Is this a scam? Kubota Dealer Pulling SCAM???

[kbarrett]

You might want to postpone your delivery with the explanation that your checking out your options. If you have the energy and interest in resolving this with this particular dealer then call Tom Martino at:

<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.troubleshooter.com/>http://www.troubleshooter.com/</A>

The troubleshooter is a syndicated consumer advocate show that will go to bat for you in situations that you're finding yourself in right now.

It's a very interesting show with an incredible track record
in resolving these types of problems.

Again, as others have mentioned. It might be easiest to go elsewhere. However, putting them on the radio may teach this dealer an important lesson that dishonest business practices will be costly in the long run.

 

[glennmac]

They should have told you up front they were going to give you a demo mower. I think you should walk unless they now discount it and you are otherwise satisfied with the dealership.I want to add a different perspective. MMM's on Grand L Kubotas are not particularly popular because, for one reason, they are hard to remove and install. I suspect he may be trying to sell you the one and only such mower he has. He may not want to order you a new one because then he is stuck with the hard to move demo mower.Have you really thought through whether you want a mmm versus a 3ph mower? Was a mmm your idea or the dealer's? A rear mower is much less expensive and easier to remove and install especially with Freedom Hitches. As to whether they or more or less convenient to operate, that depends on how much mowing you are going to do in absolute and relative terms and upon your preferences and experience.

 

[Kelvin]

tractortime,

Different posts suggest that you take delivery of the "used" mower until a "new" mower can be ordered and delievered. This certainly seems like a logical "good deal for you" option. However, it seems that right now the ball is in your court; once you take delivery of the product the ball is back in the dealer's court unless you have substantial written records of the post-delivery promises (from this dealer that you don't trust).

I personally wouldn't take delivery of the used-looking mower unless I paid xxx dollars less with the agreement that I'd pay the xxx dollars back to the dealer once the new mower was properly delivered and installed. The "xxx" dollar figure is the figure that you need to be happy with if the used mower becomes your permanent mower.

Kelvin

 

[BeeBop]

I'd walk in a miniute and go directly to a Kubota distributor and tell them of this dealers egrecious attempts at deception and something may work in your favor in your purchase at another Kubota dealer. Good luck. /w3tcompact/icons/clever.gif

 

[MReeter]

Let me get this right,you gave them a check and paid for it in full...before delivery?

 

[MikeCT]

There is no fraud at this point, you know exactly what the dealer is giving you and he has given you a choice. Now you need to decide if you want to accept one of his offers or go elsewhere. I think I would go elsewhere, doesn't look like the begining of good relationship with you and the dealer.

 

[hogboy]

Don't forget to ask for a "free" Kubota hat.

 

[Will]

Still looking for free advice? Well here goes. Stay calm, but don't give an inch. You've already agreed on the price and the product, and you'll get it eventually. It's a shame you've got to do any extra work to remind the dealer of the original deal, but that's life. Forget about legal stuff, that's just a pain for everyone, and it won't get you a tractor any quicker. Let the dealer know that you are satisfied with the original deal, and you don't want to renegotiate. If that isn't effective, call the Kubota distributor, tell them what your deal was, and ask them for the name of a dealer who will honor it. I'd guess that if you ask them nicely, they'll make a point of getting a new mower and new tractor ready to go quickly.By the way, I can see a dealer's point that an hour of mowing and a few grass stains doesn't hurt a new mower, and I imagine that a rental company or a professional landscaper buying that mower wouldn't mind. But so what? One of the pleasures of spending a mint on a new tractor, is getting an absolutely brand new, mint-condition tractor. Then you can be just like the rest of us, post some pictures, and then mow some rocks, grrrrrrr!

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Seems like much ado about nothing. Negotiate for futher discount or walk.

 

[hayden]

I really disagree with any notion that what the dealer has done or tried to do is in any way OK or tollerable. When you buy a new product, you are buying a new product, not a used one. If you buy a new car, is it OK for the dealer to substitute a used car on deliver? A demo car? A new car with a used engine? A new car with used tires? No, it's completely unacceptable, unethical, and bad business. I too would be hop'n mad that they would even think such a substitution was even remotely OK unless agreed to in advance.

At the same time, if the dealer and customer want to re-negotiate based on a used, or demo, to-be-replaced mower deck, that's fine - go for it. For me it would have to be one hell of a good price to overcome their little maneuver.

 

[JeepOne]

tractortime,

It's very hard for me to believe that the dealer can't distinguish between new and demo! New is NEW (NOT used) and demo is ALMOST NEW (SLIGHTLY used). I sure don't need a bright light to see this one!!! He knows what he's doing and more than likely needs to move that MMM. He did'nt expect you to 'drop-in' and catch his hand in the cookie jar. Take your business somewhere else while he wipes the crumbs from that hand. After all, you're probably not the only one he's doing it to. I sure would'nt want him to service anything of mine......TRUST IS VERY IMPORTANT.

Ken

 

[g42guy]

You've got many responces to mull through so here's mine! I disagree with many that say stand firm and either get the new or a lower price. This IS a bad dealer. You are buying a long term product. If you can get the same deal with a different dealer... I would do it. Even if you got "Mr. Shady Deal" to come down a little, do you want to EVER deal with him again?
I feel for ya, stuff like this is just plan wrong. Go with a dealer you can be happy with. GOOD LUCK.
Guy

 

[mbsil]

If the dealer will lie to you about a little thing he will DEFINITELY lie to you about big things.

This is a clear case of a Deceptive Trade Practice. As someone else mentioned here in the Republic of Texas we have the DTPA (Deceptive Trade Practices Act) which provides for treble (3x) damages. He's guilty, he has to pay for 300% of the mower cost PLUS all attorney and court costs.

If we knew something about you (fill in your [censored] bio!) we could give you much more help. Don't ask people to give you advice and info and expect the BEST replies when you can't even volunteer what state you're in.

DO NOT take delivery of the used mower, even as a "demo"
pending the real mower arrival. Your acceptance of the demo unit is a tacit approval of the sale and the dealer (who we already don't trust) can claim that you signed for the delivery and accepted it as-is.

Tell us who the dealer is so we can all avoid him.

If you're intent on trying to work the deal with this dealer mention Tom Martino and the fact that you're a member of a BBS with THOUSANDS of members and by all means inform the BIG ORANGE MOTHER SHIP that one of her children is slinging caca on her good name.

 

[BillG_in_TX]

Do you think that "tractortime" might be related to "winger"?
Do you remember the <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.tractorbynet.com/cgi-bin/compact/showflat.pl?Cat=&Board=buykubota&Number=133428&page=&view=&sb=&o=&vc=1>Dealer Pains !!!</A> thread posted last month?
Do you think we're being strung along here?
I have a hard time getting worked up about someone who is posting incognito. No bio info on either one.

 

[g42guy]

<font color=blue>Tell us who the dealer is so we can all avoid him</font color=blue>

I agree, PLEASE tell us which dealer it is. Maybe someone else has has dealings with him. Or maybe it is just a bad sales person/manager at that dealership. Maybe I missed it but did you say you talked to the owner?

 

[gordon]

Now in my opinion your blowing smoke. If you don't want to deal with that dealer then take your money elsewhere. Call the area rep about what happened Simple as that. The dealer is not going to take a chance of loosing his Kubota line over something like that. If all your interested in is legal stuff then I have no time for you anyway. You might be mad but stop and think about it. In my eyes dealer mistake yes////scam no.

At delivery time, if the deck was indeed as bad as you say then you would have noticed it and not taken delivery. But I bet after they had done the prep on the deck you would have never known the difference.

You have already been given some very good advise from alot of the posters. With that you should be able to make a rash decision on which way to go. Either get your money and walk or strike another deal with the dealer. End of story.


this is the last post I'll make to this thread
Gordon

 

[hayden]

I'm thinking you're right.

 

[tractortime]

Thank you to everyone that took the time to read my very lengthy upset post. And for responding. I read each and every one several times. I am not quite as upset any more as I was the other day. We have cancelled the deal as others suggested. Being that the trust was definately broken there! I do believe that we should have been informed tht we were either going to be given a demo or a used mower rather than new as stated on the signed contract. Anything other than "New" was under handed. Especially the round about way that it was found out and presented to us. (used at a farm fair last year...only a few minutes on it...still new) I did speak with the manager and I also spoke with the district manager of Kubota at the Eastern region office. Surprisingly my call to him was made after the manager of the selling office had placed a call and covered his rear about what the deal had entailed. Therefore, the the district manger was the least bit surprised and felt that since we were getting our money back the matter was settled. I mentioned how Kubota tractor corporations' promise is suppose to handle each customers' transaction with integrity and value. Needless to say...I'm moving on...PS...I'll Post what state I'm in once the check clears!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[spencer200]

Well as you can see the Kubota company was not much help. This is because they still consider this mower new even though it has been a demo for a few minutes, hours or acres. The manufacturer does not consider this item as used or sold until they have a warranty form in there hand saying it was sold. Now from my stand point as a dealer I would question that dealerships integraty.. Whenever we have a demo piece of equipment we are always up front with our customers and tell them this. We give them the option DEMO at xxx amount of dollars or NEW at xxx amount of dollars customers choice. The same as this dealer should have done for you. Unfortunately you came across what I like to call the bottom 1/3 of dealers those who take advantage of there customers whenever possible without regrads to them or there feelings. There are many more of these dealers out there than you realize I have worked for 2 in my state before I got my own dealership and there are not that many dealers in my state to begin with, even with all the brands combined.

 

[tractortime]

Spencer...I wish you lots of luck with your dealership. I wish I would have come to your place first. Nice to know that there are honest dealers out there. Sure was... and is... a sad thing that had to take place. We were very excited about getting the tractor...much like all the others that can't wait for delivery day. I feel bad for the sales guy that got the deal. He was a young guy. But hopefully they learn that they can't play the consumer like that in the future if they want to make commissions. Honesty is the best policy. Best Wishes