Hay making help

[JohnJohn]

It has been a while since I last posted and I had to set up a new account.

I have a Kubota L3010 HST now to maintain 10 acres.

I am thinking about buying 100 to 250 acres for cattle and hay.

From what I have read I will need 45 to 50HP to run a baler.

Will I need a cutter?
Will I need a rake?

A new 50 HP tractor will run me about $20,000, plus $4,000 for a loader. How much can I expect to pay for the baler , cutter, and rake?
Is there anything I am missing?

 

[carluman]

I don't have any idea of cost but I do know it would depend on if you are buying new or used. Also small or big bailer... round or square?

Sounds like fun. Best of luck for ya.

 

[cowboydoc]

To do a 100 - 250 acres of hay I would buy at least a 65 pto hp tractor and probably bigger. Yes you can get by with less. What you need to do first is decide what equipment you want to go with. Do you want to make 4x5, 4x6, 5x6 bales etc? Do you want to do sileage? Are you going to be doing alfalfa or grass? Do you want to do any square bales? How mechanically inlcined are you? Do you want a 10', 11', 12', mower conditioner or do you even want to use a mower conditioner. Would you rather go with a swather? Then are you in an area of alot of moisture? If so you'll probably need a tedder too. You're also going to need a bale trailer. How are you going to plant, fertilize, spray, etc? You can hire it all out but if you want to do it yourself you're going to have to buy all of that equipment as well.

Just for some #'s on prices my 5x5 round baler was $21,000, my 5x6 round baler was $28,000. My 735 mower conditioner was $22,000. My swather was $68,000. My side delivery hay rake was $2200, and my wheel rakes were $2800 a piece. My square baler was $11,000. I've got thousands more in hay stacker, bale carriers, flatbeds, sprayers, etc.

 

[BB_TX]

I don't know the first thing about haying, but I found <font color="blue"> this web site </font> to be interesting reading.

 

[JohnJohn]

Thanks for Lots of good information. I have just started the information gathering phase of my purchase.

I had no idea balers ran that much.

I will be buying the land in Virginia.

I have an uncle that makes hay and has cattle now in VA. I will be visiting him in a couple weeks to get more information.
He too has allot more equipment that I originally thought would be required.

The last thing I want to do is buy a under horse powered tractor for the work.

 

[cowboydoc]

That is an excellent article BB. The only thing I would fault are their prices on used equipment. The only equipment I have seen that low are junk on it's last lets.

 

[HayDR]

New Vermeer 5500 Rebel balers are in the $ 13,500 to $15,000 range.

 

[5030]

Richard:

I don't want to talk hay. I can hear it growing. My NH bailer is at the dealer getting some knotter work. 4 weeks worth. I think I am going to "borrow" a new one from the dealer if I don't have mine back in 2 weeks.

I was working on the Mo Co Saturday. I was replacing the hydraulic lines. I unbolted a stay on the swing arm and below it was a nest of yellow jackets. Sunday, my hand was the size of Joe Poluka's and it hurts all the way to my elbow.

What a way to start out. Hope I don't loose any fingers this year. I won't be able to pick my nose. /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

 

[Poppa]

Well Daryl and Richard, you have both at least filled in one gaping hole in my education. You have both answered why hay seems ridiculously expensive. Next time I will have a better understanding of what goes into a bale.

Yellowjacket tax alone should be six bits a bale /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

Mike

 

[Bird]

Yep, Mike, in our part of the country, if the equipment has been sitting unused for awhile, you look for yellow jacket nests, then you see how many dirt dauber nests have to be cleaned out. And if you have to stop and work on anything in the field, the first thing you do is check to make sure you aren't standing or lying in the fire ants. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[cowboydoc]

I've got a couple hundred acres ready to go Daryl. We just can't get a break in the weather to get any done. I'll get those pics of my setup on my post pounder taken and see what you think.

 

[sweettractors]

<font color="blue">How much can I expect to pay for the baler , cutter, and rake </font>

JohnJohn--Here in Ky you can pickup a used round baler or good used square baler for under $3500--New 8 ft disc mower $4495--New V-type 8 wheel hay rake with hydraulic caddy for around $2400--I Suppose you would need a couple New 20 ft flatbed wagons for hauling square bales at around $1200 each or if you go round bales. A New $130 rear bale spear will do just fine to yard up the roll hay bales--Hay tedder would be optional at under $1200 for a 2 rotor pull type (Tedders/Spreaders are a Good management tool, but not required in all circumstances)--Good 62 HP (2 wheel drive) used 5610 Ford tractor with New Loader and new rear tires, Under $13000--Dont get discouraged, lots of alternatives ways in making hay--Ken Sweet

Sweet Farm Equipment LLC *Over 1000 new and refurbished implements at 2 locations in Ky*

 

[slowzuki]

Yes there are different priced approaches. A lot has to do with how much time/help you have to work with when bringing in the hay.

Have you thought about how you will store the hay?

In Canadian $ here are some used prices for good to excellent equipment.

small square baler 500 - 3500$
round baler 2500 - 12000$
9 ft mo-co 2000 - 10000$
tedders/rakes 500 - 3000$
50-65 hp 2wd tractor 4000 - 18000$

Your current tractor would make a good compliment to a bigger 2wd. You could ted, rake, and move bales with the 3010, maybe skip the loader on the bigger tractor and use it for mowing and baling.

 

[cowboydoc]

I don't want to start an argument by any means but don't you think the equipment you mentioned would be undersized to undertake doing 100-250 acres of hay? An 8' mower conditioner would take days to mow even a 100 acres of hay. By the time you consider 2-4 days drying, 2-3 days baling that's asking alot of mother nature not to rain. Most guys I know that do that much hay figure their equipment for 1-2 days at the VERY most to get the hay down, and be able to bale in the same amount of time. What kind of round baler are you going to get in the $3500 range that is going to do that much ground and be fairly reliable? And also is that $4500 for a conditioner or just mower? Wouldn't you agree that with the weather you really would want a conditioner doing that much hay?

 

[slowzuki]

Cowboydoc, I certainly won't argue with you. I think it would help the discussion to know if this is being done to earn a living or as a hobby.

If I was to make a living at it, I would like good reliable equipment.

100 acres for me would mean staged cutting, ie in 33 acre portions. I know in other areas this can't be done for all kinds of reasons. The weather here is just not reliable enough to cut 100 acres and bet it all!

A family I'm friends with works something in the order of 1000 acres. They do round bale silage so 3 of them work 18 hr days for 6 weeks every summer. I'd bet there is a million bucks of equipment tied up in their operation though.

My opinion is 2 people with 30-50 000$ to spend should be able to effectively harvest 100 acres of hay, that is if a round or big square baler is bought. Small squares, well, good luck with 2 people! We're attempting say 3000 small squares this year with all 3 people who work full time elsewhere, fun fun!

Ken

 

[cowboydoc]

I agree completely with you Ken.

 

[Woodbeef]

Nope I cut 100 or so acres twice a year with a 7' mo/co. Never more than 10-15 acres a day either. That way you don't have too much hay on the ground if the weather turns. Square bale about 30% of it round bale the rest. Seems to work good year in year out for me. Neighbor's always have some rained on hay every year. I very rarely do!!

 

[Egon]

Slowsuki:

Anyone making a living with hay has reliable equipment or they be out of business

Nothin like the smell of new mown hay on a warm soft sultry evening. Perfume that can't be duplicated. Ohh to regress 40 plus years.

Egon /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[sweettractors]

Most area farmers never put down more that 25-35 acres per cutting (This is favorable with unpredicitable weather)--Our New 8 ft disc mowers have the capacity of 6 1/2 acre per hour and we dont need conditioning rollers unless we are harvesting Alfalfa. Mother nature will take care of curing in 2 good low humidity days here in Ky and no Tedder is needed unless a rain catches you. $3500 buys a good used Vermeer 605F Or Hesston 5800 Or nice used JD 336 square balers are common for well under $3500--We actually do put up 300 acres + of hay every year, using the type equipment described with the exception of a New M&W 5x5 Hay Roller plugged in at $12,500 that we purchased couple years ago--We do this in our spare time after 5 in the evening and before 8 am in the morning and Saturdays--After we get it in the windrow, we kick out a 1500 Lb round bale every 70 seconds including cycle time between rolls--Ken Sweet


Sweet Farm Equipment LLC *New 4 basket hay tedders with hydraulic fold for $3300*

 

[cowboydoc]

That's great if you're doing grass hay. Alfalfa is very tough to do that way though. Everyday it gets past cutting stage you are losing protein. I just read a report today on grass hay as well that said that every day grass hay is left after it has green headed out that you lose up to 75% of the nutrients in the grass. Are you guys doing hay analysis and seeing at what stages your cuts are producing the highest quality hay? I know Daryl, 5030, does this and he's putting out some very good hay.