them all was the best and was not very costly.

Good luck.

RobertN · Aug 30, 2017

If the trailer is 20 years old, and the brakes have not been adjusted, it is safe to assume the bearing have not been taken care of either. Dexter recommends clean/repack bearing and check brakes yearly.

This would be a good time to put the trailer on jackstands, and pull the hubs. Clean and repack the bearings. Then, go thru the brakes while the drums are off, repair as necessary, and adjust as needed.

When I got my used 5th wheel a few years back, the brakes worked ok, but not great. Turned out they were only working on one axle; at some point someone improperly rewired the brakes on the back axle. While I had it on jackstands, I got new seals, repacked bearings, fixed wiring issue, and serviced the brakes. Since then, I repack the bearings per the Dexter recomendations(12,000 miles or 12 months, whichever comes first).

RobertN · Aug 30, 2017

From Dexter:
http://www.dexteraxle.com/docs/defa...1f9b809d2ba463c18d7aff64007a4014.pdf?sfvrsn=0

Inspect/Adjust brakes every 3000 miles
Repack bearings 12 months or 12000 miles; whichever comes first.

newbury · Aug 30, 2017

RobertN said:
From Dexter:
http://www.dexteraxle.com/docs/defa...1f9b809d2ba463c18d7aff64007a4014.pdf?sfvrsn=0

Inspect/Adjust brakes every 3000 miles
Repack bearings 12 months or 12000 miles; whichever comes first.

Does just lubing E-Z lube axles until new grease flows out count as repacking the bearings?

Eric_Phillips · Aug 31, 2017

My FIL was the one that used to maintain the trailer. He was was meticulous about packing bearings. The one thing I never understood was that he never had a brake controller for this or any of his boats. Since he never had a brake controller I am sure he never worried about adjusting brakes.

Now when my wife left the campsite last weekend she noticed the brake controller just had the logo displayed and no trailer braking. Not sure what is up with that.

gary49 · Aug 31, 2017

Boat trailers that have brakes generally don't require brake controllers, since they use surge brakes. Trailer with this kind of brakes will have brake master cylinder on tongue, using the weight of the trailer to apply hydraulic pressure to non electric brakes. Simple system but electric brakes are much nicer, but you don't want electric brakes underwater. Electric over hydraulic systems are available, but they're pricey.

fried1765 · Aug 31, 2017

RobertN said:
From Dexter:
http://www.dexteraxle.com/docs/defa...1f9b809d2ba463c18d7aff64007a4014.pdf?sfvrsn=0

Inspect/Adjust brakes every 3000 miles
Repack bearings 12 months or 12000 miles; whichever comes first.

You are absolutely correct!!
NOW: How many people REALLY do that ?????

1stDeuce · Aug 31, 2017

Having lived in Michigan for the majority of my life, I will add one more thing to the conversation. In my experience, trailer brakes that sit unused most of the time tend to rust up and not work. There are several parts in there that must move to actuate the brakes, and if they can't move, the brakes won't work.

On the flip side, if they do move, and there is rust, they can hang up and result in the brakes dragging.

I suggest pulling the hubs, and checking all the brake components. Clean up the pivots, and lightly grease them for best resistance to rusting up. Once everything moves freely, the brakes should work pretty well. FWIW, with the tiny brakes used on most small campers, you probably won't be able to lock them, even with the controller cranked.

I have a Prodigy P2, and would recommend the Prodigy series to anyone considering a controller. MUCH better performance than the time ramp units, which are just about useless in a panic stop when you need trailer brakes the most. Much smoother than the pendulum type controllers too. P3 will even tell you if there are problems with your brake circuit, or magnets. Can't beat that!!

RobertN · Aug 31, 2017

newbury said:
Does just lubing E-Z lube axles until new grease flows out count as repacking the bearings?

Interesting, it does not indicate. EZ-Lube Axle is at page 58.

http://www.dexteraxle.com/docs/defa...0b9b809d2ba463c18d7aff64007a4014.pdf?sfvrsn=0

RobertN · Aug 31, 2017

I do...

fried1765 said:
You are absolutely correct!!
NOW: How many people REALLY do that ?????

check · Aug 31, 2017

fried1765 said:
You are absolutely correct!! NOW: How many people REALLY do that ?????

Not many, I'll bet.

oldballs · Sep 1, 2017

I'll bet that the majority of trailer owners here on TBN use their trailers less than six time per year....or something like that. Thus most of 'em are sitting outdoors in the weather......At least that's what mine does. The tires are covered, the break'away battery gets charged now and then and the deck is coated with linseed oil yearly. But each time I do use it the brakes and controller seem funky. But for short hauls around town it isn't a problem. Grease the bearings yearly..........I don't think so. ....just sayin'
Cheers,
Mike

bspeedy · Sep 1, 2017

I bought a 20' Diamond C trailer last month. When I asked the dealer about lubing the EZ lube axles he said 'DON'T!!' He claims that lubing these axles forces grease past the seals and onto the brakes. He recommended a yearly teardown and re-pack of the bearings.

That's not happening. I have been lubing these types of axles with the grease gun for years with no ill effects. And in that time, I've probably towed five to ten thousand miles per year. In the future, I plan to jack up the wheel being lubed and spin it as I pump the grease. This should help the grease get through the bearings instead of through the seals.

Anyone every tear down their properly lubed axles and find grease all over the brakes?