HVAC SEER2?

[dieselscout80]

Our HVAC system a packaged heat pump from 2003 (4 ton) and is possibly SEER 12 has a coil leak and the coil is no longer made.

There’s a $2000 federal tax credit and the power company has a $400 rebate.

Our HVAC guy gave us two quotes. 1. Is another packaged heat pump that is SEER2 16, but doesn’t qualify for any of the tax credits or the rebate for $12.195.00. It has a two speed compressor and a variable speed blower.

2. Is a split system that’s SEER2 18 and qua for all credits and rebates for $17.695.00 which also includes replacing all our craw space duct work. It is an inverter drive compressor and a variable speed blower. The duct work is about $2500 or more, so the system is really $15195.

Being in South Carolina AC season is the big driver of our electrical bill. We average 1300 to 1400 kWh per month for most of the year, but June, July, August and September we add another 1200 to 1300 kWh to our usage.

Our electricity is about $0.13 per kWh.

This is a calculator and it seem to say it would take about 10 years to make up the cost what do you people think?

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With fixing the duct and replacing the system with the SEER2 18 seems to make sense. We’re sixty and will likely be here for at least ten years likely longer.

 

[ponytug]

I think that you have done your homework and that you will be happier with the more expensive option as it gets you variable speed compressor, which means quieter, as well as more efficient.

All the best,

Peter

 

[dieselscout80]

I think that you have done your homework and that you will be happier with the more expensive option as it gets you variable speed compressor, which means quieter, as well as more efficient.

All the best,

Peter

Petee, that’s what I think.

I won how much the ductwork upgrades will affect the efficiency?

The quietness of the split system is something we’d really like along with the benefit of consistently lower humidity.

Does anyone have their results of a similar switch in HVAC system.

 

[2manyrocks]

Quietness of a duct system has a lot to do with how well the ducts are sized and installed so there is little resistance to air flow. Gentle transitions ...not abrupt. A good sized return vent. Putting the air handler a few feet away from the living space.

In terms of the outdoor unit being loud, you can compare the db ratings of units. If your old unit still runs, I think there is a db app for your phone but I can't speak for its accuracy.

I installed a cheap mini split in 2020. It's so quiet that I have to go look at the fan in the outdoor unit to see if it's running. My electric bill went down considerably.

 

[dieselscout80]

Quietness of a duct system has a lot to do with how well the ducts are sized and installed so there is little resistance to air flow. Gentle transitions ...not abrupt. A good sized return vent. Putting the air handler a few feet away from the living space.

In terms of the outdoor unit being loud, you can compare the db ratings of units. If your old unit still runs, I think there is a db app for your phone but I can't speak for its accuracy.

I installed a cheap mini split in 2020. It's so quiet that I have to go look at the fan in the outdoor unit to see if it's running. My electric bill went down considerably.

Thanks

Our ductwork is not noisy just the un itself.

 

[ddbackhoe]

Thanks

Our ductwork is not noisy just the un itself.

Why do you want the ductwork changed out?

 

[Carl_NH]

I would opt for the inverter and new/better insulated ductwork - and also factor in or consider electric rate increases over time which is inevitable.

Here in NH they went from 22 to .34 a KWH last year due to fuel costs.

 

[LD1]

IS the $17,695 before or after rebates?

 

[dieselscout80]

Why do you want the ductwork changed out?

The seams aren’t sealed and the insulation is in really bad shape.

 

[2manyrocks]

If the ducts are metal and otherwise in good shape, why not tape the seams and install new insulation?

 

[techman]

The electric savings between 16 and 18 SEER is small, typically about $60/year. This varies based on electric cost and your heating and cooling degree days. The amount I gave is for our climate in NE PA. So depending on your age, how long you might keep the house and other issues it can take many years to recoup the price difference. Put the difference in the bank and you will make more money. As both systems have compressor control (2 vs variable) and variable speed blowers the lower cost unit makes sense.

paul

 

[dieselscout80]

IS the $17,695 before or after rebates?

I was assuming it was, but you know how that goes.

I verified that they are credited directly to me and applied to our electric bill, after I pay the $17695, so it drops the $$ down to $15195.

 

[ericm979]

If the ducts are metal and otherwise in good shape, why not tape the seams and install new insulation?

Would the new ducts be larger, or have more outlets? A lot of houses including mine have insufficient duct systems. We added a return and some ducts and it improved the comfort in the house. It probably improved the efficiency of the system too but since the A/C and heater and fan all got changed at once its hard to tell.

I wish I'd added an inverter A/C when we did that. It'd be more comfortable than the single speed compressor and two speed blower we had put in. We've stated in a couple places heated and cooled by mini splits and they're awesome. A central system that works on the same principals would be great.

 

[ponytug]

The seams aren’t sealed and the insulation is in really bad shape.

Getting the ducts properly sealed (not with duck/duct tape! It is illegal to use on ducts here because it degrades so quickly. Here you have to use mastic, or specialty foils.) and insulated will do a great deal toward getting the heat/cold where you need it when you need it.

If I could get ours done for that price, I would do it in a nanosecond!

All the best,

Peter

 

[ssgp2]

Definitely go with the split system with the inverter compressor and variable speed blower.
SEER ratings are calculated at full load for a given time. Your system wont run at full capacity probably 95+% of the time, provided that the system is sized correctly

 

[2manyrocks]

Getting the ducts properly sealed (not with duck/duct tape! It is illegal to use on ducts here because it degrades so quickly. Here you have to use mastic, or specialty foils.) and insulated will do a great deal toward getting the heat/cold where you need it when you need it.

If I could get ours done for that price, I would do it in a nanosecond!

All the best,

Peter

I forgot. Aluminum foil tape.

But why is the installer suggesting new ductwork?

 

[m1garand762]

As an industrial hvac tech I think they are taking you to the cleaners
Get a single speed 13 of 14 deer and be done with it. Seal the ducks yourself and call it a day

 

[varelaelectric]

Based on the provided data, the calculator suggests a payback period of around 10 years, indicating that the investment may be worthwhile in the long run, particularly given the expected energy savings and potential environmental benefits, especially for commercial electrical service. However, it's advisable to consult with HVAC professionals and consider all factors before making a final decision.

 

[ultrarunner]

What refrigerant are new units using?

I believe 410a is going away but I see lots of 410a installs.

Anyone have a preference between R32 or R454b?

 

[nyone]

$12k plus to just replace a unit? God damn..and they said NY is expensive.