Flail Mower Let's talk flail mowers

   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,551  
I just looked at your photos again Dan. Do you not have skids on that mower? My skids are set at the same height as the roller and that keeps a lot of pressure off the roller.
My mower is a different brand but construction looks similar to yours except I have skids.
Does anyone else not have skid rails?

The black skids are visible here on the end of the mower.

FLAIL MOWER HPHD15
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,552  
Did a bunch of messing around today.. Went out with the scraper removed, as expected that was not good.... :laughing:View attachment 481025

After cleaning that off I checked pto rpm, by running the tractor at half pto speed I was able to count revolutions and 50 revs took 15 seconds. x4 to get to a minute and double because of the half engine speed gives 400 shaft rpm at the noted 540 pto speed on the tach so for whatever reason it's off a fair amount. I suspect the tach might not be original as it has mph in gears that doesn't account for the dual range transmission option that mine has. I've mostly been mowing above that rpm anyway as the motor is happier there, but went out and tried it at around 1900 rpm instead of 1500 (rated pto engine speed), may have cut a tiny bit better but no real change. As I waited for a return call from Betst I started to reinstall the scraper and noted that I could get it right up against the roller this time. I think it originally had come loose (or was never tightened properly) and because there is some odd slop in the bolts holes it would jam and not move over by the roller, leading me to think you couldn't get it close. You have to mess around with it a bit to get it over by the roller. Bolted it down right against the roller, tried again and huge improvement initially, then the scraper came loose and moved away from the roller and it loaded up again.. After tightening to the point of almost stripping the two bolts I went back out one more time and it was working decent, but eventually the tractor just bogged down again. There wasn't much on the roller this time though the ends where the shaft tapers still loaded up, so may possibly still have issues with the tractor itself. There was quite a bit of grass wrapped around the main shaft when I got back, but I had tried to go forward again several times with the tractor bogging so I don't know if that was loaded up the first time it came to a stop or after. So much grass wraps up on the tapered ends of the shaft that it compacts tightly around the bearings and they start to run hot even after a short time. I think a big part of the issue now may be that the knives just aren't cutting well, there shouldn't be any long grass left to wrap around like that.

leonz,
Some pieces of tape and rotating the pto by hand shows the gearbox to be about 2.8:1, and the pulleys about 1.4:1, so at 540 pto would give around 2120 main shaft rpm.

When you talk about 37 degrees is that some proven angle to work well on a flail slicer? Mine had more of an edge originally as dirt gopher mounds have rounded them a bit, but if moving fast enough should be cutting ok anyway.. If you are just referring to the half of the blade near the mounting hole no there aren't any edges, but when I look up other flail knives that seems to be quite common. I think part of the issue here is that there aren't as many blade stations as some flails, and you can tell a lot of grass is hitting the knife mounts because of the grass caught in them.

Alien,
Yes it has skids but they aren't designed to drag around on the skids, they are meant to take the weight on the rear roller. Skids are for rough terrain and parking... ;)
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,553  
I wish you were closer, there was a 917H about a month ago just north of me for sale. (20 minutes or so north). I'd pick it up for ya if you were closer.


Thanks for offering. I'll keep watching and thanks for the information. I'll go look at any of them within resonable distance but the pickings are slim. The State and a few counties use them but you hardly ever see them used by individuals.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,554  
Thanks for offering. I'll keep watching and thanks for the information. I'll go look at any of them within resonable distance but the pickings are slim. The State and a few counties use them but you hardly ever see them used by individuals.

Absolutely


I agree, a lot of people don't use them. It seems to be a hidden secret for some reason amongst common folk jk
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,555  
This is the only style knife I've been able to find. Redirect Notice

I have cut brush up to about 1.5" with mine successfully. Makes a bit of noise while doing so though. :D It does do very nice finish work on my lawn comparable to my Hustler Z. Vic


To use as a rough cut mower that's what I need is weight. My 6' mott is a little over 500 lbs and while I get excellent finish cut when I try thicker brush it cuts it but I can't even hear my tunes. So I need a heavier mower or louder earbuds. I use headphones when on the skidsteer, that thing is loud just sitting in it. Thanks for the information it helps and I'll just keep waiting for something to come up on CL or farmers bullentin.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,556  
I hate to say it but you do need new knives.
They did a piss poor job of sharpening them using simple steel as a knife blank
and if they tell you different I will gladly have a conversation with them.

There is no excuse for those knives BECAUSE of the blunt edge that SHOULD NOT be there to begin with.

That is why your mower is not mowing well and tearing the brush rather than cutting it.

Your mule has issues as you said with a different Tachometer/speedometer than what is ment for your mule.



====================================================================


The 37 degree cutting angle figure comes from the Mathews Company Lawn Genies that my father and I have owned and own now.

The no tool knife hangers they manufactured allow the tapered side slicers to become an airfoil(airplane wing) as they spin up to speed and the slotted knife goes from hanging at vertical to horizontal to create a world class finish on turf and brush.

The flail mower rotors on most machines do not allow this to happen because they are bolted to stay vertical in a knife station or the bent bar stock knife hangers do not allow them to move and create an airfoil.


I am so sorry you are going through this as new resident member of the "Flail Mower Nations".
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,557  
Did a bunch of messing around today.. Went out with the scraper removed, as expected that was not good.... :laughing:View attachment 481025

After cleaning that off I checked pto rpm, by running the tractor at half pto speed I was able to count revolutions and 50 revs took 15 seconds. x4 to get to a minute and double because of the half engine speed gives 400 shaft rpm at the noted 540 pto speed on the tach so for whatever reason it's off a fair amount. I suspect the tach might not be original as it has mph in gears that doesn't account for the dual range transmission option that mine has. I've mostly been mowing above that rpm anyway as the motor is happier there, but went out and tried it at around 1900 rpm instead of 1500 (rated pto engine speed), may have cut a tiny bit better but no real change.


Dan on your sherman transmission do you know how much it reduces your pto speed. On the howard transmission pto speed does not change with gearing (only engine speed). I'm not sure how much it slows but you might can find out. I'm just thinking it might not change much but it is slower. The ratio as you calculated is going to stay the same of course but the pto speed as you mentioned about the dual range transmission will slow things down. I'm just thinking out loud as I know you've already thought of this. Wish I could offer more help. :confused3: No need to reply, just throwing thoughts at you.
 
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   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,558  
I hate to say it but you do need new knives.
They did a piss poor job of sharpening them using simple steel as a knife blank
and if they tell you different I will gladly have a conversation with them.

There is no excuse for those knives BECAUSE of the blunt edge that SHOULD NOT be there to begin with.

That is why your mower is not mowing well and tearing the brush rather than cutting it.

Your mule has issues as you said with a different Tachometer/speedometer than what is ment for your mule.



====================================================================


The 37 degree cutting angle figure comes from the Mathews Company Lawn Genies that my father and I have owned and own now.

The no tool knife hangers they manufactured allow the tapered side slicers to become an airfoil(airplane wing) as they spin up to speed and the slotted knife goes from hanging at vertical to horizontal to create a world class finish on turf and brush.

The flail mower rotors on most machines do not allow this to happen because they are bolted to stay vertical in a knife station or the bent bar stock knife hangers do not allow them to move and create an airfoil.


I am so sorry you are going through this as new resident member of the "Flail Mower Nations".

I don't know Leonz, my Caroni knives have never been sharpened and they cut tall grass just fine. I suspect sharp knives are important for finish cut but for field mowing anything sharper than a baseball bat should knock down and mulch tall grasses.

I still think there is something fishy about the RPMs. I don't know anything at all about old Ford tractors but 1500rpms just sounds low. Sounds reasonable for a marine diesel and I know old Ford diesels were used in marine applications but I believe in this case we are talking about a gasser and 1500-1800rpm for a gas engine just seems very low.
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,559  
Dan - Thanks you for all the information. I have been watching this as I was considering the brand - not now. One question - Has Betst gotten back with you yet on the issue? Can you return it? I also agree the knives look beat up in your last photo, but it is puzzling that both sides look kicked and warn.. Have you considered sharpening them and see how she does? Just curious.

Wishing you the best on a good solution
 
   / Let's talk flail mowers #3,560  
When I bought all new knives for my flail they were not what I would call sharpened at all. I tried cutting with them but ended up taking them all off and sharpening them some. Tried them again and could not tell much difference between dull and sharp .
 
 

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