Squabble net.com

[roger_scotty]

In case anyone missed it, we have been entertained by some premium quality "dealer to dealer" squabbles recently. Here is a repost of what I just posted to another thread. I've heard (plenty!) from the dealers and although I may joke about it, the truth is that I am concerned. I do value dealer input tremendously because of all the work and time and knowledge that they put into the group. But I'm curious.... How do the the rest of you feel about the dealer spats? Feel free to reply privately if that is more comfortable.

REPOST:

Boy oh Boy! Am I glad to get back on the forum! As the moderator, I guess I might as well set out some policy here.

I represent the interests of the club members - not of any dealer. And as much as I personally dislike these dealer squabbles, it sure gives potential buyers a good look at the personalities involved. Club members are perfectly capable of drawing their own conclusions about how that translates into business ethics. So as long as it is entertaining and educational I won't try to stop it....yet. What I will do is to ask that you guys keep it civil. When you square off, try to do so on technical merit and without the personal attacks. I don't care if you feel justified or not.....just drop the personal insults.

You boys got into this scrap; you can figure how to get out of it. My aim is to keep it clean.

 

[buppy69]

Personally I don't like the squabbles. I'd like everyone to get along. You can express your opinion without cutting other dealers down. I have a close working relationship with the local dealers. If I don't have what the customer is looking for, I send them to one of the other dealers. I don't tell them that their tractors aren't as good as mine or that they cost more. The customer will figure that out for himself.

Eugene

 

[rich1010220]

I try to read this forum every day to obtain knowledge about my Yanmar. All the post that are nothing but bickering is worse than spam e-mails. Maybe Jerry Springer would be interested in this.

 

[tractorlet]

Let's Stop. No more thread posts. Lets see.

 

[Thomas]

Just say what you have to say and use tact,and if there more to say use the private message. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

 

[kayssupply]

If I remember correctly ,on the Yahoo club, the moderator could remove anything he found offensive. It's pretty much up to you. You have my support.

 

[roger_scotty]

Thanks for the support. So far I don't find it offensive until it gets to the name-calling stage. I could be wrong, but I don't see anything wrong with a healthy family argument about tractors, parts, prices, business practices, and how to build a loader. Its all in the family.

I've been responsible for some pretty stupid designs myself...Take a look at this attachment showing my "half-back digger". And I'll defend anyone's right to criticize those designs. They can even call me an idiot for those designs because it is simply the truth. But if I hear that I'm dumb because of being a red-head then that's stepping over the line.....particularly now that the red hair is getting a bit thin on top...... :-0

 

[tractorlet]

Hi Roger:

Thanks for your modesty but don't knock your design. When did you develop the idea? We have a front implement that is a quick attach to our FEL called a min-dipper and it is very similar except we disconnect the bucket before attaching the hoe. It digs 5 1/2 flat. Don't have a picture of it here but will get one tomorrow and post it. I think you'll be surprised at how close you were to where you wanted to be.

Also we have a front hoe (same as back but mounts on the FEL) which avoids all the three point problems. I'll get back tomorrow.

Bob

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Actually Roger, I have a picture, someplace, of a backhoe bucket mounted to a solid beam, hanging from the back of a D-2, and it was built by Caterpillar. It could well be the original Backhoe, so your design ain't all that bad.
As far as squabbles are concerned, they happen. I've heard it said that it is better to keep one's mouth shut than it is to open your mouth and prove beyond doubt that you're the idiot people think you are, and that applys to squabbles quite well. People get into peein contests over what color tractor is best, so you pretty much have to figure they're gonna argue over anything else relating to tractors too.
Best thing is to let them fight it out, they'll get tired of typing soon enough. It's a whole lot easier to bust up a fight between 2 tired combattants than it is between 2 guys about to go at it.
The Constitution gives folks the right to say pretty much anything, but it doesn't require anyone to listen to them, or read what they write. Let it go, and stay out of the middle, or ya can get hit from 2 directions.

 

[roger_scotty]

Oh, there wasn't anything wrong with the design as far as the work that it could do. It cut right through the rocky soil. The problem was that although I reinforced the bottom of the bucket so that it could stand the strain, I neglected to tie the column supports properly to the top of the bucket. I almost got it right....The columns didn't buckle or bend, but they did allow enough deflection to cause the FEL bucket cutting lip to flex into a permanent frown.

 

[Thomas]

Sir...Have you got a photo how you attach the two together..I do indeed like your idea. /w3tcompact/icons/clever.gif

 

[roger_scotty]

I don't have such a photo, but here is what I did:

I bought 8' of 4"x4" x 1/4" angle iron and cut it into 4 two foot lengths. Two of these were bolted to the ears on top of the backhoe bucket through existing holes in the bucket. These angles run fore and aft. This required drilling a couple of half inch holes in one leg of each angle,. Then this assembly was mounted to the bottom of the FEL bucket by drilling holes through the angle iron, right through the bottom of that bucket, and on through the remaining sections of angle which were aligned longitudinally inside of the FEL bucket. The entire assembly was then bolted with four heavier 3/4 inch bolts. This sandwiched the bottom of the FEL bucket between the angle iron. Done! It only took a few hours one afternoon.
The most critical part of the project was finding an affordable backhoe bucket. I got mine for fifty bucks at a machinery auction.

 

[BrettW]

You've come a long way for a guy with two first names!

 

[Calpyro]

Roger,
You asked: "How do the rest of you feel about the dealer spats?"
Well, I have been considering upgrading to one of the newer FX series Yanmars and I am shopping for a dealer to purchase a tractor from. In fact, I have considered purchasing a few tractors to resell to finance this upgrade. I would like to purchase from a dealer that has fair prices, honest, straightforward and is NOT a kook.
I think that some of these discussions have answered some questions that I have had. Several of the people that I have been considering purchasing from have posted in some of these spats, and at least one has made a complete fool of himself. Frankly I am glad that I learned this prior to plunking down cash at the wrong spot.
I am much more likely to purchase from a dealer that have a consistent record of being helpful. Helpfulness is an important thing for a customer to count on. However, I just want to purchase a tractor. I don't want to have some sort of fatal attraction where the dealer reposts my email messages and analyzes every minutia of what I have posted over the last few years or conducts detailed Internet searches to find my real identity.
I just want a new tractor to play with.
I guess what I am saying is that it is helpful when dealers expose what type of person that they are. For this reason, this discussion has been helpful.
Cameron

 

[clifst2310]

Old habits die hard.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Good Luck!!!!

 

[Thomas]

Thanks for the information. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[Earnsfan]

I too have noticed that you can tell alot from peoples posts. I have noticed that some are always giving good information in short easy to understand messages.
Good luck in your search for a tractor.
Mike