Mower conditioner problems

[Hay Wizard]

Hey guys, I'm not even sure if this is the right place 2 ask my question but I did a search and saw where a few people had ask similar questions so here goes. I've been using a MF 925 mower conditioner for years til this fall and its been problem after problem. Yesterday I was cutting and the bar that screws into the sheave that hold the pitman to male the make the sickle blade work just completely broke off. It broke flat with the sheave and I'm not sure how I can even get a hold of it to screw it out and replace it. I tried welding it back on but it held maybe 5 minutes. Should I just drill a hole and tap it and use the bolt to turn and break it loose. It has right hand threads and they use loc-tight at at the factory on it. I figure I'll have 2 take the whole sheave off to even do that. Anybody else ever had that problem? Any help is appreciated...

 

[Muhammad]

Welcome to TBN.

 

[Briana03]

WELCOME to TBN

I moved your thread to the Ag Tractors & Machinery Forum.

 

[JimRB]

Some people talk about using left handed drill bits so that if the bolt or screw shakes loose it spins out as part of the drilling out. Of course Loctite might not let it spin out while drilling.

 

[5030]

That's old iron. Time to upgrade.

 

[AKfish]

That's old iron. Time to upgrade.

He will... right after he get's it fixed!!

AKfish

 

[Hay Wizard]

I've used the cutter for almost 15yrs with just normal wear and tear repairs and its been one of the best cutters I've ever used. Clean smooth cuts, nice neat rows laid out to rake, and just an all around good machine plus the 9ft cut cuts big fields in no time. I tried heating it up yesterday and drilled a hole in it just a bit smaller than a 1/2 drive ratchet and beat it into the hole and even with a breaker bar on it it would not screw out.....the right hand thread makes it where when its in use that tightens it more and more and now its unbelievable how tight it is. I called around looking for another cutter yesterday and only found regular cheap sickle mowers and that's not what I want.....so I've got 2 rig it up some way 2 get it 2 work at least til I cut 2 more fields...

 

[5030]

Don't have any idea where you are but if you were close, you could borrow one of my machines. I'm done cutting.

 

[cornshucker]

can you take the sheave off and put it in adrrll press and drill out and retap the threads.

 

[AKfish]

Can you drop every other guard or a bunch of 'em and drive the cutter bar out with a punch and hammer?

I'm done cutting, too... Gonna buy an older model Kuhn this weekend - FC250. Disc mower with finger conditioners. I'd like to sell my other Kuhn disc mower.

AKfish

 

[Hay Wizard]

I'm not sure what u mean by use a punch and hammer....the only way 2 make the sickening move is the sheave pully turning with the bar sticking out with a bearing holding the pitman arm 2 it.....I called around all day yesterday and can't find anything decent anywhere. I only found old sickle mowers and one 6ft drum type rotary cutter the guy said it hadn't been used much but the blades and machine looked like it had been thru the ringer and he wanted 3600 for it and its only 6ft. I looked at an older new Holland mower conditioner 70's vintage and it seemed 2 work ok for 800 but I'm kinda skeptical about it. I would rather go with a disk type cutter now cause less moving parts mean less problems. Haven't found a used one near me at all and can't see paying what the new price of one is....I'm thru with all my hay cutting too but I cut for couple other people and a local feed store that sells it. I'm the only guy around who even does square bales and I've cut theirs for years both spring and fall and don't want 2 leave them hanging. I got half of one field cut and not started on the other. 25 acres left to cut. BTW I'm in Shelby NC. Does anyone know where a good used disk type machine is at close by?

 

[AKfish]

Well... the sickle bar has to be replaced from the pittman end of the mower, right? Gotta slide all the way out and slide a new one back in and connect to the pittman/gearbox.

If it's jammed and won't slide - dropping the guides might free it up enough that you could "drive" it out with a hammer and a punch - a half inch/inch at a time?

You'd wreck the sickle bar - beatin' on it - but it'd be out.

Or you could drop a bunch of guards and cut it out with a plasma cutter/torch - a chunk at a time..

I don't have a clear picture of how/where it's busted. Just goin' on the idea of getting the cutter bar out of the machine and putting a new bar in. ('Course that assumes you've got a new cutter bar.... and maybe I'm assuming way too much! )

AKfish

 

[Hay Wizard]

I guess I wasn't clear about the problem...the bar and all is fine....there is several pulleys on the drive side that are turned with a huge 4 V belt and the lower pulley which is called a sheave pully has an offset hole with a 3inch long 1 1/4 round steel bar that's screwed into it and u slide a bearing on it and the pitman arm has a clamp like thing that goes in front and behind the bearing that has bolts around it that holds it 2 the bearing....it has a locking collar that locks the race of the bearing on the shaft....the problem is that the short bar all that goes onto actually broke off flush with the sheave pulley and I have nothing 2 hold onto 2 screw it out....its what makes the blade work and its right hand thread so as it turns it keeps it tight.....they loc-tite it on at the factory and I would say its never been off.....I tried heating it up with no success and even drilled a hole and took an old ratchet and beat it into the hole and with a breaker bar it wouldn't budge....the pully kept slipping in the vice.......I even tried just welding the bar back on where it broke off and it ran like 5 minutes and snapped right off and I had welded 3 beads all the way around it with 7018 rods and bumped the heat up pretty high for good penetration.....the massey Ferguson dealer said the pully had 2 be special order from badger and I almost passed out when they said the price....if I can just get the piece of the broke off shaft out its only gonna be 25bucks for one of them.....I've never seen anything this aggravating and complicated.....

 

[hosspuller]

If the new price scares you...Best bet will be to take the pulley off. Then take it to a machine shop. They can bore the old stub out and rethread the hole. Screw the $25 part into the new hole and your ready to put it back together.

 

[5030]

I'm not sure what u mean by use a punch and hammer....the only way 2 make the sickening move is the sheave pully turning with the bar sticking out with a bearing holding the pitman arm 2 it.....I called around all day yesterday and can't find anything decent anywhere. I only found old sickle mowers and one 6ft drum type rotary cutter the guy said it hadn't been used much but the blades and machine looked like it had been thru the ringer and he wanted 3600 for it and its only 6ft. I looked at an older new Holland mower conditioner 70's vintage and it seemed 2 work ok for 800 but I'm kinda skeptical about it. I would rather go with a disk type cutter now cause less moving parts mean less problems. Haven't found a used one near me at all and can't see paying what the new price of one is....I'm thru with all my hay cutting too but I cut for couple other people and a local feed store that sells it. I'm the only guy around who even does square bales and I've cut theirs for years both spring and fall and don't want 2 leave them hanging. I got half of one field cut and not started on the other. 25 acres left to cut. BTW I'm in Shelby NC. Does anyone know where a good used disk type machine is at close by?

Hope you have a serious power unit. Disc mowers and especially discbines are very power intensive, rule of thumb is 10 pto horsepower for every foot of cutter width. far as moving parts, disc mowers have lots more than reciprocating sickle mowers. Most are enclosed in a gear oil bath but there is still blade tips, pivot bolts, washers, nuts and other parts and hitting any trash in field can cause lots more damage than just a replaceable knive section (in the case of a sickle), then there are the crimp rolls. I'd steer clear of a flail type and stick with rubber rolls. The flail conditioner takes even more power.

I'm up here in Michigan, not even close.

I would consider taking it to a competent job shop and having the broken part bored out to a larger diameter and then installing either a 660CA bronze sleeve or steel sleeve to bring the diameter back to original.

What you have is the old style 'wobble box pitman drive. I rebuiult one for a guy down the road last summer. PITA.

 

[rdbigfarmboy]

Badger made it. I had one had about the same issue. Scrapped mine 3 years back.
I got a drum mower.
Look on craigslist they are some badgers still around. search craigslist mf 925 (725) or badger 1005 or something similiar. I have seen some whole machines advertised on craigslist.

 

[bill in ny]

Hope you have a serious power unit. Disc mowers and especially discbines are very power intensive, rule of thumb is 10 pto horsepower for every foot of cutter width. far as moving parts, disc mowers have lots more than reciprocating sickle mowers. Most are enclosed in a gear oil bath but there is still blade tips, pivot bolts, washers, nuts and other parts and hitting any trash in field can cause lots more damage than just a replaceable knive section (in the case of a sickle), then there are the crimp rolls. I'd steer clear of a flail type and stick with rubber rolls. The flail conditioner takes even more power.

I'm up here in Michigan, not even close.

I would consider taking it to a competent job shop and having the broken part bored out to a larger diameter and then installing either a 660CA bronze sleeve or steel sleeve to bring the diameter back to original.

What you have is the old style 'wobble box pitman drive. I rebuiult one for a guy down the road last summer. PITA.

my 9' new holland discbine with flail conditioner only requires 65 pto hp.

 

[5030]

my 9' new holland discbine with flail conditioner only requires 65 pto hp.

That's in 'average' cutting conditions. Get it in heavy first cut conditions and you'll soon see it requires more.

I've never been fond of flial type conditioners for hay crops here that are abundant clover. The flail removes the clover leaves. We run serrated roller conditioners.

10 per foot of cutter head width is still optimum in all conditions, hilly ground and heavy crop production.

Not saying you can't, just saying that it's better to have extra over marginal.

 

[bill in ny]

That's in 'average' cutting conditions. Get it in heavy first cut conditions and you'll soon see it requires more.

I've never been fond of flial type conditioners for hay crops here that are abundant clover. The flail removes the clover leaves. We run serrated roller conditioners.

10 per foot of cutter head width is still optimum in all conditions, hilly ground and heavy crop production.

Not saying you can't, just saying that it's better to have extra over marginal.

we have timothy hay, so the flails work real well. i only have 75 pto hp on my mowing tractor, and it's more than enough. even in heavy conditions.

 

[welderman1]

Hey guys, I'm not even sure if this is the right place 2 ask my question but I did a search and saw where a few people had ask similar questions so here goes. I've been using a MF 925 mower conditioner for years til this fall and its been problem after problem. Yesterday I was cutting and the bar that screws into the sheave that hold the pitman to male the make the sickle blade work just completely broke off. It broke flat with the sheave and I'm not sure how I can even get a hold of it to screw it out and replace it. I tried welding it back on but it held maybe 5 minutes. Should I just drill a hole and tap it and use the bolt to turn and break it loose. It has right hand threads and they use loc-tight at at the factory on it. I figure I'll have 2 take the whole sheave off to even do that. Anybody else ever had that problem? Any help is appreciated...

did you get the mower going? if not and you still have the mower would you be up to selling that pulley with the broken off pin?