OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES

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/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #81  
Here is my wild guess at what is going on.

Kioti has decided to drop the Kioti name and only sell under the bobcat name.

That's my guess, and I have absolutely nothing to go by other than bobcat dealers popping up, bobcat machines sold cheap and Kioti dealers dropping like flies.

I'm thinking Rick could see the writing on the wall. I can't imagine a more successful selling dealer than Rick, just common sense.

I'm wondering if I keep my machine or sell now??

Joel
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #82  
Here is my wild guess at what is going on.

Kioti has decided to drop the Kioti name and only sell under the bobcat name.

That's my guess, and I have absolutely nothing to go by other than bobcat dealers popping up, bobcat machines sold cheap and Kioti dealers dropping like flies.

I'm thinking Rick could see the writing on the wall. I can't imagine a more successful selling dealer than Rick, just common sense.

I'm wondering if I keep my machine or sell now??

Joel

Hmm...That is definitely and interesting possibility that I had not even thought about. Hopefully its not the case though, I have not even picked up my new Kioti from the dealer yet. If they do end up selling under only that name, I am not going to come out of this deal looking to good :confused2:.
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #83  
I think to put this in perspective a little. In my area Deere, CaseIH, Agco and New Holland have been consolidating and closing dealers at a pretty good clip for the last 5 years or so. Within an hour or less in all directions we have lost an Agco dealer (a statewide Caterpillar dealer took over his Agco line, they are also getting into the Kubota business), CaseIH dealership was closed (consolidation of all area Case IH dealers in the area under one owner), a Deere dealer consolidated with a larger dealer, Massey only dealer stop selling Massey just this year and a New Holland dealer swallowed up his fourth dealership. I have seen a Kubota dealership lost and than picked up by a NH dealer.
Deere has been pulling several small dealers franchise this past year.
Farm Equipment - Industry News Deere Drops Schmitt Implement in Iowa

[http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/john-deere-buying-pricing/152432-another-deere-dealership-pulled.html

It is puzzling as Rick was a very well respected Kioti dealer and did a great job of promoting Kioti. :confused: I had correspondence with Rick on some issues when buying my Kioti, but I didn't base my decision soley with Rick, it was base on I liked the tractor and I liked the price. Kioti's were well built when Rick was a dealer and still are. There are other very good Kioti dealers across this country and some are on this forum. I am not sure we will ever know all of the reasons, but I still believe Kioti makes a good tractor and has a long term commitment to the North America market.
The John Deere in my shop came froma Deere dealership that closed some 15 years ago. I don't like my John Deere any less and have no intentions of selling it.
Definitly an ever changing business and world. I am going to enjoy my Kioti and look forward to the next one, maybe a 90hp DK90. :D You just can't have one!;)
 
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/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #84  
Here is my wild guess at what is going on.

Kioti has decided to drop the Kioti name and only sell under the bobcat name.

That's my guess, and I have absolutely nothing to go by other than bobcat dealers popping up, bobcat machines sold cheap and Kioti dealers dropping like flies.

I'm thinking Rick could see the writing on the wall. I can't imagine a more successful selling dealer than Rick, just common sense.

I'm wondering if I keep my machine or sell now??

Joel

The same thought actually crossed my mind since we now have a local Bobcat dealer here that changed ownership and is now selling tractors.
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #85  
Interesting theory.It could be that Kioti is changing their marketing strategy a bit. Bobcat has quite a extensive marketing channel and dealers.

Our local Bobcat dealer chose to pickup Kubota instead of the Bobcat tractors. it is the choice of the dealer is what he told me and they went with a already established name in small tractors. What is interesting they also sell NH. They signs are now at seperate buildings. I think they are going to seperate the Kubota fnad Bobcat rom the NH. It is tough to go there and not leave with wanting to add another tractor to the barn!:D

I know the talk in tractor and implement business is Brand Purity. Dealers being pressured not to carry competing brands. Most of this has been the big full line companies. The shortline mfg will have a tough time of keeping their products at the full line dealerships in the coming years. Some have partnered by mfg and branding it for the large lines.

What ever happens it is probaly the cause and affects of this economy. It is tough to sell small tractors. I have seen the stats from under 40hp as being off 40%. It is tough to grow market share out of a depressed market like CUT. The large HP ag tractors have been quite a bit better and is some cases up. The large lines can weather it better as the CUT market isn't their bread and butter but their gravy.
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #86  
Hmm...Wallace certainly gets unmatched personal recommendations
...........I looked at Kioti web site, only 2 dealers within 100 miles, both over 50 miles from me.
Not in the market, but if I were, would be hard to interest me in Kioti because of dealer availability alone.
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #87  
I agree with others that the Kioti tractor is still a good machine and a good buy. Hey, I own one so I have to feel that way. Seriously, I have used tractors growing up almost every day, and have rented many types since. This little CK30 is a good companion.

That being said, it was great knowing the Rick and his staff were there to help with any question or issue that I had. His response to other's problems helped me and gave me more confidence. I purchased filters from Wallace, and a CK model tractor for each of my grandsons. I think Rick's expertise and knowledge will be there, and I wish them the best with the other brands. Corporations are strange.

I did post on the Kioti facebook page, and it is still there. On their page it is set to just show Kioti messages when it loads. There are two other views---Kioti and fans, or fans only.
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #88  
Hey All,
Joel, take it easy man... This is just a part of business. We are all freindly with Rick and Amy and he has an uncanny knack for coming out on top. We will never know what the reasons are for this seperation, but I can assure you that Kioti is not going to rely on Bobcat. When I went to Korea (with Rick and Amy) we were told that the north American dealers were 70+% of Daedong's business. There is no way that Bobcat can come close to that figure. Kioti is forcasting an 8% rise in market share this year, so I know they are commiting great effort to compete in the compact market. They have several new models and variations of existing models in the pipeline over the coming few years. The UTV was an unforeseen fiasco because of a supplier going out of business, but will be more than competative when it arrives in the next several months.
I compare this situation to when a good freind goes through a divorce that you did not see coming. Shock is your first response, but then they both go on to do their own thing and you stay freinds with both parties.
We have seen a tremendous increase in business over the past 4 weeks and are gearing up with increased inventory to handle the traffic. We are aslo in the process of setting up a free help line(via email) for all the do-it-yourselfers out there that are lucky enough to own a Kioti Tractor. All you will have to do is email your questions to our service dept and we will do whatever we can to help ALL KIOTI OWNERS. We are also expanding our reach in the NH and Vermont area for sales, service and warranty work.
So keep the faith and let the other dealers around you help as well. In this economy there are a lot of casualties, but the survivors will usually bend over backwards to earn your business.
I wish Rick and Amy success as he has helped me a time or two as well.
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #89  
Hey All,
Joel, take it easy man... This is just a part of business. We are all freindly with Rick and Amy and he has an uncanny knack for coming out on top. We will never know what the reasons are for this seperation, but I can assure you that Kioti is not going to rely on Bobcat. When I went to Korea (with Rick and Amy) we were told that the north American dealers were 70+% of Daedong's business. There is no way that Bobcat can come close to that figure. Kioti is forcasting an 8% rise in market share this year, so I know they are commiting great effort to compete in the compact market. They have several new models and variations of existing models in the pipeline over the coming few years. The UTV was an unforeseen fiasco because of a supplier going out of business, but will be more than competative when it arrives in the next several months.
I compare this situation to when a good freind goes through a divorce that you did not see coming. Shock is your first response, but then they both go on to do their own thing and you stay freinds with both parties.
We have seen a tremendous increase in business over the past 4 weeks and are gearing up with increased inventory to handle the traffic. We are aslo in the process of setting up a free help line(via email) for all the do-it-yourselfers out there that are lucky enough to own a Kioti Tractor. All you will have to do is email your questions to our service dept and we will do whatever we can to help ALL KIOTI OWNERS. We are also expanding our reach in the NH and Vermont area for sales, service and warranty work.
So keep the faith and let the other dealers around you help as well. In this economy there are a lot of casualties, but the survivors will usually bend over backwards to earn your business.
I wish Rick and Amy success as he has helped me a time or two as well.

Hi Dave, I am with you all the way, I like my Kioti very much and happily use whenever possible.

I was just stating what I've been seeing. I'm not sure how Kioti plans to hit their targets (unless it includes bobcat sales) with what appears to be a dwindling dealer base. Rick is the second big dealer I've seen go in recent months.

Would be interesting to know the count of new dealers versus old, specifically the Kioti line.

To be clear, what is good for Kioti dealers is good for me!!!

Just seems like loosing an established name like Rick would be a tough pill for Kioti to swallow.

PS, my brother's inlaws have a place at the head of Mascomma, I'm up your way once in a while.

Joel
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #90  
Would be interesting to know the count of new dealers versus old, specifically the Kioti line.
Joel
Without having someone within KIOTI I don't know how to tell how many dealers there were but there appears to currently(02APR10) be 194 USA dealers. So going forward I guess we just pay attention.
 
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/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #91  
The word I heard was Kioti had 290ish dealers before this thing started coming apart. I also heard the number of dealers remaining was a little less than the 294 but not significant enough to mention.

Doing the math that is a 1/3 reduction in dealers...........
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #92  
I hope all works out for the brand (after all I'm the one with big vinyl stickers on my truck that read "KiotiHauler") , I do like my machine and would change little about it.

I'd hate to end up with a machine that I can't get parts for.

Joel
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #93  
The concern for me here is how viable will Kioti be going forward if their best dealers are baling out. It's the same issue that hurts Kioti sales everywhere: potential buyers are wary of the dealer network. If it's true that the number of dealers is shrinking, it's not good for the current owners nor for the brand's viability. I bought Kioti because of specs, apparent quality, price, and the hope that they were to be the next "Kubota-like sucess story". We shall see how that turns out.
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #94  
The concern for me here is how viable will Kioti be going forward if their best dealers are baling out. It's the same issue that hurts Kioti sales everywhere: potential buyers are wary of the dealer network. If it's true that the number of dealers is shrinking, it's not good for the current owners nor for the brand's viability. I bought Kioti because of specs, apparent quality, price, and the hope that they were to be the next "Kubota-like sucess story". We shall see how that turns out.
Well said,my concern also.I have a good dealer who is close who has great sales and service but if they close up shop I WILL sell my Kioti tractor.I wonder if Kioti will look at this website post of wallace tractor and see that it has already had over 9,000 veiws.I am sure it can,t be good for Kioti business.coobie
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #95  
I seriously looked at Kioti, John Deere and Kubota, while shopping for my last two tractors.

I purchased Kubota's strictly because I found the size and options I wanted at the price I wanted- Orange, Red and Green were all on my short list, but I couldn't find 'the' deal I was looking for.

At the risk of getting flamed- had I read this 10 page thread before I went shopping, I would not have looked at Kioti. Way too many questions at this point.

When I hear "just relax" and it's just "normal business" the hair on the back of my neck stands up. Adding to the mystery is that a well respected dealer has left the fold, so something happened?

Just too much mystery for me. I'm not a buy-for-life guy, and re-sell value is a critical element. I used to be a Ford, Chevy or Dodge pickup-truck guy based on best price, but a FiaDodge is no longer a consideration, and an ObaChevy may cause me to think twice.
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #96  
We have been, and still are, in this for the long haul. The KIOTI Brand, product, management team, and support has been very good for us. Nothing has changed this year, or any time in the past, that will apparently change that.

God only knows what the future brings for any of us, but nothing has happened that changes our enthusiasm for the KIOTI Brand and the product. With the new products and programs KIOTI has planned, only the converse could be true.

We are sorry to loose a fellow dealer, BUT... we remain a proud KIOTI Tractor dealer, and have been given no reason to think otherwise.
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #97  
The concern for me here is how viable will Kioti be going forward if their best dealers are baling out.

While I am very saddened to lose my dealer and someone who has done more than any other to make this Kioti forum a place we all turn to for helpful advice, I do think that we need to be careful not to let common business decisions to undermine overall faith in a product. Rick is great at both sales and support but part of that reflected the quality and value of the product he was selling and maintaining. I have little faith in Korporate Kioti but Daedong makes fine engines, strong tractors and has a modern parts distribution system to support us. We all knew we were buying the Hyundai of tractors, no one who did research on CUTs could possibly think Kioti is as well established as Kubota, JD, or NH. I'm guessing we all basically saw the quality of the tractors and considered their value in relation to what the other brands offered before joining the pack.

As corporate policies change there will be changes in dealerships. That is business and it works both ways and for all the tractor companies. While policies are undoubtedly made with Kioti USA's financial interests at the top, one presumes that there is some rationale for whatever strategic plans have lead to situations where excellent dealers decide to drop the line. I doubt seriously that Kioti wanted to get rid of Rick and assume it was fallout from some policy that made overall sense to the company. It sucks when an excellent dealer drops out but it doesn't change the quality or reliability of the tractors they sold us. I'm sure both Rick and Sweet's would agree. Does it complicate life for those of us who relied on Rick, yes, without a doubt this is an unwanted complication but the tractor still starts up and runs like it always has so except for my sadness nothing much has changed.

We all know the small dealer network for Kioti is its Achilles Heel and obviously the current economy is doing nothing to help them resolve that issue. Still, I have learned through TBN of other good dealers and with Bobcat now carrying most of the line it is actually easier than ever to get service and parts on Daedong built tractors. If the number of dealerships has dropped from about 300 to about 200 that was a process that has been going on for several years as Kioti has indentionally adopted policies aimed at weeding out the smallest low volume dealerships as part of a strategy to strengthen the brand overall. If those policies have had the unintended consequence of causing a few excellent dealers to leave that is certainly unfortunate but not evidence that the whole dealership network is collapsing.

I don't pretend to understand the business dynamics between manufacturers and dealers but I'm sure they are complex as both sides have power and vulnerabilities and the balance must therefore be both dynamic and sometimes precarious. Seemingly small changes in corporate policy can have different effects on different dealerships which could change fortunes dramatically in either direction. It may seem a trivial analogy but it seems that loss of a favorite dealer in some ways is like having your favorite and favored sports team lose a game they were expected to win. Doesn't mean you drop the team or sport, it just means that sometimes evil (read Yankees, Kioti) trumps virtue (read Red Sox, good dealers). Life goes on. The sun still rises. The Red Sox will win again.

I'll always see Rick and Amy's business as a paragon of how dealerships should do both sales and support. I am now jealous of the TBN participants with MF or Mahindras as I'm sure Rick will do every bit as good a job supporting them. Rick is a very smart businessman and an equally hard worker. Amy keeps him in line and organized. They are both affable, charming and completely trustworthy. Rick sold me a new tractor over the phone, sight unseen, then hopped in his truck and delivered it to an island as scheduled 300 miles away even though he was nursing a bad back and had to bring an assistant with him to lift anything. He delivered exactly what he said he would, did not exaggerate his sales pitches and really worked with his customer to get them the best tractor with the best deal he could. Support after the sale was just as up front and helpful. It was a pleasure doing business with them and I will surely miss knowing Wallace Tractor is my dealer. But, I still have complete confidence in the machine they sold me and know that I will find someone will fill the gap they have left. And, I am betting that despite his unpleasant dealings with Kioti, Rick probably does not want to unload his personal DK40se (though as a MF and Mahindra dealer now it could be a bit embarrassing for him to keep a bright orange tractor amidst all the red ones:eek:).
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #98  
In the market for a compact tractor loader backhoe for about a year, all my research, and common sense + logic led me to the Kioti brand and this forum. Where I found the most enthusiastic and proud pack of C.U.T owners howling out the praises of there superior brand KIOTI! One name(Rick Wallace), was continually referred to as the source for product information, straight up advice, great deals with quality service and even called a candidate for sainthood! As well as other solid dealers on the KIOTI trail.
Finally decicing the right place in the pack for me was a DK 40SE TLB and taking this forums advice I called Rick just a few days before this thread started. I talked with both Rick and Amy and as you all stated MOST GRACIOUS FOLKS. Rick and I discussed the decision on the DK 40SE TLB, which he agreed was a great choice for my needs. I told him of the dealer quote I had received,(Wallace tractor is 10 hours away) and he assured it was a great price and I should feel real good if it was in writing. IT WAS IN WRITING AND I SIGNED!!! OW OW OWWWW!! My KIOTI DK 40SE TLB W/18" bucket is in!!!
I said all that to say this, Wallace Tractor carrying the Kioti brand was a real plus for Kioti. But KIOti is not RW and RW is not KIOTI. They each stand as fine examples of QUALITY, one a geat individual and his team, the other
a great tractor and the company that builds it.
Even a couple of days before parting with I believe Rick gave me sound advice. And trust if KIOT was a DEAD DOG he would have said so. Thanks RICK, I FEEL GOOD! OW OW OWWW!!!
 
/ OUR SINCERE APOLOGIES #99  
I must admit, I still enjoy my machine every bit as much as I did a couple of weeks ago, just put three hours on it this am.

But honestly, I can't get over the thought that something is up.

Two of the highest profile dealers, at least on this forum, drop the line within months of each other.

Just a couple of months ago Rick was posting from the sales conference, all fired up, and then bang, no longer a dealer.

I'd hate to have to call a Bobcat dealer and try to explain the history of a LK3054XS and the particular filters based on serial number split and aluminum hydraulic pump, and bla bla bla, all the unique quirks of my machine that Rick was intimately aware of.

Joel
 
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