How Do I Take This Tree Down Safely ?

[CurlyDave]

This picture was taken with the camera held true horizontal & vertical. Yes the trees really do lean that much.

The one I am concerned about is the evergreen which has broken about 30" above the ground. It is about 40' tall, and at about 25' it has hung up on the branch of a live oak. It is about 10" in diameter at the break.

I have good access from the point where the picture was taken.

I need to clean out the fallen logs, and then dig a trench which will pass directly under the broken tree.

The reason for the trench is that there is a drainage ditch, just barely visible at the right hand edge of the picture. Right now water flows down the ditch and then under my propane tank (just beyond the left edge of the picture), eroding the gravel base it sits on.

About 20-30' behind the broken tree is a gully. If I can dig a trench to divert the water into the gully, I can stop the erosion.

While I could probably fit the tractor under the tree, I don't want to take the chance of it falling on the tractor while I am digging.

I am not very proficient at tree felling with a chainsaw, and this looks dangerous to me. Any good ideas?

 

[RalphVa]

I've had several Virginia Pines break off like that. They're usually lying against another tree, keeping them from falling over. So, there'll be tension in the top part of the tree. You can't just chain saw through from the top (just above the breakover); the chain will get caught. Do a small cut, maybe a couple inches on the top part just above where the tree has broken over. Then undercut it from the bottom side. Be sure to watch where it seems to want to fall and stay out of the way. Keep doing this until you get it to a point where it'll fall over. Then remove the part standing from the ground or maybe leave it so you'll know where it is to not drive over the stump, if it's out of the way.

Ralph

 

[Tororider]

I think you can just cut from the high side at the spot of the break, it should continue to put more pressure on the live oak and fall. If you want to be safer and not have to worry about where it falls, if you can get the tractor in there, just push down on the broken part w/ front end loader. Even if it doesn't break free, it will make it easier to cut if it is horizontal to the ground.

Could you use the thumb to grab it and pull it down?

 

[Treemonkey1000]

That tree is tensioned like a archery bow. They have a tendency to snap quickly when you cut the back side of the arch. Depending on how hung up it is can put the tension on the inside. If you are comfortable with your reflexes and a sharp saw. We do what is called a "plunge cut" sometimes to help reduce the chance of it snapping and ripping your head off. Google Plunge cut is a way to see a better description. Basically lay the saw horizontal and auger or drill a flat slot on the back of the arch part way into the tree above any break. Then depending on the direction you want maybe do a small face cut towards where you want it to fall. After that CAREFULLY try a back cut below your plunge cut. Hard hat. Safety glasses are a very good idea. The tree leaning that much is going to want to snap quickly. Plus it may twist when it does go. So you have to be prepared to jump back. Another thought is it doesn't look all that big. If you can sling a rope up into it. Then go down to a anchor point below where you want to fall it. Then redirect the rope with a pulley or clevis to a spot you can pull it down with the tractor.

 

[mikim]

I'd wrap a chain around it above the break and pull it sidewise with the tractor (wife driving) then use an ax to finish the break ....if needed. Is that madrone in the foreground? I burned a lot of madrone when I lived in Central Point ... about 17 yrs ago ....burns clean and well.

 

[mwb]

I would undercut about 2 feet up from the break; the weight of the tree will resist it springing closed. When your cut starts to open up, stop and use the tractor to pull it sideways to break. The break appears to be sharp enough that you shouldn't have much spring. Once the but hits the ground, use the tractor (pulley if you have to) to drag the tree away from where it is hung up.

 

[Tororider]

I would see if you can get the tension off by using the thumb and trying to push/pull the tree down. How long has the tree been dead? If it is dry you may be able to snap it off with the thumb without having to worry about being close to it.

Those hang gliding injuries can be a pain, you are one tough dude.

 

[Treemonkey1000]

Is that madrone in the foreground?

That is Madrone in the foreground. It is common in this area.

We don't burn firewood. I burned wood as our primary source of heat for 20 years when in lived in CA. That is a younger man's game. We now have two propane fireplaces to satisfy the urge to look at flames.

There is a lot of downed wood on the property, but after a lot of consideration, I decided that the proper way to dispose it was not to drag it through the living room one piece at a time. Plus the ash means the house is always dusty.

- - - -

Treemonkey:

No I am not comfortable with my reflexes, and I am a very slow runner due to an old hang gliding injury. I am no where close to crippled, and I can walk miles with ease, but I am slow and not too good at leaping out the way of danger.

How about either grabbing the tree about 2' above the break with the thumb, and then cutting it between the thumb and the break? Or, I could even try to trap it between the dipperstick and the boom before cutting. Either way, I have 8000 lbs of tractor which could help prevent it from springing too far?

Is this feasible, or is it the dumbest thing you have heard of?

Hey I admire you for doing the hang gliding. Haven't done that yet. Recognizing limitations is a good quality as well. I am still working on that part. Although being 50 years old and raising a daughter solo. Wisdom is starting to set in and help me look at risk factors. The factor that aches and pains of the past are catching up with me.
Looking at flames from propane does sound a lot easier..I still get plenty of my wood free for obvious reasons.
As far as what you want to do Pine is not that dense so that tree shouldn't be all that heavy. If it were Madrona that could be more of an issue. Is the tree hung up pretty good in the other tree? Say if you cut it like you mentioned and it has so much leverage that it damages your thumb on the tractor by twisting or falling. Or it starts to slide one way or the other the tractor more than likely is heavy enough to manage it..In your shoes with that tractor I might consider doing what you want to do. Maybe as a trial move up to the tree and see if you can lift the tree with some upward pressure with the bucket? You might get a better feeling of how heavy the tree is that way.
By the way old injuries or not adrenaline and fear can make reflexes and speed a lot faster!

 

[Egon]

Dig out the root ball with the backhoe.

 

[Charlesaf3]

oh - reason for not cutting from the "back" is I'd be worried about Barber Chair. From the front your blade will get pinched. Side should be the least loaded.

Normally under tension I'd cut a few kerfs to release it, but not sure where tension/compression is in that situation.

 

[LD1]

It is tough to tell from the picture how close that tree in front is to the broken one. The one between where you took the pic and the break. And it is also hard to tell exactally which way it is leaning, weather it is leaning only to the left or to the left and away. But I agree with charlesaf3 and try to chain it just above the break and pull it off the stump. Pine is very weak and you have a lot of tractor. I don't think you will even need the chainsaw to get it on the ground. Chain it about 2 feet above the break and pull toward the direction where you took the pic.

 

[3RRL]

I like the advice to use a chain on the broken part and start pulling it towards where you took the photo from. If it was me, I'd put a cut at the break on the side we can see in that photo. Your tractor should pull it enough to dislodge it from the stump at the break. If the canopy is being supported by the Oak, it might not fall, just break off at the cut/break. Then re-chain and start pulling it towards the right side of that photo, if you can get the tractor in there. It should just fall down from there and you can limb and buck it there.

 

[gf5205]

It is tough to tell from the picture how close that tree in front is to the broken one. The one between where you took the pic and the break. And it is also hard to tell exactally which way it is leaning, weather it is leaning only to the left or to the left and away. But I agree with charlesaf3 and try to chain it just above the break and pull it off the stump. Pine is very weak and you have a lot of tractor. I don't think you will even need the chainsaw to get it on the ground. Chain it about 2 feet above the break and pull toward the direction where you took the pic.

I would only do this with chain longer than the tree is tall because if the top releases before the butt breaks you could pull it down on yourself.
Greg

 

[Charlesaf3]

if you are pulling well below the trees center of gravity thats unlikely. But I usually link two 20' chains together to do this - I occasionally hang trees up like that in the woods

But paying attention and doing things slowly is always a good idea

 

[CurlyDave]

There is a plan forming in my pointy head.

Behind the broken tree, just barely visible in the picture are several large trees, maybe 24-30" in diameter. Using a stepladder, I intend to chain the broken tree to one of the large trees as high up on the broken tree as I can reach, say 12' above ground, maybe 15' measuring along the trunk, from the break. This will anchor that part of the tree, preventing the tree from flipping back on me.

Then I will put a second chain around the tree, just above the break and pull it back toward the spot where the photo was taken, using the tractor. I will make certain the lower chain is longer than the tree.

The downside of this is that it may put enough down pressure on the live oak branch to break it off. If that happens, so be it. I have a lot of live oaks, and the fool things are always dropping branches.

 

[smfcpacfp]

I have this problem with the jack pines on my property all of the time, since my woods are so dense. I agree with the guys above who mention pulling it down with chains. Hook a chain to the top and pull it away, but have lots of chain or rope between you and the tree.

Unfortunately with dense woods, a lot of trees are destroyed when old one die and fall down.

 

[Charlesaf3]

Hey, at least you have a tractor - this is a pretty manageable problem with one. Without one, its a complete mess.

Just to repeat, be very respectful of embedded compression and tension forces. Amazing how much can be present in a situation like this. But hopefully you'll be lucky and you won't have any.

I think the top chaining approach is a good safe one. I wouldn't do it probably due to impatience, but its definitely safer. I do pull a lot of awkward trees down with top ropes, slings, and snatch blocks even though it takes a bit longer for that reason - its never a pain to have the tree fall right as you want it.