JD or Kubota?

rtimgray · Jan 13, 2005

"what about the lurkers and newbies reading unsubstantiated crap. I guess they need to go by something if they have any horse sense (pun intended) to them. What should it be then, someone who has a history backed up by years of posts, or some no name."

They should not place too much faith in comments made by anyone here, no matter how many posts they have. The number of posts made by any contributor tell you only one thing for certain: how many posts they have made. The unlearned individual should rather use these comments as an accessory as they perform their own investigation, using whatever methods are at their disposal to determine what product is the best for their situation. Comments here should be used to provoke interest and thought, not to merely be told what a person should use. Remember, free advice is worth every penny you pay for it, and if it is the sole reason for someone to choose or disregard any particular item, then they get exactly what they deserve for neglecting their due dilligence.

cowboydoc · Jan 13, 2005

I thought the recall was related to castings failing in the JD TLB the 110 or whatever it is called 

Now that may very well be. I don't know about that. But the 110 is not a CUT and that's what orbith stated was that the front end on the CUT was recalled. Maybe he was talking about that. If he was I apologize.

With regard to the front end on the CUT I don't think they ever recalled it. What they did was come up with a fix to make it "limited" slip instead of full traction and reduce scuffing on the lawns. If you took your tractor in they would put the new parts in it free of charge.

JDGREEN4ME · Jan 13, 2005

( I've never been on a message board, so please bear with me... )
I really don't think halfmoon2 meant to start this exchange in motion with his post. Since he has no further posts I hope we did not scare him away! /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

I am not sure what the HP is for the Kubota but if it is higher than the JD I think I would go for the Kubota. As for prices of parts I guess they are all expensive to some degree, cost being relative to your ability to pay for them. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Please let us know how your search ends up...

AndyClyde · Jan 13, 2005

( With regard to the front end on the CUT I don't think they ever recalled it. What they did was come up with a fix to make it "limited" slip instead of full traction and reduce scuffing on the lawns. If you took your tractor in they would put the new parts in it free of charge. )

Richard you are right it was not a recall,but the old axle design is completely different from the new axle design.The older axle looks much heavier built and bullet proof to me than the newer ones. The old axle had an internal enclosed cylinder that when you turned the steering wheel IE: towards the left the cylinder would extend on the right side and vice versa,where as the new front axle has one hydraulic cylinder that is exposed and is linked to the front wheels by tie rods. I was talking to a JD mechanic and he told me the new axle was more prone to damage IE: hitting stumps and popping a tie rod end off or damaging the cylinder,when looking at the new design I could understand how that could happen especially for my uses,where the old axle is enclosed more so.

obrith · Jan 14, 2005

Ok, a couple notes here -

I never said anything about the front end of any tractor. I said JD recalled ~3300 TRANSMISSIONS, including CUTs and 110TLB's. My dealership got lucky, we only had a couple of the machines. Unfortunately it takes a mechanic ~29 hours to replace the transmission in the 110 (because of all the extra frame reinforcements), so it was quite a costly recall. And you know what, I'm not a mechanic and I'm not 100% sure what they recalled it for (though I could go back and pull out my paperwork that has been long filed away if I cared to), but I do know it very specifically said that every tractor HAD to be completed because they expected FAILURE on the recall.

In fact, if you had just purchased your tractor, or hadnt used it much, you really got the short end of the stick... JD used re-manufactured transmissions in any machine that had time on it. Which means if you had yours replaced when you had only put 5 hour on the tractor, you may have a transmission that is 100's of hours older than the rest of your tractor. On the other hand, if you were one of the ones with 100's of hours, you might have had a near-new transmission re-installed.

I'm really not sure what you'd like me to tell you to 'prove' my knowledge, and frankly, I dont feel the need to. I will, however, continue to give my opinion to those who ask questions in these forums.

I am quite happy for you that JD treats you well. They treat some of my customers quite well too. I wouldn't doubt if one of them complained loud enough that they would send out someone to talk to them. I was just saying, from a dealer prospective, they rarely listen.

And thank you rtimgray. I'm glad that everyone isnt as stubborn as a few of the guys seem to be...

BillyP · Jan 14, 2005

John Deere Recalls 1,700 Compact Utility Tractors

Jan 6, 2004 12:00 PM

E-mail this article

John Deere voluntarily recalled about 1,700 of its 4000 Ten Series compact utility tractors, according to SafetyAlerts. Consumers should stop using the product immediately unless otherwise instructed.

SafetyAlerts reports the problem is with the tractor’s transmission. “An internal failure may occur within the Hydrostatic Transmission preventing the transmission from returning to neutral after the pedals are released. This can allow unexpected movement or cause the tractor to continue moving, creating a possible risk of injury to the operator or a bystander.”

For more information, contact John Deere’s Customer Communications Center on (800) 537-8233, Monday through Friday, 8:00 am until 6:00 pm (Eastern Time), Saturday, 9:00 am until 3:00 pm, or at the John Deere web site at www.johndeere.com.


Both Kubota and New Holland have/had a problem with some of their tractors not stopping when you let off the HST pedal. Neither one, to my knowledge have had a recall or a fix to this problem.

rockyridgefarm · Jan 14, 2005

Both Kubota and New Holland have/had a problem with some of their tractors not stopping when you let off the HST pedal. Neither one, to my knowledge have had a recall or a fix to this problem 

This may be because they are far superior.

It might also be that as foreign corporations, they are not nearly as likely to be attacked with lawsuits.

Often there is a very fine line determining when a slight chance of a safety issue warranting a recall. Unfortunately, the decision is usally made my news media and juries. Sometimes that is best, because the manufacturers may let profits overide the needs of their consumers. But, usually manufacturers go way out of their way to keep things right. Of course, that is also because if they don't the juries will.

Part of the perception that Toyota and Honda make far superior vehicles might just be they are too hard to sue. I am not suggesting that any of these manufactures are blatently or even unintentionally shipping unsafe products. I am saying that many of the safety recalls are fixing problems with such miniscule probablility of causing harm, it is a wonder that they are done.

And, maybe a brand that HAS recalls is the brand that you want.

All of this post is theoretical (but based on real world experience) I am not suggesting that I have inside knowledge of any of the players involved.

MessickFarmEqu · Jan 14, 2005

( "

They should not place too much faith in comments made by anyone here, no matter how many posts they have. The number of posts made by any contributor tell you only one thing for certain: how many posts they have made. )

I said this about two weeks ago and it started a 60 post firestorm.

Bob_Young · Jan 14, 2005

Heh, good one MessickFarm.

"...how many posts they have made". And how much time they've got on their hands /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif.

5000 posts times 20min. per post (for checking the facts, typing, checking for typos and hitting submit) = 100,000 minutes = 1666.67 hours = almost a job. More than that if you count reading all the posts and raising issues.

Insomnia maybe?
Bob

cowboydoc · Jan 14, 2005

Neil,

Although we don't always agree I certainly respect your opinions. You put your name, your dealership, and all else right on the line. You don't hide behind a computer and make inflammatory comments. You make comments alot of people here don't agree with but you put your name and your business right there in black and white to back up what you say. Has anyone here ever called your boss and tryed to get you in trouble or called kubota to get you in trouble? I suspect that hasn't happened. Point is you're a man about it and put your name and your business where your mouth is. You back up what you have to say.

rtimgray · Jan 14, 2005

"I said this about two weeks ago and it started a 60 post firestorm. "

You are truly wise beyond your years, Neil. Good point.

slowzuki · Jan 14, 2005

"It might also be that as foreign corporations, they are not nearly as likely to be attacked with lawsuits. "

Not true unfortunately for engineers! Kubota maintains registered corperations in both Canada and the US. It is really hard to protect yourself from liability.

ByronBob · Jan 14, 2005

Doc,

The very nature of this question alone brings out the loyalty of some to the worst degree. Tempers flare, comments are misconstrued and here we are. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Some people are taught to not disclose public information over the internet for safety reasons. When my boy is old enough to understand that I'll say those very things to him.

Comments from everyone should be taken with a grain of salt. Neil said it nicely a few weeks back. Your a veteran on this board and I respect your opinion as well as everone else's to a certain degree. We still have to think for ourselves everyday.

Orbith is new, which in itself isn't a crime because we all were at one time. But lets give him a chance to contribute to other area's of the forum before we discard him as a phony. The transmission situation doesn't apply to me but I learned that the issue was happening just the same, so in that regard I learned something new in this thread.

I called Yamaha today on another issue. Can't reach a human, no e-mail support ect....I can see how big businesses sometimes overlook opinions from the few vs listening to the many. Such is life.

To all at TBN, keep the comments/opinions coming. Regards Bob

P.S I wonder if we scared off Halfmoon 2 /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

rockyridgefarm · Jan 14, 2005

Orbith is new, which in itself isn't a crime because we all were at one time. But lets give him a chance to contribute to other area's of the forum before we discard him as a phony. 

Its not being new that I have trouble with. In 9 posts a Deere dealer bashes Deere 6 times. That's strange.

If a new poster shows up and said that he was a Kubota and Kioti dealer, and all Kioti did was lie and rip off customers, would there be howling? No, because he is new, we should be nice. I don't think so.

rtimgray · Jan 14, 2005

Oh, if he had badmouthed Kioti it would have been all out WAR - you know how vicious those dern Kioti owners are. Since people only ever say good things about Kiotis, our skins are pretty thin, so we immediately attack an interloper like crazy.

"In 9 posts a Deere dealer bashes Deere 6 times. That's strange."

Seriously, if a basketball team opens a game and hits 6 out of 9 shots, do you expect them to hit about 67% for the entire game (you might hope for it if you're a fan of that team - but you wouldn't expect it). It takes a little while for everything to average out - just look at me - probably half my posts are agrumentative and half are constructive - and right now I'm on an argument streak.

There's also that old phrase - "You can't judge a book by it's cover." Maybe nine posts is just a cover.

rockyridgefarm · Jan 14, 2005

Sorry I said KIOTI and HOWL in the same sentance... I didn't mean it, honest!

I hope obrith is a good poster here. A dealers perspective should be an asset. A JD/kunota one is not all that commen. So let's hope.

Obrith I apologize if I have come across as attacking you. I am interested in the facts, I may get a little bullish trying to wrestle them out of fluff. I work in a car dealership, and get to see what seems like bonehead stuff all the time. Often when all the facts come out, the story is vastly different. Sometimes its worse. I am the information guy. My job is to dig in and get the real story.

We often hear thay are all breaking, all we see is the bad stuff, and then, dig into the facts and for every problem, we have dozens of successes. Maybe it is the same at your shop. Maybe its worse.

But I AM a very satisfied customer of Deere and JD Credit.

CajunRider · Jan 15, 2005

I am a regular member of a woodworker's forum. Over there the heated discussion is Unisaw vs. Grizzly. The argument is virtually identical: Made in USA, Performance/Price, etc.. The only difference I see is that in the end the woodworkers make up and go make sawdust, here we make up and go move dirt.

I am searching for my first tractor right now. I wonder whether I'd be green, orange, red, blue, or just start howling. Regardless of the outcome, out of the argument here I actually collect some pearls of wisdom. Thanks for the passionate discussion. It's not all bad ya know. What's bad is when people don't come and don't post.

rtimgray · Jan 15, 2005

Rocky - nice post. Like Fat Albert says, "You show alot of class." Way to rise above the fray.

CajunRider is also right. The only time we really lose out on anything is when people quit posting altogether.