Tractor Sizing How important is rear diff lock on CUT?

[TJP89]

Never said it would.

I use split brakes in place of a locker for those odd times. Like only one tire hung up (or in the air). And it works just as well as a locker. But I use brakes far more to keep the tractor in a straight line when rear blading on an angle. A locker wont do that.



I am betting it will be a stale mate. Two identical tractors, with even footing and traction (not one tire on ice other on pavement; rather similar between the two rears), and I doubt either one will move the other.

Done it several times with different equipment and vehicles. Most notably, I had a 85 dodge w350 power wagon. 33x12.50 mud tires and posi front AND rear. Chained to my brothers 89 F150 and street treads with open diffs. On a pretty hard packed gravel drive it was a stalemate.

Sure, I could pull alot harder than him. But not hard enough to overcome his dead weight back out of the two depressions he made when spinning tires.

It takes a pretty significant difference in equipment size or weight for it to not be a stalemate in my experience. Just because one may have more drawbar pulling power, doesnt mean its enough can overcome the other.

I think you guys are blowing this out of proportion. I am NOT saying that a locker isnt usefull. I am NOT saying that a locker doesnt increase pulling power. I am saying that in MY experience, the slight increase doesnt help me more times than it does. You guys are making it sound like hitting the locker and getting BOTH tires spinning suddenly increases traction by 2x's. But that just isnt the case in most circumstances. I think most of us here arent running big iron pulling 18' disc's. We are running small CUT's doing a variety of chores.

My opinion is the diff lock can give the tractor that little extra ummph to power through. If you're in way over your head, it isn't going to help.

 

[McREBEL]

No. The "bottom" line under discussion is which of the features offers the most versatile capability. That both is better is a no brainer, whereas distinguishing which is capable of getting you through more situations requires that you get into lots of situations - so many that you are able to keep your brake pedals unlocked and reliably operate them together or selectively. When you do that you find the split brakes will do anything a rear locker will do, and then some - except getting ALL the power on the ground. Some is used by the applied brake. ... If youre rolling , braking a lesser traction wheel to assure that both wheels are working to their traction limits will get you max thrust but will require more engine power than the locker setup. If you need all your engine power the brakes are going to slow you down and use more fuel while one brake or the other is on. Brakes also wear out -- intermittent use only.

If you need to use one of the features long term it has to be the locker. It also had better be a task with lots of straight lines and not much sideslope.
larry

Be careful, it sounds like you are saying the bottom line is both are better.

 

[TJP89]

Be careful, it sounds like you are saying the bottom line is both are better.

That is the bottom line

 

[McREBEL]

That is the bottom line

Yes and I believe the OP has already decided the same.

 

[SPYDERLK]

weve come a long way since the 1st page.

 

[k0ua]

weve come along way since the 1st page.

Yup. OP probably has bought another tractor, had it delivered, and already done his first 50 hour service by now!..:laughing:

 

[sd455dan]

I tell you what you non-lock knuckleheads....lets take two identical tractors....hook them each to an equal size disk and put them side by side in a long field with slippery conditions....one tractor uses the posi and one does not....I put all my money on the posi tractor winning that by a lot....if you can't see that then you have not spent much time on a real tractor doing any real world work

Agree
ESPECIALLY older NON 4x4 tractors, - the diff lock many times will keep the tractor moving when pulling a disc or other ground engaging implement...

In other words my 3000 Ford benefits greatly from the diff lock.
The 4x4 Rhino I almost never need the diff lock- but still glad it has it.

 

[ishiboo]

I disagree.

IMO, rear diff lock is completely unnecessary.

If you have tracks.

 

[ishiboo]

I disagree.

IMO, rear diff lock is completely unnecessary.

If you have tracks.

 

[jonnmero]

New to tractors. looking for something 25-30HP for plowing snow, working in the woods, moving dirt, etc. 8 acres on north side of a fairly steep ridge. Looking at a Yanmar 424 since dealer is only 5 miles away, but from everything I've read, there is no locker on the rear axle. Is this a deal breaker?

Thanks for your opinions.

John

Have only used the diff lock on my Foton 254H once, but that was enough to warrant it. Was stuck in gooey mud to over the front tires, and the 4WD wasn't enough. Saw the unpleasant possibility that I had to get out in the deep mud to get help, but remembered the diff lock. A bit of rocking, and I was able to get out. Rather chuffed not having to have the mud bath! So, the difference between diff lock or not comes down to the problems you face when you really need it. I wouldn't even consider a tractor without it.

After the dip in Big Muddy
Jonn

 

[greg_g]

Personally, I wouldn't buy a tractor without a dif lock!

SR

X2. I live on 30 acres of diagonal. Started with a Yanmar 240, only cuz I got it cheap. Found out why real quick, one wheel drive sux! Sold it, bought 4wd, never looked back. I even made sure the last riding mower I bought had diff lock.

//Greg//

 

[jeepfreak1972]

Personally, I wouldn't buy a tractor without a dif lock!

SR

I 100% agree. I could have been in trouble many times without it on every one of my tractors. No diff lock no buy for me.

 

[jonnmero]

I 100% agree. I could have been in trouble many times without it on every one of my tractors. No diff lock no buy for me.

Since they are available, the three best features, 4WD, Diff lock, and split brakes are a given.
Just like HST is an unnecessary complication, as the more there is to go wrong, the more will.

 

[k0ua]

HST is an unnecessary complication, as the more there is to go wrong, the more will.

I agree totally. Since I don't have a clutch on my HST equipped tractor, and all that linkage, pressure plates and throw out bearing, so should I say that your gear tractor has too many extra parts and might be a bit too complicated? And I believe there are less parts in a HST tractor than a gear tractor transmission also. I am just trying to understand this whole parts count line of reasoning.

You know once one looks into how these systems actually work, one becomes less fearful of this 60 year old technology. Not to mention how much they help increase efficiency for repetitive movement tasks.

 

[vtsnowedin]

Let me pop some popcorn and pull up a chair.

 

[k0ua]

Let me pop some popcorn and pull up a chair.

UM, buttered popcorn! I want some too!

 

[DGinVT]

I have and use the rear wheel locker on my three diesel tractor, especiall when going up hill with a load in my woodlot.

 

[jonnmero]

I agree totally. Since I don't have a clutch on my HST equipped tractor, and all that linkage, pressure plates and throw out bearing, so should I say that your gear tractor has too many extra parts and might be a bit too complicated? And I believe there are less parts in a HST tractor than a gear tractor transmission also. I am just trying to understand this whole parts count line of reasoning.

You know once one looks into how these systems actually work, one becomes less fearful of this 60 year old technology. Not to mention how much they help increase efficiency for repetitive movement tasks.

The technology with HST is fine, but how well does it work in extreme cold? And also how is the power loss in the system?
Looked into it when buying new tractor, but the price difference was considerable, - and the determining factor.

 

[k0ua]

The technology with HST is fine, but how well does it work in extreme cold? And also how is the power loss in the system?
Looked into it when buying new tractor, but the price difference was considerable, - and the determining factor.

Well, we don't have low temps here in SW Missouri as I am sure you do in Norway, so I can't say. It works well in the cold temps we do have here. Power loss is close to 15%. Worth it for the gain in efficiency of operation (quicker time to change directions, and better precision control) Price difference is usually between $500 and $1000 US between models.

I am not trying to sell anyone a HST system over a gear/clutch system. All the short comings of each system is worthy of debate. My only point was and is that HST systems are not more complicated, and not more prone to failure.

If anything gear/clutch systems are more complicated and more prone to failure. If number of post here on TBN are any indicator, there are more post's about clutch problems than there are about HST problems. And considering that the majority of TBN users are using CUTS and SCUTS not utility tractors, and the majority of newer CUTS and especially SCUTS are HST equipped, it would stand to reason that gear/clutch systems are unreliable!

Of course this is not true, as both are very reliable. Of course new users, having no experience in using a clutch and abusing it may, and likely does contribute to early clutch failure and account for a percentage of the posts we see here. I have never had any problems with any of the clutch/transmission systems of of the tractors I have owned. Nor have I ever had any problems with the 3 HST tractors I have owned.

My only point is that HST systems have been in service for many decades, are not complicated, are easy to understand, and are certainly not unreliable.

All the rest is debatable.

 

[Dr_Zinj]

I use mine all the time. Ice, mud, and slippery logs and boulders; can't get over them otherwise, even with split braking. And you really don't want to drop your FEL load, or unhook your 3PH equipment just to unstick yourself when a diff lock will do it in a jiffy.