First Truck for a Tractorman
- Thread starter glennmac
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Well if it is any consolation Cowboydoc they are having fits with the new Allison. Basically it isn't doing well at all. You can get a good strong Ford E4OD or E101OD tranny built but it's gonna cost you $2800. They have aftermarket people into the racing tranny's building them up. Also with add on items such as a Banks Transcommander that take the slip out of the tranny under load that helps them immeasurably. I also run Amsoil synthetic and watch the tranny temperature. If you keep em below 250 you got it made. Like tractors, there's those of us who enjoy building towing machines and watching them work. Heck if ya smoke a tranny, big deal, build up a better one and slap her in. There are good E4OD's out there, but they are built up not stock as comes from the factory. Very important --- get a tranny temp gauge and watch it. If you are getting temps up then add a double stack cooler and change the fluid any time you really get it hot or twice a year if you tow lots. It's just another one of them horsepower challenges.
Mmmmm love that burnt diesel smell!
Dr Dan
Mmmmm love that burnt diesel smell!
Dr Dan
LarryT
Silver Member
I have to agree with Woodstock. I have TWO trucks. One is the work truck. An 88 GMC 4WD 1500 with over 230k mi. It used to be my good truck (bought it new). Now I have a new truck, a 2000 Silverado, shortbed, short cab "sissy" truck. I've towed a 7000 boat many hundreds of miles and other trailers hauling construction materials and autos thousands of miles with the old GMC. A great truck! It now has farm duty, still gets about 200 miles a month. The sissy truck is fun to drive, looks good, and is otherwise useless. I just hauled a Troybuilt rototiller from Sacramento to San Diego and you'd have thought I had load on the back. I'm presently shopping for a new Suburban to replace my 96 Tahoe with 95,000 miles. I've decided to go to a 2500 for all the reasons Richard and others mentioned above. I'll still have the two trucks though! Gotta look good and gotta work, can't do both with the same machine!
Larry...
Larry...
Bird
Rest in Peace
Glennmac, I believe Mt. Mitchell on the Blue Ridge Parkway in North Carolina (yep, part of the Smokies) at 6684' is the highest. And we did stay a few hundred feet down from the peak.
Bird
Bird
RobS
Super Member
I'm just getting a taste of the width now Dan. I replaced my regular mirrors with the big, wide, swing out towing mirrors. I know what you mean about drive throughs etc. Great for towing though and beat the heck out of the slip ons I used to use /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
cowboydoc
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Dan,
In the new Ford that I got it has an automatic. It was a great deal so didn't have a choice. I have always had manuals in the past. My wife wanted an automatic as she is small and has a hard time driving the stick. Mine has the redesigned 4R100 but it's still not able to keep up. It was really bad hunting gears and such and drove me crazy. I put in a superchip which helped some. Tryed the Banks transcommand and it didn't do anything much at all. Since it is under warranty the dealer put in the updated heavy duty torque converter, cooler, and inline filter. I also added another cooler and inline magnetic filter and gauge system. We'll see how it goes but if you are on ford diesel.com you know they are having a devil of a time keeping them in the diesels. We'll see how this goes but if it doesn't get better I'll be trading for a stick.
In the new Ford that I got it has an automatic. It was a great deal so didn't have a choice. I have always had manuals in the past. My wife wanted an automatic as she is small and has a hard time driving the stick. Mine has the redesigned 4R100 but it's still not able to keep up. It was really bad hunting gears and such and drove me crazy. I put in a superchip which helped some. Tryed the Banks transcommand and it didn't do anything much at all. Since it is under warranty the dealer put in the updated heavy duty torque converter, cooler, and inline filter. I also added another cooler and inline magnetic filter and gauge system. We'll see how it goes but if you are on ford diesel.com you know they are having a devil of a time keeping them in the diesels. We'll see how this goes but if it doesn't get better I'll be trading for a stick.
RobertN
Super Member
Example weight rating for Dodge
I thought the GVRW was it... but looked at my Dodge literature(just got a 2500HD). GVWR and trailer capacity are listed different. They also list a combined rating. So, to clarify from thier book:
GVWR= Total wieght of truck with cargo, passengers, ect
Max trailer= Total max wieght of trailer with cargo and fluids, 150 lbs for driver(ya right!), and must include cargo ect in truck
Max GCWR = Total weight of truck and trailer with cargo, people, fluids, ect
So, here's what I found, in the 2001 Dodge literature
Ram 1500 4x4 quad cab:
GVWR = 6400lbs
Max trailer = 7150
Max GCVWR = 12500
Ram 2500HD 4x4 Quad cab Diesel(my recently bought truck)
GVWR = 8800
Max trailer = 13,200
Max GCWR = 20,000
So, based on these numbers, I could reasonably tow my B8200 with equipment behind a 1/2 ton, and not have to worry about excedding, or even coming close to the limit. However, if you are shooting for something near the 8000lb range, a 3/4 ton IS the choice.
It is interesting to note, that in all models(1500/2500/3500), That the weight rating is higher on the 2wd regular cab(by 500-800lbs)
And yes, as someone mentioned, all the weight rating are confusing till you sit down and look closely at them.
RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif
I thought the GVRW was it... but looked at my Dodge literature(just got a 2500HD). GVWR and trailer capacity are listed different. They also list a combined rating. So, to clarify from thier book:
GVWR= Total wieght of truck with cargo, passengers, ect
Max trailer= Total max wieght of trailer with cargo and fluids, 150 lbs for driver(ya right!), and must include cargo ect in truck
Max GCWR = Total weight of truck and trailer with cargo, people, fluids, ect
So, here's what I found, in the 2001 Dodge literature
Ram 1500 4x4 quad cab:
GVWR = 6400lbs
Max trailer = 7150
Max GCVWR = 12500
Ram 2500HD 4x4 Quad cab Diesel(my recently bought truck)
GVWR = 8800
Max trailer = 13,200
Max GCWR = 20,000
So, based on these numbers, I could reasonably tow my B8200 with equipment behind a 1/2 ton, and not have to worry about excedding, or even coming close to the limit. However, if you are shooting for something near the 8000lb range, a 3/4 ton IS the choice.
It is interesting to note, that in all models(1500/2500/3500), That the weight rating is higher on the 2wd regular cab(by 500-800lbs)
And yes, as someone mentioned, all the weight rating are confusing till you sit down and look closely at them.
RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif
RobertN
Super Member
Richard,
Of interesting note, while working on my Class-B for driving fire engines, I re-learnt about what gears to use for hills. The big thing is when going downhill, don't use a gear that's higher than what would be required to climb that hill. So, if you have to go up the hill in second gear, go down in second gear too.
RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif
Of interesting note, while working on my Class-B for driving fire engines, I re-learnt about what gears to use for hills. The big thing is when going downhill, don't use a gear that's higher than what would be required to climb that hill. So, if you have to go up the hill in second gear, go down in second gear too.
RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif
cowboydoc
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Robert,
Yes that is true for the big rigs. But just so we don't confuse the motorhome and big rigs with pickups again let me say that with a pickup and trailer I can take most of the hills back in Idaho in 4th gear. With the chips, coolers, turbos, etc. these pickups are putting out way more hp and torque than when the book was written. On my brothers new truck the last time I was home in April we went to a rodeo up north and that thing pulled hills in overdrive that before you had to be in 2nd or 3rd on the 95. He had the exhaust done, superchip, etc. and dyno'd at 350 hp and 675 lbs. of torque. Now as far as going down the same hills in 4th gear that would not be a pretty situation.
Yes that is true for the big rigs. But just so we don't confuse the motorhome and big rigs with pickups again let me say that with a pickup and trailer I can take most of the hills back in Idaho in 4th gear. With the chips, coolers, turbos, etc. these pickups are putting out way more hp and torque than when the book was written. On my brothers new truck the last time I was home in April we went to a rodeo up north and that thing pulled hills in overdrive that before you had to be in 2nd or 3rd on the 95. He had the exhaust done, superchip, etc. and dyno'd at 350 hp and 675 lbs. of torque. Now as far as going down the same hills in 4th gear that would not be a pretty situation.
fishman
Veteran Member
Glennmac,
I know you said 2nd-hand vehicle, but have you looked at some of the rebate and other incentives available for new trucks? I looked at the used/new prices around my area (TX) and decided that the used trucks weren't worth what they were asking for them. With a new truck, like a new Kubota, you get a warranty and you decide how nice you want to treat it (oil changes every 3000 miles, waxing, etc.) Rebates included, I've seen some new single-cab half-ton 4x4 gas v-8 trucks going for 20-22 grand in the paper. Dodge seem to be the least expensive, followed by Ford, and then Chevy. Any would do well for you, but I bought a Chevy. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif Finance it for 4 years instead of 3 and the payments are lower than a used late-model truck, and you will know it's history.
That said, the last truck I had was 9 years old when I bought it, I kept it for 12 years, and then sold it for what I had in it. Just thought I'd present another option./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
Oh, and once you experience a pickup's versatility, you'll never be without one again. Just thought I'd warn you!
I know you said 2nd-hand vehicle, but have you looked at some of the rebate and other incentives available for new trucks? I looked at the used/new prices around my area (TX) and decided that the used trucks weren't worth what they were asking for them. With a new truck, like a new Kubota, you get a warranty and you decide how nice you want to treat it (oil changes every 3000 miles, waxing, etc.) Rebates included, I've seen some new single-cab half-ton 4x4 gas v-8 trucks going for 20-22 grand in the paper. Dodge seem to be the least expensive, followed by Ford, and then Chevy. Any would do well for you, but I bought a Chevy. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif Finance it for 4 years instead of 3 and the payments are lower than a used late-model truck, and you will know it's history.
That said, the last truck I had was 9 years old when I bought it, I kept it for 12 years, and then sold it for what I had in it. Just thought I'd present another option./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
Oh, and once you experience a pickup's versatility, you'll never be without one again. Just thought I'd warn you!
fishman
Veteran Member
Also, as to the automatic vs. manual debate, I have used both extensively while towing heavy items and much prefer the automatic. That said, I can definitely see the application for a manual transmission in mountainous terrain. IF I were buying a truck with a manual tranny (which I won't), I would also make sure that it had a "granny" gear, plus 4 "road" gears, instead of the so-called "wide-ratio" gearbox. The granny gear allows the driver to start a heavy load with minimal stress on the drivetrain, because it's such a low gear. I also would make sure that the rear-end was a 3.73 ratio or higher (if a gas motor, don't know about diesels). Be aware that a 4.10 rear end will likely get poor mileage while commuting. The 3.73 is a good compromise between the 3.5x and the 4.1x rear end.
DFB
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Re: Example weight rating for Dodge
Another interesting note for the 4x4 Dodge RAM 1500 class is the differences listed for maximum allowable trailer weights by transmission type in my owners manual. GVWR are all the same @ 6400lbs
Manual trans 5.2L gas eng. axle ratio (3.55) = 4800 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 9,500 lbs
Manual trans 5.2L gas eng. axle ratio (3.92 ) = 5300 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 10,000 lbs
Automatic 5.2L gas eng. axle ratio (all) = 7800 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 12,500 lbs
Automatic 5.9L gas eng. axle ratio (all) = 7700 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 12,500 lbs
Now get into the 2500 HD GVWR @ 8800 lbs
5.9L gas eng. all trans/all axles = 8800 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 14,000 lbs
BUT... add the V10
8.0L gas eng. all trans/all axles = 13,200 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 19,000 lbs /w3tcompact/icons/cool.gif
On my automatic transmission there is an O/D Off switch that will lock out the overdrive to prevent excessive shifting on hills. Shifting down into a lower gear (2nd and 1st) is also recommended for climbing and decending steep grades too./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
What's also important is the different recommended maintenance schedules depending on the operating conditions, such as towing and snowplowing.
DFB
Another interesting note for the 4x4 Dodge RAM 1500 class is the differences listed for maximum allowable trailer weights by transmission type in my owners manual. GVWR are all the same @ 6400lbs
Manual trans 5.2L gas eng. axle ratio (3.55) = 4800 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 9,500 lbs
Manual trans 5.2L gas eng. axle ratio (3.92 ) = 5300 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 10,000 lbs
Automatic 5.2L gas eng. axle ratio (all) = 7800 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 12,500 lbs
Automatic 5.9L gas eng. axle ratio (all) = 7700 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 12,500 lbs
Now get into the 2500 HD GVWR @ 8800 lbs
5.9L gas eng. all trans/all axles = 8800 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 14,000 lbs
BUT... add the V10
8.0L gas eng. all trans/all axles = 13,200 lbs max. trailer wgt. GCWR 19,000 lbs /w3tcompact/icons/cool.gif
On my automatic transmission there is an O/D Off switch that will lock out the overdrive to prevent excessive shifting on hills. Shifting down into a lower gear (2nd and 1st) is also recommended for climbing and decending steep grades too./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
What's also important is the different recommended maintenance schedules depending on the operating conditions, such as towing and snowplowing.
DFB
Bird
Rest in Peace
My youngest daughter just bought herself a new Dodge, extended cab, but 2WD, pretty well loaded out. She said window sticker was $25,000 and they came down to $20,500.
Bird
Bird
Cowboydoc,
Come on man don't give up! Make it a project (we all know ya got the bucks)! I am suprised about the Banks Transcommand. Are you sure it was installed right and all connections were making it? Mine works wonderful. If you are drinking a soda pop with a straw in it, you have to worry about corneal lacerations however. LOL Mine does NOT slip. It jumps from gear to gear with very little slop and tranny temps are in the 140 degree range. Did you see the company out in AZ that builds racing tranny's mentioned on ford-diesel.com? They were quite reasonable and do a heck of a job on them. Also are you running Amsoil in your tranny? That made a BIG difference. Have you actually fried a tranny yet or are ya just whinning? Also as Bird mentioned those US Gear OD's and UD's are pretty darn nice. Have you put an exhaust brake on your trucks? I haven't yet but it is just a matter of time (not doing that much towing in hills yet). Also B&D's torque converter is supposed to be great. Have ya got that PSD intercooled with Banks Downpipe? Man I got mine breathing and it actually scares me it zips up to 85 so fast.
By the way... I am buying an EZ Dumper hydraulic dump trailer which holds 5 yards. Ummmmm any idea what a yard of gravel weighs? It's gonna take a little over 3 tons and has hydraulic surge brakes on all four so I'll have a load to make the pyro and boost gauges kick a little. You gotta be nuts to get into diesel tractors and totally insane to get into diesel towing monstors! Fun but it keeps ya fairly broke all the time - just to see a little black smoke kick out the pipe. I am actually thinking of another diesel truck to put up on a trailer and take to the truck pulls. Is there any hope for me? LOL I love the sound of them Cummings when they hopped up a little. I spent a few days at Sheid Diesel in IN a couple weeks ago. I saw a guy come in and drop $4100 on a rebuilt injector pump and injectors and never even batted an eyelash (of course I dropped $3500 on intercooler and exhaust and a little tricking out). Thank god I ain't married - I'd be divorced in a month!
See ya guy
DocDan
Come on man don't give up! Make it a project (we all know ya got the bucks)! I am suprised about the Banks Transcommand. Are you sure it was installed right and all connections were making it? Mine works wonderful. If you are drinking a soda pop with a straw in it, you have to worry about corneal lacerations however. LOL Mine does NOT slip. It jumps from gear to gear with very little slop and tranny temps are in the 140 degree range. Did you see the company out in AZ that builds racing tranny's mentioned on ford-diesel.com? They were quite reasonable and do a heck of a job on them. Also are you running Amsoil in your tranny? That made a BIG difference. Have you actually fried a tranny yet or are ya just whinning? Also as Bird mentioned those US Gear OD's and UD's are pretty darn nice. Have you put an exhaust brake on your trucks? I haven't yet but it is just a matter of time (not doing that much towing in hills yet). Also B&D's torque converter is supposed to be great. Have ya got that PSD intercooled with Banks Downpipe? Man I got mine breathing and it actually scares me it zips up to 85 so fast.
By the way... I am buying an EZ Dumper hydraulic dump trailer which holds 5 yards. Ummmmm any idea what a yard of gravel weighs? It's gonna take a little over 3 tons and has hydraulic surge brakes on all four so I'll have a load to make the pyro and boost gauges kick a little. You gotta be nuts to get into diesel tractors and totally insane to get into diesel towing monstors! Fun but it keeps ya fairly broke all the time - just to see a little black smoke kick out the pipe. I am actually thinking of another diesel truck to put up on a trailer and take to the truck pulls. Is there any hope for me? LOL I love the sound of them Cummings when they hopped up a little. I spent a few days at Sheid Diesel in IN a couple weeks ago. I saw a guy come in and drop $4100 on a rebuilt injector pump and injectors and never even batted an eyelash (of course I dropped $3500 on intercooler and exhaust and a little tricking out). Thank god I ain't married - I'd be divorced in a month!
See ya guy
DocDan
Glenmack,
Don't, don't, don't.... Get addicted to this pulling stuff. It can wipe out the budget real quick. We been steering ya from reasonable to brute and you know ya want a truck ya don't have to even question whether or not it will pull the load. Ya wouldn't have a Kubota if ya didn't like the best. LOL
Dr Dan
Don't, don't, don't.... Get addicted to this pulling stuff. It can wipe out the budget real quick. We been steering ya from reasonable to brute and you know ya want a truck ya don't have to even question whether or not it will pull the load. Ya wouldn't have a Kubota if ya didn't like the best. LOL
Dr Dan
cowboydoc
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Dan,
Yep already fryed the first tranny in the first month that I had it. That's why the rebuild was beefed up so much with all the mods. Mine is a new one so it already has the intercooler and everything. I did put the 4" exhaust on to get the temps down a little. I'm not much into hopping them up like my brother is. I just want to be able to pull my trailer up the hills and get good fuel mileage. As far as the exhaust brake yes that is one of the first things that we always put on them. Makes the brakes and drivetrane last alot longer. The Transcommand was installed right and they even sent me another one to make sure the old one wasn't bad. Still didn't make alot of difference. It firmed them up some but that dang torque converter unlocks at too low of a speed and rpms. They said only way to fix that was with a switch. Mine's still under warranty so we'll see. Rather than spend the 4k to build up the transmission I'd rather just trade for a manual that can take it. I like shifting but my wife doesn't. We'll see though. I just got it back last week and have been so busy I haven't had a chance to pull with it. My daughter has some rodeos this weekend though so we'll put it to the test then. Depending on the gravel you are going to be 2500 - 3000 lbs. I think. Talk at you later.
Yep already fryed the first tranny in the first month that I had it. That's why the rebuild was beefed up so much with all the mods. Mine is a new one so it already has the intercooler and everything. I did put the 4" exhaust on to get the temps down a little. I'm not much into hopping them up like my brother is. I just want to be able to pull my trailer up the hills and get good fuel mileage. As far as the exhaust brake yes that is one of the first things that we always put on them. Makes the brakes and drivetrane last alot longer. The Transcommand was installed right and they even sent me another one to make sure the old one wasn't bad. Still didn't make alot of difference. It firmed them up some but that dang torque converter unlocks at too low of a speed and rpms. They said only way to fix that was with a switch. Mine's still under warranty so we'll see. Rather than spend the 4k to build up the transmission I'd rather just trade for a manual that can take it. I like shifting but my wife doesn't. We'll see though. I just got it back last week and have been so busy I haven't had a chance to pull with it. My daughter has some rodeos this weekend though so we'll put it to the test then. Depending on the gravel you are going to be 2500 - 3000 lbs. I think. Talk at you later.
Have you got a tranny temp gauge that is accurate (gotta be careful with gauges that are inaccurate)? If so what kind of temp's are you running when pulling? Man I can't understand a fried tranny in a month -- had to be a flaw in something. I think you can get a good combo with an auto but it may take a little investigation. I'm stuck - legs don't work so I have to use auto tran. LOL I used to love it when I had an old diesel LandRover. Had OD so I have 16 gears forward and 4 reverse. Blows people away when ya back across a parking lot in reverse and shift 4 times! Keep after it!
Dr Dan
Dr Dan
Well, while the rocket scientists are arguing in the stratosphere, I think I'd like to ask Wheeldog and Kerr about Toyota Tacomas, since they seem to have them or know about them.
Looked at one and drove it around the parking lot this morn. I liked it. Good size for the routine chores, commuting, and parking garaging. Would either of you worry much about using a V6 Tacoma to tow your tractors with fel and rear mower on an appropriate size trailer maybe 300 miles a year?
Kerr, maybe I should go further and just sell all my property and retire to a maintenance free condo in Naples, Florida.
Looked at one and drove it around the parking lot this morn. I liked it. Good size for the routine chores, commuting, and parking garaging. Would either of you worry much about using a V6 Tacoma to tow your tractors with fel and rear mower on an appropriate size trailer maybe 300 miles a year?
Kerr, maybe I should go further and just sell all my property and retire to a maintenance free condo in Naples, Florida.
cowboydoc
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Glenn,
In the newest Quarter Horse Journal there is a great article about "The Right Truck". Would be a good article for you to read. You can look them up at www.aqha.com.
In the newest Quarter Horse Journal there is a great article about "The Right Truck". Would be a good article for you to read. You can look them up at www.aqha.com.
