Front Wheel Drive on JD650

[sporteus]

So, had to share this story and ask about next steps. I changed all the fluids on my auction bought JD650 (never trust another man's maintenance). Glad I did, it was a mess. The gear oil in the front end came out like liquid ****. Brown, think, almost chunky, it was gross. Then I pulled the dip stick (hadn't actually checked it before) and it was bone drive and ...rusty. Sigh.

Changed out the oil, made sure it was full, ran it for while over a couple of days, and then when I was changing out the coolant, I looked down and saw the left side wheel leaking. Checked the oil and the dipstick was dry. Well, it's a used tractor, I have to expect this stuff, right?

So, going to need to replace the seals on the front wheel drive I think. Really don't want it to be a huge project, just get it sealed up and git 'er done. Any advice on this? I have the tech manual, but of course that section starts assuming you've disassembled the whole front axle assembly already! Will I need to drop the whole axle off the tractor or can I remove the wheels, drop the wheel axle units (I don't know what the heck you call them) and replace the o-rings and seals. Might repack the bearings while I'm at it.

Thoughts?

 

[whis]

shouldn't have to remove axle, just the ends, bearings run in oil

 

[joecdeere]

shoot me your email and I'll send you a PDF of the Deere Tech manual for the 650

Joe

 

[sporteus]

joecdeere, thanks for the offer. I have the tech manual. (wish i bought it in print though, since the dang PDF is not searchable!! what a pain!)

 

[sporteus]

So, after letting the tractor sit for a week (because of moving back to standard time...sigh...I miss daylight.) I checked the front end and realized that both left and right sides are leaking and fairly significantly (noticeable puddles under both sides.

Might start the tear down this weekend, but would rather order the parts first so its not sitting on jack stands for a couple of weeks.

So, looking at the parts diagram(below), the leak is in the assembly between parts 13 and 22. So, should I just order all those parts in between (parts 15-20) or just the seal? I don't expect that I need to replace everything to fix the leak, but since they all seem to work together on that joint and aren't overly expensive (seal is most expensive part), do I just get them all and rebuild that joint?

 

[whis]

I would replace all seals and any bad bearings

 

[Oldtink]

Hate to rain on your parade but item 15 (ware sleeve) is no longer available from JD but you can check with SKF or Timkin for an after market sleeve that fits the dimensions. Last resort is having a machine shop turn one for you. The sleeve is .1" thick and rides inside the oil seal.
You'll want to attack that little job through #22 and there is an oring on it's face you might want to pick up.

 

[sporteus]

Hate to rain on your parade but item 15 (ware sleeve) is no longer available from JD but you can check with SKF or Timkin for an after market sleeve that fits the dimensions. Last resort is having a machine shop turn one for you. The sleeve is .1" thick and rides inside the oil seal.
You'll want to attack that little job through #22 and there is an oring on it's face you might want to pick up.

Got all the parts today, except for that ware sleeve. But, I think I've found a place for those! Weaver Tractors Weaver's Compact Tractor Parts & Compact Tractor Salvage Going to order them, since the seal will only be as good as the sleeve.

 

[sporteus]

Got all the parts today, except for that ware sleeve. But, I think I've found a place for those! Weaver Tractors Weaver's Compact Tractor Parts & Compact Tractor Salvage Going to order them, since the seal will only be as good as the sleeve.

And the parts will be here Friday and they're coming from ....Fredrick's! So I guess Weaver just locates the part for you or something. Must be a comparable Yanmar part is all I can figure. I'll have to measure the new parts against the older when I get them. I'll let you know if they have a Yanmar part number on them, if they're John Deere, or if they're a generic aftermarket.

 

[sporteus]

So, has anyone done a tear down/rebuild of the MFWD on a JD 650 (or 750)? Looking for any "gotchas" or "goddahaves" before starting the project.

Printed off the relevant tech manual pages this morning and going to take a look through them tonight. But, I find the tech manuals written in the 80's to be less that specific in a lot of cases and have already found a couple sets of instructions in the tech that were missing key steps. And the pictures SUCK. I'm a visual learner, so I count on the pictures when I get confused. (I do real well with instructions from Ikea! LOL!)

 

[prs]

Sorry, my 650 is only 34 years-old and no where near ready for such repairs. Knock on wood.

prs

 

[sporteus]

And the parts will be here Friday and they're coming from ....Fredrick's! So I guess Weaver just locates the part for you or something. Must be a comparable Yanmar part is all I can figure. I'll have to measure the new parts against the older when I get them. I'll let you know if they have a Yanmar part number on them, if they're John Deere, or if they're a generic aftermarket.

Got the parts today. No Yanmar or John Deere label on them, just a part number "AC-1364" and CHINA. No idea if that's a Yanmar part number, but guessing it's some aftermarket source since it's marked CHINA. I'll compare them up when I pull the MFWD this weekend hopefully.

 

[sporteus]

I was able to drop the housing on both sides and bring them inside to replace the seals the morning. Ran into my first gotcha, removing the spindle from the housing. Tech manual instructions below. Been mucking with it for over an hour and it's just no budging. Any advice? This is a stupid way to have to take this dang spindle out and I am worried about screwing up the drive gear (although it should be catching on the housing without screwing up a spline).

 

[Barry 1]

My YM186D has that same axle,but haven't worked on it yet. Is the gear holding it?or the inner bearing race #19 ?? If the inner race is stuck,it looks like it will come out if you remove the upper snap ring,and you can remove it later. Is the bearing bad? If it aint broke,don't fix it.

 

[sporteus]

Well, the trick is... soak it with PB Blaster and go take a nap! A clear head and a couple of good whacks and it came off. Now I'm tearing apart the spindle housing and the needle bearings came out in little pieces and the retainer was completely shredded. Glad I got all the parts! Can't get the needle bearing housing out now, so it's soaking in PB Blaster while I relax and have dinner and maybe an adult beverage. Hopefully the right side assembly will go easier after I've done this one (assuming I'm able to get the new parts in there without a hassle!)

 

[sporteus]

OK, I've got a problem. Trying to get the old needle bearing holder out and it ain't going nowhere, not no how!! Got a 2lb slide hammer this morning with puller attachments and most of the lip has tore up. Sigh. Reading threads about welding a bead on the inside and it will contract the sleeve and drop out, but the bearing holder is about an inch inside of a 2" hole, so I don't even know if someone could get a welder in there (completely outside my realm of knowledge). I've heated it once with no effect, might try that one more time. You can't get at it from the opposite side to punch it out and there is a retaining ring under it that I can't get at until the bearing sleeve is out of the way. (unless someone mades a pair of long nose retaining ring pliers with a "U" shaped head. still thinking on this one.)

Any advice?

 

[sporteus]

Was able to Dremel out the bearing sleeve, leaving only a slight mark to remind me of my troubles.