Right to Privacy

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   / Right to Privacy #141  
If you get a chance ,read it. He does have some views about capitalism that you might find interesting.
One other thing about your previous post that I wanted to
critique was the point about blacks and the post war exodus to the North. I don't think that most blacks who did migrate north would describe themselves as"middle class". Working class perhaps, but not middle.
Some of my strongest childhood memories was being on some picket lines with my Dad.
At the time, a lot of blacks were employed as strike breakers and the real pejorative term used was "scab" albeit no one will deny the "n" word was used very liberally. When one is faced with losing your job to somebody, I guess its only human to use the most obvious feature of the person you are looking at.
I think that to characterize the "suburbanization" of America is somehow tied to racism is a rather broad stroke of the brush. I think that most people move to get better schools, more land, better housing, and that includes minorities.
BTW Did it ever dry out there?

It did dry out, thank you for asking. Very pleasant today. High of 67* and more on the way through Monday. I slipped on wet leaves while walking the dog today and got mudded on the right side :) I was washing up my heavy winter jacket and coveralls anyways, so more laundry. They sure got it down in RI. We don't have anything like that here.

If the blacks who 'exodusted' north worked in an auto plant or other heavy manufacturing, they would be at least lower-middle class for that time - no? Not in the sense of a middle class in downtown ChiTown certainly.

I can remember working-to-middle class neighborhoods where if a house or two on the block was purchased by a black family, the rest went quickly. It may not have been the only factor but was at least a primary one. Maybe something folks were contemplating and that made the decision for them. Fair enough? In any case, it did not represent any move toward integration and that is racial by definition.

My purpose is not to beat up on 'white' America. I hope what I write is factual and reasoned. If we cannot embrace a common historical truth on social issues, race or otherwise, we will never find agreeable solutions. We will be doomed to argue forever about what the truth is or isn't.

Dave.
 
   / Right to Privacy
  • Thread Starter
#142  
Well everything that I know, I read on the internet, so it MUST be true:)
 
   / Right to Privacy #143  
I don't know how many years Bob. I can only say it isn't just an excuse. When Obama ran for President, I didn't have to go far amongst my family and friends to find those who would never consider voting for an African American, regardless of his politics. Just wasn't going to happen. If you are caucasian, I would guess you know folks who feel the same way without thinking too hard on it. I personally believe that some percentage of the Tea Party demonstrators didn't become Constitutional 'experts' until we had an African American President either. They try to hide behind 'birther' and middle name of Hussein nonsense. I see it as something else.

Using Obama as an example, he was raised by a caucasian mother and grandparents. He did not claw his way out of the projects, in other words, he shares a lot of culture with caucasians.

It is their country too. Shortly before the Revolution, 20% of the population was African American. Mostly slaves or servants for life. The Declaration of Independence and Bill of Rights did nothing to change their slave status. The US Constitution and the State's Constitutions - used between the Declaration Of Independence and the ratification of the US Constitution - for the most part legally protected slavery. Some signers of the US Constitution were slave owners, including the man who wrote it.

When African Americans were able to join the middle class in the northern states, as a result of non-discriminatory employment laws, they were shunned by caucasian society. That is the basis for white flight which began in the 1960's leaving broken communities behind.

Following the civil war through the first half of the 20th century, many blacks in the south were robbed of the farms and property which they legally owned. The judges, lawyers, sheriffs and juries were all white people and saw blacks as less than equal. That might still be the case without LBJ's civil rights push of the mid-sixties. Over and over again the life forced on blacks in this country has been very discriminatory.

From the earliest days of the American Colonies until the mid-1960's, African Americans were either slaves or powerless to participate in the American culture as we think of it. Naturally, during this time period, they developed their own culture - wouldn't you or I? They didn't reject white culture, they told very clearly to keep out of it. It would be unreasonable to expect two cultures with a goodly amount of ill feeling between them to heal in one or two generations.

To this day, the black and white cultures of our country have never truly joined. Or the white and hispanic. Hopefully they get a little closer as time goes on. Did you know that this year, 2010, may be the first year that non-white births exceed white births in the US?

Look at two areas of American life - the military and professional sports. There are many, many examples of African Americans who have excelled in those two areas. They also happen to be the two most color blind institutions we have in our country. That should tell us something Bob.

I do agree that LBJ's Great Society housing projects were dismal failures. I will still take his efforts as a good faith attempt to solve a very old and entrenched problem. I don't know where else in the world we may look to find solutions that work. Racial harmony is difficult to achieve given our history.
Dave.

And I have no doubt the # of people who wouldn't vote for a black president were offset equally bu those who voted for him only BECAUSE he was black. I don't worry about the extremes. There are always nuts on both ends of the spectrum. I don't like his politics. I really haven't seen him do a lot that could be construed as racially biased. I DO see a ridiculously leftward bent that is contrary to how he portrayed himself while campaigning.
 
   / Right to Privacy #144  
And I have no doubt the # of people who wouldn't vote for a black president were offset equally bu those who voted for him only BECAUSE he was black. I don't worry about the extremes. There are always nuts on both ends of the spectrum. I don't like his politics. I really haven't seen him do a lot that could be construed as racially biased. I DO see a ridiculously leftward bent that is contrary to how he portrayed himself while campaigning.

Gerard, I have no intention of discussing Obama as president. I try to stick to history. You just jumped to current day politics which will get this thread closed.
Dave.
 
   / Right to Privacy #145  
I don't know how many years Bob. I can only say it isn't just an excuse. When Obama ran for President, I didn't have to go far amongst my family and friends to find those who would never consider voting for an African American, regardless of his politics. Just wasn't going to happen. If you are caucasian, I would guess you know folks who feel the same way without thinking too hard on it. I personally believe that some percentage of the Tea Party demonstrators didn't become Constitutional 'experts' until we had an African American President either. They try to hide behind 'birther' and middle name of Hussein nonsense. I see it as something else.
Dave.

I'll 2nd your post Dave1949, infact the town where I went to school had a little fame during the campaign. More then one radio station said we know how that little backwards ____ town is going to vote. It was not hard to figure out the reason. Sit in any local dinner or pub and listen. :ashamed: :(

I have many friends there but I have to admit sometimes the stupidity outweighs the small town, good ole folk. :mad:
 
   / Right to Privacy
  • Thread Starter
#146  
NAHNAHNAHNAHNAHNAHNAH
No were Not talking politics, it was some mystical galactic
hiccup that posted some random stuff.
Please o God of Closing, Let us be.
Darn, that,s religion
 
   / Right to Privacy #147  
DAVE1949... it must really be different where you live... I've never been to Maine unless a stop-over in Bangor in 1970 counts.

I live in Oakland CA and the races are thoroughly and completely mixed... my Father attended Oakland Public Schools in the 1930's and there were Black, Mexican and Asians in his class... side by side with the English, German, Italian and Irish... and this was 75 years ago.

Some of the wealthiest individuals here are not white... they have tremendous political power. A Former Mayor, Lionel Wilson graduated from Law School in the 1940's... I went to school with kids of the California Supreme Court Judge and the Federal Building in town is named after a neighbor... they are all black.

Oakland has long had a black and Asian population... originally, many came here to work on the railroads, later in ship building... several of my Dad's friends worked at the Mack Truck and Caterpillar Tractor Factory... the area has a rich history tied to Caterpillar Tractors... San Leandro CA is where Caterpillar started with the world famous Caterpillar Yellow.

Maybe it's different in other parts of the country... just haven't come across it here...
 
   / Right to Privacy #148  
UltraRunner,

In the time period I was describing, I lived near Toledo, OH. I suppose it was different. The Mason-Dixon Line doesn't have a lot of significance in CA. :) In 1957 my family visited my Mom's Aunt in Jackson, Miss. I can remember seeing some 'whites only' signs on that trip. They weren't quite done fighting the Civil War in the Old South in 1957 is my impression. The northern states above the Old South are peppered with Underground Railway historical sites used to allow slaves to escape to Canada. It is different and I thank you for the contrast you provided.

Maine is 98% caucasian. The ethnic roots are French Acadian, some Swedish, Italian and Greek plus the usual E. Coast mix of English and Irish. Another factor is Maine only has about 1.3 million residents.

There are a number of Somalian immigrants in Lewiston, ME. They have a community there.
Dave.
 
   / Right to Privacy #149  
Well everything that I know, I read on the internet, so it MUST be true:)

Hey!
I just started 'A People's History Of the US' which is supposed to be quite a liberal take on American History. The companion book is the conservative leaning 'A Patriot's History Of the US' which I will read next.

See, even in book titles the labeling battles never end.
Dave.
 
   / Right to Privacy
  • Thread Starter
#150  
Well let me change the subject, if I may.
How about we talk about HMMMMMM let me think-------------------------------------------------------------------------I've got it! How about the right to privacy!
Actually, back in the dark ages,the 4th amendment was mentioned(Thanks Dave) If one were to read it literally, there is no "right to privacy"mentioned. Your thoughts?
 
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